JP barrel break in?

[MickB]

I have a new JP-15 with the 16" lightweight supermatch barrel.

The manual that came with the rifle says to fire 20, then use JB bore compound. Then repeat two more times (fire 20 then use JB, fire 20 then use JB). Repeat again after 300 rds.

This is supposed to maximize accuracy potential.

On my Noveske barrels, the instructions say no such break in is necessary.

So, for you guys with JP barrels - do you follow the procedure in the JP manual, or just shoot the darn thing?

Mick

[Alaskapopo]

I have a new JP-15 with the 16" lightweight supermatch barrel.

The manual that came with the rifle says to fire 20, then use JB bore compound. Then repeat two more times (fire 20 then use JB, fire 20 then use JB). Repeat again after 300 rds.

This is supposed to maximize accuracy potential.

On my Noveske barrels, the instructions say no such break in is necessary.

So, for you guys with JP barrels - do you follow the procedure in the JP manual, or just shoot the darn thing?

Mick

Its voodoo and a waste of time and money. Just shoot it.

Pat

[MarkCO]

Agree with Pat!

[J.Schmitt]

He includes the bore compound with the rifle. Maybe a little vodoo, but 1/4 moa is not unheard of with his barrels. Everything about JP is about maximizing the rifle. I took the 15 minutes at the range and used the compound.

Jay

[ken hebert]

I have a new JP-15 with the 16" lightweight supermatch barrel.

So, for you guys with JP barrels - do you follow the procedure in the JP manual, or just shoot the darn thing?

Mick

what do you want to end up with? a bullet hose or a tight group puncher? why did you put out the coin for one of the beast barrels on the market?

[Jesse Tischauser]

It can't hurt to clean the barrel of debris when u break one in and it kind of makes sense to do so. How would you ever know if it helped or hurt though?

[Dan Sierpina]

It can't hurt to clean the barrel of debris when u break one in and it kind of makes sense to do so. How would you ever know if it helped or hurt though?

You never will know. A different barrel can be a completely different animal. I usually go and sight it in, then clean it when I get home. I shoot more than 20, but less than 50. Oh yeah, clean it before the first round goes down the tube.

[Smokin]

The thought of "breaking in" barrels through cleaning is often debated. Most people that are into long range shooting also have this debate. The thought is that some of the smaller burrs that are present in even "hand lapped" barrels will 'lay down" and get "trapped" after too many rounds pass through the barrel. Cleaning the barrel after a few rounds when the barrel is new is supposed to break these smaller steel "micro fibers" free. The thought is that leaving them there will lead to the potential of greater copper fouling down the road leading to decreased accuracy. In the tactical long range group, GA Precision also recommends this process with their rifles. They dont use a lapping compound as JP doesm but the principel seems to be the same. My thought is that Its a bit of a pain, but we all paid extra money for JP rifles or other precision rifles so that we can get the best accuracy out of a highly tuned system. Spending an extra hour on the first range day with a new rifle wont kill me.

[jobob]

If the barrel is chrome lined (JP stainless barrels aren't) I don't think breaking in would do anything. I don't know, but it may help on stainless and other non-cl barrels. There are very knowledgeable people (JP included) who really believe in the process. I used a break-in process which included JB bore cleaner on a DPMS LR 308. At first that rifle did not want to group well, and was also a jam-o-matic. But the groups have shrunk considerably, and it is now very much improved in the reliability department. A year ago I wanted to sell it, and now I'm thinking it might be a keeper.

From what I've read, stainless steel tends to tear in the manufacturing process leaving microscopic rough edges. Perhaps a break in process of some sort would help with stainless barrels. But it's difficult to prove one way or another. If someone were take, say, 20 identical barrels manufactured with the same reamer, and go through the break in process with 10 and just shoot the other 10, then do an accuracy comparison after 200 rounds or so, you might get some kind of indication. But I doubt that it would be conclusive unless there was a large difference between the two groups.

I know someone who swears that shooting 10 or 20 cast lead bullets with JB stuffed into the grease grooves does wonders to break in a barrel. I'm not advocating this process, just passing it on. Haven't tried it myself.

[Smokin]

If the purpose of coating bullets with the bore lapping compound is to create some semi abrasive rounds, I believe David Tubb sells Throat maintenance bullets that thy

Claim removes some imperfections in barrels that are showing degraded accuracy due to wear. I'm not sure about the application of those rounds in a new barrel. Seems like a few patches, some compound and some bore shine are easier.

[warpspeed]

If I spent that kind of coin on a barrel, I'd follow the mfgs instructions to the letter. I'd want the max accuracy I could get.

Otherwise, buy a DPMS barrel and go shoot. It is more than adequate for 3 gun and about half the price.

[MarkCO]

Its a bit of a pain, but we all paid extra money for JP rifles or other precision rifles so that we can get the best accuracy out of a highly tuned system. Spending an extra hour on the first range day with a new rifle wont kill me.

But, it might take several hundred (or more) rounds off the useful life of that barrel. If you buy a quality barrel, in most cases you will do more damage than good. If you are in the habit of buying cheap, poorly finished barrels, then the process of the break-in with some barrel lapping compound of some sort will help. The materials and processes, yes even the QC, has improved leaving the old method of break-in a thing of the past for quality barrels.

You could read what Shilen says: http://www.shilen.com/faq.html#question10

Here is a little summary of a guy who had similar questions: http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/Barrel_BreakIn_II.asp

Here is the Kreiger opinion: http://www.kriegerbarrels.com/Break_In__Cleaning-c1246-wp2558.htm

In essence, it comes down to the throat. If you have a good smooth throat, don't screw with it. If it is rough, then you can benefit from it. I'd rather buy barrels from companies that produce barrels that are quality from the get go. A JP barrel is such a barrel.

[MarkCO]

If I spent that kind of coin on a barrel, I'd follow the mfgs instructions to the letter. I'd want the max accuracy I could get.

Otherwise, buy a DPMS barrel and go shoot. It is more than adequate for 3 gun and about half the price.

But your logic is 180 degrees opposed to the science of the matter.

[Pezco]

I have followed the instructions on my 2 JP rifles and they still shoot tiny groups years later. Is time the issue, really... after you spent that much on a JP?

[warpspeed]

If I spent that kind of coin on a barrel, I'd follow the mfgs instructions to the letter. I'd want the max accuracy I could get.

Otherwise, buy a DPMS barrel and go shoot. It is more than adequate for 3 gun and about half the price.

But your logic is 180 degrees opposed to the science of the matter.

I don't understand. Please explain.

[AlamoShooter]

Now I am going to have to work -Voodoo- in to my Tag line some place.

I wash my hands before I cook, I wash the packaged salad before I eat it.

Why would I not clean a new barrel before I shoot it ?

I will do a Pagan Ceremony when I get my new long range barrel, including shoot and clean during the sight-in. I will dance in a circle with my Drum , if I thought it would help. even though it would ware my shoes out some

I may have to do a Video skit complete with burring sage and target pasters

Edited August 22, 2011 by AlamoShooter

[MarkCO]

If I spent that kind of coin on a barrel, I'd follow the mfgs instructions to the letter. I'd want the max accuracy I could get.

Otherwise, buy a DPMS barrel and go shoot. It is more than adequate for 3 gun and about half the price.

But your logic is 180 degrees opposed to the science of the matter.

I don't understand. Please explain.

Quality barrels that have a good finish do not require any "break-in". All you end up doing is an accelerated wear procedure.

Mass produced barrels that have less than good finish will benefit from a break-in procedure that smooths out the machine marks in the throat. So with break-in, you CAN improve the accuracy of a DPMS barrel while it is pretty near impossible to improve the accuracy of a JP barrel.

I've been through several barrels and have microscopically examined the bores on a bunch. I had a Rem 700 in .30-06 bought in 1976 that had a very smooth finish throat. Shot about 1 MOA. Bought another in 1988 that shot about 6 MOA. Inspected the throat and chamber, it looked like it had been finished with a Makita drill. Did the Tubbs system and dropped it into the 2 MOA range.

There is a significant difference between "cleaning" and "breaking in", especially when abrasives are utilized.

I have two 20" Kreigers, one "broken in" and one not. The "broken in" one is cleaned to bare metal every 100 rounds. The other has Gunslick every 500 rounds followed by 2 dry patches. 1,000 rounds in, they are equal in the accuracy department. I think I know what the end result will be, but it will be a few years getting there. Keeping track of the cleaning costs and time too!

[ArturoJ]

Gale McMillan thoughts on break-in here

[kurtm]

Jamie...no one said don't clean it before the first shooting session.....everyone should, however the rest remains in contention. I agree with MarkCo on all of this and a few others. I break them in by shooting them.

BTW I have a J.P. 1X9 from 1999 and I did all the break in vodoo that is requiered, and this particular barrel HATES to be cleaned! It is a true 1/2 M.O.A. barrel ONLY after it has 50-75 rounds down the barrel. If you clean it, it opens up to 1.5-2 M.O.A. and only settles back down when fouled. It gets it's chamber cleaned occationally, but I hardly ever clean the bore anymore and it is still well withinm 1/2-3/4 M.O.A. and I couldn't tell you when it was last cleaned. KurtM

[warpspeed]

Thanks Mark.

I guess what I meant was no one expects great things from a plain CrMo barrel. 1 - 2 MOA and all is good. So when you get one and it shoots 1.5 or so out of the box, there is nothing more to be accomplished. It is as advertised. But when you are expecting sub MOA from a barrel, you would not want to do anything to change that and, for most people here, they will not have 2 barrels in their life let alone a dozen. Those who have done this 6 or 8 times have learned what works and what doesn't. The rest of use come here to glean that info and avoid the mistakes ( and cost ) of those who know.

Again, thanks for the knowledge. I had never thought about it like that.

[bpipe95]

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but aren't JP barrels made from Wilson blanks?

DPMS, RRA,WOA, and several others all use Wilson blanks...

[MarkCO]

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but aren't JP barrels made from Wilson blanks?

DPMS, RRA,WOA, and several others all use Wilson blanks...

Is not my place to confirm nor deny. There are some "parts" that we all use that are branded one way or the other when in fact they are all manufactured by the same vendor on the same line. That does not mean that the specs (finish, dimensions, etc.) are the same across the various "brands."

For instance, there are about 20 brands of water heaters sold across the US, but only 4 plants where they are manufactured. Each brand has distinct difference in features, specs, QC, etc.

One guys "perfection" is another guys "blem". Blanks still must be finished by someone.

[pjb45]

There was this guy from Accuracy Speaks in AZ who wrote about breaking in a barrel and cleaning it after every session. Derek seems to know what he is talking about. Wil Schuemann also talks about using JB paste on his barrels. McMillian is also fun to read.

My sense is if YOU feel you need to do it, then do it. Otherwise don't. The opinions of the experts are opposing, so do what you feel is best for you.

I did not break in my Sabre Defense barrel and it shoots 1/2 MOA.

[A6Gator]

John Paul seems pretty intense about his rifles. I mean, who else gives reloading data to maximize accuracy. Most other manufacturers will void a warranty for reloads. If JP says there's a break-in procedure, there's probably a reason for it. He includes the bore treatment when he ships a rifle (or upper). While some may not need it, I would imagine, looking at an average, his rifles are probably more accurate with the proscribed break-in procedure. For what a JP barrel costs, if it takes 30 mins, why not?

[boomfab]

A lot of the information on shoot/clean/shoot/clean break-in MAY have some merit in certain circumstances as much of it was pioneered in the benchrest crowd. Those guys chase every last bit of accuracy possible down to levels that borderline on the insane. The sum of a hundred small things adds up to a superbly accurate rifle. They also spend incredible amounts of time on case prep and bullet sorting by weight and length from base to ogive, etc, etc. They also clean their barrels at very short intervals, after 20-40 rounds many times.

For 3gun purposes, I think it's pretty pointless spending tons of time (and throat life by over cleaning) going after that negligible increase in accuracy. 3gun is VERY hard on barrels. For instance, a ~20 second long 50 round rifle stage....benchrest guys would faint at the thought. Or what about those four 30rd mags you just dumped in hoser training on paper? Or that long range stage that has a bank of 300-500 yard tagets that you got locked in on and went through a couple mags trying to hit? These activities destroy the throat in your barrel at a high rate which is one of the most critical aspects in overall accuracy.

For 3gun, I'd say get a quality stainless barrel that has its bore lapped to a mirror shine, develop an accurate load (100 yard, 10 shot group, ~3/4") and spend the balance of your time practicing and not cleaning.