ima45dv8 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I've had folks say "Not Ready" a time or two; I've used it on occasion.... I've had to. A peeve of mine is standing there with my hand on the grip of my gun, taking a last mental picture, and have an RO ask, "Are you ready?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooterj Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I've had folks say "Not Ready" a time or two; I've used it on occasion.... I've had to. A peeve of mine is standing there with my hand on the grip of my gun, taking a last mental picture, and have an RO ask, "Are you ready?" +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldchar Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I've had folks say "Not Ready" a time or two; I've used it on occasion.... I've had to. A peeve of mine is standing there with my hand on the grip of my gun, taking a last mental picture, and have an RO ask, "Are you ready?" +1 Wish I could say I had never done that, sometimes there is so much going on I am just moves thru the mechanics at that time . Sorry about that. Jim G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Campbell Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I've had to. A peeve of mine is standing there with my hand on the grip of my gun, taking a last mental picture, and have an RO ask, "Are you ready?" Sorry , the RO was not sensitive to your needs, But yuo where probably 99 of 120 shooters he had to run that day and he really wanted to say " Please get your S*** together and lets get this done ". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singlestack Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I've had to. A peeve of mine is standing there with my hand on the grip of my gun, taking a last mental picture, and have an RO ask, "Are you ready?" Sorry , the RO was not sensitive to your needs, But yuo where probably 99 of 120 shooters he had to run that day and he really wanted to say " Please get your S*** together and lets get this done ". Huh? It is not up to the RO to tell me to get my shit together or be sensitive to my needs. He is not supposed to give the Standby command until I assume the start position. If my hand is on the grip of my gun I am not in the start position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I've had to.A peeve of mine is standing there with my hand on the grip of my gun, taking a last mental picture, and have an RO ask, "Are you ready?" Sorry , the RO was not sensitive to your needs, But yuo where probably 99 of 120 shooters he had to run that day and he really wanted to say " Please get your S*** together and lets get this done ". "Not sensitive to my needs"? Really? As an RO I'm pretty sure one of the duties is to run the stage according to the USPSA rulebook. Buried deep inside is a little detail of not proceeding to "Are You Ready" until the competitor has assumed the designated start position. A stage cannot require or allow a competitor to touch or hold the handgun after Standby and before the Start Signal (8.2.3). If the RO is actually paying attention and not just going through the motions in a surly manner because it's a long day, they shouldn't ask me if I'm ready if I haven't assumed the start position. Just a small detail, I know. But one I try to adhere to, and I've RO'd a couple of shooters. Seriously, I don't spend a long time getting ready. And on those occasions when I do take a last-minute mental picture, it's pretty quick. If the RO is just "going through the motions" and tries to hurry me along, that ain't my failing. It's theirs. Asking me if I'm ready when I clearly am not indicates that individual might not ought to be holding a timer and accepting responsibility for ensuring safety for that stage. Their lack of attention has just been demonstrated. If they missed my hand on my gun, did they also forget to check if I had eye- and ear-protection affixed? And...it's not the RO's place to tell me to hurry up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanky Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Well said, Mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpha-charlie Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 (edited) If it's a newer shooter or someone who just looks like they're on the edge of lost, I sometimes ask, "Do have any questions about the course of fire?" Once that is resolved, I give "Make Ready." Until MR is given, the CoF has not begun and asking if they have any questions is not prohibited. +1 When I first started I was so nervous and no matter how much I tried to take it all in, I still didn't understand everything. A few times I did have to ask a question or clarify something when the R/O did indeed ask if I understood everything. I'm thinking they asked due to my 'deer in the headlights' look when stepping up to a 32 round course with swingers, steel, mandatory reloads, etc... This was always at a Level I match and made me feel really comfortable and part of the group so to speak, instead of feeling like "the stupid new guy who doesn't know anything." Made me keep coming back each month. If you've been doing this for any amount of time, my first communication will be, "Make ready!" Now when I step up to shoot I'm so focused on running the stage through my head that I wouldn't even notice if I was asked a question. I hear "Make ready" and it's like a switch going off in my head. (Not an "Over the Top" reference btw ) Edited February 23, 2011 by alpha-charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Campbell Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Guys , it was meant to be funny. If shooters can have their pet peeves so can RO's. I agree with everything that has been said, Do It By to the Book. The original Question , was about "Do you understantd the Course of Fire' . When I started at a local indoor range , with a lot of new shooters every week, I was taught by the "old hands". That was what you said, It was not until I took the RO course that I was TOLD , that was not a range command. As to the "Are You Ready" command, I've stood there waiting for the shooter to assume the start position, which he has not, Standing hands at sides and the start is Hands above Shoulders. At a local match I will eventually say surrender,at a big match I'll wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooterj Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Guys , it was meant to be funny. If shooters can have their pet peeves so can RO's. I agree with everything that has been said, Do It By to the Book. The original Question , was about "Do you understantd the Course of Fire' . When I started at a local indoor range , with a lot of new shooters every week, I was taught by the "old hands". That was what you said, It was not until I took the RO course that I was TOLD , that was not a range command. As to the "Are You Ready" command, I've stood there waiting for the shooter to assume the start position, which he has not, Standing hands at sides and the start is Hands above Shoulders. At a local match I will eventually say surrender,at a big match I'll wait. You had us all fooled cause you didn't use the sarcasm icon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Guys , it was meant to be funny. I had a feeling you might be taking a piss at me! If shooters can have their pet peeves so can RO's. I agree with everything that has been said, Do It By to the Book. The original Question , was about "Do you understantd the Course of Fire' . When I started at a local indoor range , with a lot of new shooters every week, I was taught by the "old hands". That was what you said, It was not until I took the RO course that I was TOLD , that was not a range command. As to the "Are You Ready" command, I've stood there waiting for the shooter to assume the start position, which he has not, Standing hands at sides and the start is Hands above Shoulders. At a local match I will eventually say surrender,at a big match I'll wait. Yeah, when they forget the hand position and it becomes obvious they have (we've probably all seen/done it enough to know it by sight), I'll say something like, "Wrists above shoulders". I can't start them until they get all lined out anyway, so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A63111 Posted February 23, 2011 Author Share Posted February 23, 2011 Thanks for all the replies. They have enlightened me as to the origins at least. I asked this for 2 reasons: A standing waiting for Make Ready and being asked if I understand the course of fire. I agree with the other posts that there has been more than sufficient time to ask any questions before now.It is also distracting to me. B while ROing last weekend a gentleman asked me if I intended to ask if he understood the course of fire. When I replied no, that's not a range command he got a bit unsociable. Later while trying to explain my side he said he had a question at the time and thought he was shooting at a friendlier club (it wasn't even my home club). Myself and a shooting friend did 90% of the RO work that day for the squad we shot on. Once again thanks for all the replies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All-Gator Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Got to the thread a little late, but want to add my two-cents. Typically, I begin by asking the clipboard holder, "Who's my shooter?" (Even if I damn well know the shooter.) Then I ask the shooter, "(use his name) do you understand the COF?" This sequence is more for my administrative purposes to assure that we have the appropriate score sheet and the appropriate shooter. I guess I could just ask, "Is that you?," but, asking if he "understands the COF" seems a little more friendly and does allow me to assist the shooter if needed. Most times the shooter will nod and I begin the official sequence of commands. Sometimes a question is asked...usually to confirm starting position. Importantly, on occasion, we find it isn't the correct shooter. I can't think of anytime that a shooter has shown...either verbally or with body language...that this sequence has disturbed him. After reading some of the posts, an inquiring mind wonders. A-G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I look at it this way... I'm bad enough without having an RO do a dramatization of what they think the commands should be. When I get to the line, I'm paying attention to my stage plan and if you deviate from the mandated commands, which I'm not paying attention to, I WILL pay attention to you, then I'm screwed. The RO should not have ANYTHING to say other than the commands... at least at a Major. At a local if there's a new shooter that needs some assistance, fine. But know the commands and use them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I firmly believe that using the proper range commands avoids more problems than it causes, on the 99.xx% of normal stages..... I also firmly believe that if as a competitor you get annoyed at some variation in range commands, and it influences your performance on the stage, then as your competitor I have an advantage -- because I've worked hard to anticipate virtually anything..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outerlimits Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 They stopped asking thay cause when Troy reads a WSB, there are no questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbbean Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 B while ROing last weekend a gentleman asked me if I intended to ask if he understood the course of fire. When I replied no, that's not a range command he got a bit unsociable. Later while trying to explain my side he said he had a question at the time and thought he was shooting at a friendlier club (it wasn't even my home club). Part of making ready is asking any questions you might have.Has nothing to do with being friendly or unfriendly. If you don't understand the course of fire you aren't ready. In my experience, most shooters have no problem asking questions, between "make ready" and "are you ready". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcs Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 When I am ROing and I have someone who has never shot USPSA before (Local match only), I will ask them if they understand the COF. The next time they show up, I use nothing but the "by the book" commands. Just to be clear, I use "by the book" commands after asking them if they understand the COF. I do it more for safety reasons then how to shoot the COF. At a local match I feel a new shooter should get all the help he/she needs to keep things safe. I also want them to come back and have a good time. Once a shooter is experienced, then everything should be by-the-book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 When I am ROing and I have someone who has never shot USPSA before (Local match only), I will ask them if they understand the COF. The next time they show up, I use nothing but the "by the book" commands. Just to be clear, I use "by the book" commands after asking them if they understand the COF. I do it more for safety reasons then how to shoot the COF. At a local match I feel a new shooter should get all the help he/she needs to keep things safe. I also want them to come back and have a good time. Once a shooter is experienced, then everything should be by-the-book. IMHO, I beleive you should ALWAYS RO only by the book. It helps ALL levels of competitors. The squad mates should be helping a new shooter, and as a CRO on a stage, you should ask a seasoned competitor to hlep them and focus on ROing. The "understanding" of the course of fire should have occurred much before the competitor stesp up to the start position. The scorekeeper should make sure the correct shooter and scoresheet are matched up, not the RO running the clock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooterj Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 B while ROing last weekend a gentleman asked me if I intended to ask if he understood the course of fire. When I replied no, that's not a range command he got a bit unsociable. Later while trying to explain my side he said he had a question at the time and thought he was shooting at a friendlier club (it wasn't even my home club). Part of making ready is asking any questions you might have.Has nothing to do with being friendly or unfriendly. If you don't understand the course of fire you aren't ready. In my experience, most shooters have no problem asking questions, between "make ready" and "are you ready". In a nutshell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Amish 1 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Shoot both games and it gets even worse. LAMR vs Make Ready I see clear vs. if clear Do you understand... vs. nothing yep, and "won't you look at that gamer!" vs. "THAT'S AN FTDR!!!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All-Gator Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Wonderful word of the day: Should. Arrghh...now I'm feeling defensive. The scorer "should" have the correct shooter and correct score sheet matched up and ready to go. The shooter "should" know the stage. But I also know that what "should" happen is often different from what "does" happen. I also know the unit does well what the commander checks. I guess I prefer to err on the side of a smooth-running, glitch-free stage. But from this thread, it is obvious that some do object to any deviation and find it distracting. So, once again, it seems no good deed goes unpunished. Whatever. A-G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbbean Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I guess I prefer to err on the side of a smooth-running, glitch-free stage. We all do. That's why we prefer to stick to the official procedure instead of each club and each RO creating their own personalized local routine. A shooter has to assume some responsibility. We expect a shooter to be safe, to bring a working gun, and to understand the rules. It doesn't seem to be expecting too much more to expect them to either know the course of fire by the time they get to the line or ask the RO whatever questions they have as part of making ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singlestack Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I guess I prefer to err on the side of a smooth-running, glitch-free stage. We all do. That's why we prefer to stick to the official procedure instead of each club and each RO creating their own personalized local routine. A shooter has to assume some responsibility. We expect a shooter to be safe, to bring a working gun, and to understand the rules. It doesn't seem to be expecting too much more to expect them to either know the course of fire by the time they get to the line or ask the RO whatever questions they have as part of making ready. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A63111 Posted February 23, 2011 Author Share Posted February 23, 2011 We all do. That's why we prefer to stick to the official procedure instead of each club and each RO creating their own personalized local routine.A shooter has to assume some responsibility. We expect a shooter to be safe, to bring a working gun, and to understand the rules. It doesn't seem to be expecting too much more to expect them to either know the course of fire by the time they get to the line or ask the RO whatever questions they have as part of making ready. I agree with your thinking. There is an opportunity between make ready and are you ready for any questions one may have. My renewal exam asked for the proper range commands in the proper order. I try to use them with each shooter. If questions are asked I resolve them before continuing with the COF. I haven't seen Troy or Gary chime in yet with their opinions though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now