Langenator

If I can make it, it looks like I'll be digging shotgun shells out of my pockets...

Hmmm...my 870 doesn't have anything that looks fork-like...I'm going to assume that means I don't need this modification?

Isn't most match ammo for .308/7.62 somewhere around 168 or 175 grains? And personally, for soft targets beyond 800m, I'm switching to the main gun and firing bursts of HE. "Gunner - HE - troops - 1000!"

Might want to check the rules before you do that - I'm reasonably certain that at least some rule sets frown on that practice.

Actually, replacing the washing machine ate the income tax refund. I'm waiting for piles of 930 JMs to suddenly become available while I have no $$.

If it hasn't already been pointed out, the heavier bullets can sometimes be a help if you need to flip a spinner.

As for ammo, maybe talk to Atlanta Arms about becoming their first stocking dealer west of the Mississippi.

Gah...I had just about $2k saved up, ready to order myself a new AR-10 type rifle to play He-Man/Heavy Metal with. Then my truck got jealous of me spending money on other toys and blew a head gasket. Bowed the header just a bit, too, just to make sure it ate the whole new toy fund and then some. I hate it when that happens.

Other than a little extra safety check on any metal targets due to the slightly higher velocity of rounds coming out of the PCC, I don't see why you couldn't. I've got a 9mm AR that would be great fun to shoot in something like that.

Well, SOCOM is it's own little world. They've even got all the FN mags that came with the Mk. 16s (SCAR-L), which aren't the standard issue, either.

PMAGS are an issue item. They have been in the supply system for years. PMAGs are NOT an issue item. They have an National Stock Number (NSN), which means they can be purchased with unit supply budget funds through standard channels. IIRC from my company command time, magazines are a Class II item (expendables). Standard issue mags are purchased as replacements for worn out ones the same way, except they come from a central .gov supply because the .gov buys them by the tens, maybe hundreds, of thousands. Now, I can look at this a couple of ways, both of which relate to money. First is from a Big Army budgetary point of view. PMAGs are more expensive than standard mags. Not sure how much, but say it's $5 per mag just for illustration. If an infantry battalion going to Afghanistan buys 10 PMAGs for every one of their riflemen (say 500 for easy math) that's an extra $25,000 (500 x 10 x $5). I'm not sure how many infantry battalions we have in country any more, but as of Jun 2010, there were an even dozen infantry/cav battalions/squadrons just in RC-East. That doesn't count engineers, MPs, artillery being used as infantry, etc. Or replacements for magazines that get worn out, damaged, lost, etc. But you're probably talking over $1 million every year, over and above the cost of standard mags (I realize that's a rounding error in the F-35 budget, but the Army's looking at huge budget cuts, and the F-35 isn't.) Now look at it from the POV of the contractor that makes standard mags: if that infantry battalion buys 5000 PMAGs, they're not buying 5000 of your mags. If you've got 20-30 battalions going to Afghanistan every year, that's 100k-150k mags that are left sitting in Uncle Sam's GSA warehouse. So when Big Army looks at how many they need to buy for next year, they buy 100k less of your mags, and you make that much less money.

OK, the actual SOUM has been posted by Weapon Evolution here. And by my read, it's not just the polymer mags, it's any mags that are not official issue. (Just because something has an NSN, which PMAGs do, doesn't make it official issue.) Steel mags like the HK ones are also not authorized. Message below.

I would really like to see the actual SOUM to see what it says. The way the story reads, only GI issue aluminum mags are authorized. The story concentrates on PMAGs, but if only standard issue mags are allowed, that would exclude steel mags like the HKs and CProducts ones as well. And Army TACOM has no jurisdiction over the Marines, so the SOUM doesn't effect them. The Marines can still use PMAGs, HKs, Lancers, whatever. Just like the Marines can wear Vibram 5-Fingers for PT, and the Army can't.

I ordered some 55gr ammo from Freedom Munitions on Monday...we'll see how long it takes to arrive. $149+shipping/500.

For those of use who don't reload...anyone have any comparison between various factory 69s vs 75/77s? I'm looking hard at the Prvi Partizan 69 and 75 grain match loads, if I can ever actually find some available.

There's also the 1x/4x Pitbull...seethis thread. Pat Kelley really seems to like his. I'm thinking real hard between that or the ELCAN 1x/4x.

I prefer experienced, or perhaps thoroughly ripened. My 870 has a wood stock and a synthetic forearm. But only because the wood front was so thoroughly worn that the checkering was gone. Got slippery with sweaty hands. We actually have kid (read: college sophomore) who shoots a gorgeous wood stocked Browning at local matches. He's been shooting sporting clays since he was like, 12 or something, and he's wicked quick with it.

No wood furniture? Kids these days...

Back to the weapon firing out of battery...I've shot a grand total of 3 3gun matches, never been an RO. But I have run more than a few ranges in my 16 years wearing the green suit, and if a weapon fires without the trigger being pulled, that's de facto evidence that there is something mechanically wrong with the weapon. IOTW, the shooter might not be unsafe, but the weapon sure is. And if I'm in charge, that weapon isn't coming back on my range until it's been inspected by an armorer and certified as being in proper mechanical order. As an RO/MD, I might not DQ that shooter, but I sure hope he's got a back up weapon.

Or a genius...... NO! He is evil.... The question is...did anyone finish the stage, under par time, hitting all targets, with the correct round type?

Actually, I started LaRue at stage 2 and DQ'ed on stage 11, so I never saw stage 1. I'm not designing stages at this point, I was just curious. Trying to understand how much is stage designer preference, how much is safety concern, etc. Art vs science. I saw lots of DQs on stage 1 so many that I was scared even. What happened on stage 11. On stage 1 it was slugs on close steel after shooters lost track of their ammo count. Pat I shot WWII Division, so I was doing mag changes while moving between the pistol bays. Left the safety off, and with my brain concentrating on changing a mag whilst moving backwards and sideways, also left my booger hook on the bang switch...and, when I slammed the mag in (full mag with slide already forward, wanted to make sure it locked in) my trigger finger tightened enough to send one over the berm. Loosing track of ammo count gave me fits on stage 10 with the buck and bird. I missed a couple of the buck targets, then got myself all bef**kled. Ended up standing there pumping buck out of the gun. Luckily the two types were different colors, so when I saw a green shell go in I knew I was OK. At least I got to shoot 9 full stages before that.

Actually, I started LaRue at stage 2 and DQ'ed on stage 11, so I never saw stage 1. I'm not designing stages at this point, I was just curious. Trying to understand how much is stage designer preference, how much is safety concern, etc. Art vs science.

At LaRue they were using some sort of clipper (I think it was some sort of farrier's tool for trimming horses hooves) to check the HXP Greek .30-06. Magnets stuck, but no steel core. Just some steel as a component of the jacket alloy. I haven't read anything about us WWII shooters tearing up the steel targets.

I know Augie lost at least one target to the faulty tree in the match that sent him home.

First off, I'll admit I've only ever shot one big match (LaRue 2012), so I may be way off, given the small sample size. But here's my newby question: Is it pretty much standard, for stages in which the pistol and the rifle and/or shotgun are used, that the pistol must always be fired first, before moving on to the rifle/shotgun? I ask because at LaRue, that seemed to always be the case, and there was at least one stage (stage 6) where, given the choice, I would have used both long guns before the pistol (rifle and shotgun targets were actually closer than the plate rack for the pistol.) If it is the case that the pistol always goes first, what's the reasoning? Is it a concession to the open division? (Since the ability of open-type holsters to retain the pistol during vigorous movement seems iffy to me.) At the local match I shoot at, slings are generally required on the rifles, and the sequence seems to usually go shotgun first, then pistol or rifle. The MD's distaste for staging weapons may have something to do with this, as well as the physical layout - on one stage we shot, the rifle would have been staged a good 30-40 yards from the start point.