kellyn

I'd say if someone kicked your rifle into the mud: 1) you need to find a new place to shoot and 2) you must have figured out the right way to shoot a stage and no one else did. If there were no limits on rounds or some specified shooting order in the COF, you did nothing wrong. Did the stage description have any such limitations or prohibitions? Did you get a procedural or just a rifle-kicking? Even if you did do something wrong, a procedural is the remedy not equipment abuse or insults. There is no general prohibition on shooting 2,3,4,5,6,7.... rounds on a target, especially a paper one. There is certainly no prohibition on experimentation! I'd say that the people you've been shooting with are hidebound, lame, unimaginative, and jealous.

Travis, COME BACK!

Normally he shoots CDP in IDPA. I think part of it is that Springfield mostly makes .45s but I think the biggest reason is that he just likes an opportunity to shoot a .45. He usually shoots full power military ball ammo. In AZ, he has always shot CDP (which is why I'm going to ESP for the next State Championship!) next time I see him, I'll ask. He was thinking about shooting a 10 but last we talked it seemed that idea has gone by the wayside. I don't think an extra reload costs Rob 2-3 seconds :-) More like 1!

Nope, it is a Buchanan Bagworks armband. (www.3gungear.com) Mark Buchanan has all the cool shit for 3 gunning: mag pouches to arm bands to shooting bags. His arm band does not have any metal to rust.

Mags should easily drop free. If they don't, get new ones. The redi-mag is the ultimate AR speed load set-up - but make sure you catch the spare ma as it falls. The first match I shot w/ one, I promptly dropped the spare mag in the dirt. Otherwise use a good mag pouch (Buchanan bagworks or Safariland) or better yet have both. I have a different technique than DblTap. I don't pull down on magazines although it's probably a good idea. I prefer to rely on feeling the mag seat. I can feel the "click." A lot of people hold on to the front of the mag well but I can't stand it. With my weak arm all scrunched up I can't swing the rifle well. Whatever you prefer. When shooting standing, I always hold the farthest part of the handguard. Try both and experiment with your own ideas.

I agree with Eric. You probably need a skinny front post - marketed as "National Match." The stock front sights are too wide for me. Mine is an Accuracy Speaks (as is most of my stuff!) As for rear sights, I also agree with Eric. I have a DPMS detachable rear sight which I was zeroing today (talk about happenstance). It lacks enough elevation adjustment in light of recent 3 gun matches where shots have been 400 to 550 yards. I prefer to make sight adjustments for far targets rather than hold over. I contacted Bushmaster and Armalite. Their detachable carrying handle A2 sights have a full range of adjustment (out to 600) and I will be getting a Bushmaster as it has 1/2 MOA adjustments (allegedly) whereas the Armalite is 1.5 MOA. 1/2 MOA is perfect for me. 1.5 MOA is too coarse (that a 4.5 inch adjustment at 300). 1/4 MOA is too small even for highpower. You have to crank on the sight to get any real adjustment for wind etc. I used to use a Smith Ent. USMC combat same plane rear apeture. It was the ulitmate! The apetures were smaller than factory and allowed for more precise sight alignment. But then I loaned it to Rob Leatham and he lost it! (Must be an attempt to oppress me!) I looked at Smith's catalog and they don't seem to offer that sight anymore but I will call them this week to make sure. Currently, I have a Bob Jones rear sight which also has smaller apertures but the large aperture is about 3 MOA lower than the small one. The large apeture is designed to take a small lens which screws in and allows the shooter to adjust his focus to the front sight. I took that out and use it as a large aperture.

Isn't the GSSF like the Special Olympics of the shooting world?

I'm a big believer in both custom ARs and slowly building them as you go along to defray costs. 3 gunning requires an AR that consistently shoot 1 MOA to 1 1/2 MOA. Most factory ARs have no problems achieving this as the AR is inherently accurate. But it is SWEET to shoot 1/2 MOA groups out of an AR. SWEET! My Accuracy Speaks open gun does just that. I take it to Police Sniper competitions and let it trash on Robars, Steyrs, etc. The best thing about a custom AR is that it is like Burger King, you can have it your own way. If you want a DPMS extended rail receiver and a Medesha handguard with a 18 inch bull 1 in 7.7 twist barrel with a Clark comp, then you can have one! One thing that I have noticed about all of the good 3 gunners is that none of their ARs are alike. Everybody has them setup differently. Chris is absolutely correct about buying parts here and there. Get a comp here, a receiver there, a trigger system one month and gas manifold another. Then take the whole puzzle to the gunsmith and have him put it together the way you want it. Pretty soon you have an AR and it feels like it was free! Factory guns can be and are competitive in Limited (after a trigger job) but a custom is nice. Be sure that your gunsmith is experienced w/ ARs and don't let him build you a highpower cross the course gun - unless that is what you want.

You can compete with a pump but nobody seems to. I've broken 2 seconds on the Dozier drill w/ a pump (5 pepper poppers at approx 10 yards, low ready start). Pumps will almost always be slower and I don't think they are any more reliable. For every semi failure, I've seen someone short-stroke a pump. Of course, the more goofy the positions, the harder it is for a pump to compete. It is much slower to pump a shotgun while shooting in the hunched over, half-prone, half-kneeling, twisted to the right position. These kind of positions are common in 3 Gun. I do think, however, that a pump could have been competitive at this year's SOF and WC 3 Gun but not at Myst. Mountain or 3 Gun Nationals - both of which had some goofy positions. Rob Leatham once told me that he thought Limited class should require pump shotguns. Interesting idea but I'm kind of neutral/lukewarm to it. Go shoot your Nova!

The only big 3 gun left this year is in November in Alabama. In 2002, the Mystery Mountain 3 gun is in Mesa in March and the 3 gun Nationals are in Vegas in May. If a holosight is good enough for Mike Voight, then it's probably good enough for you too! :-) The most popular holosight reticle on rifles is the 1 MOA dot surrounded by the circle. A 1 MOA dot is small enough to allow for some accurate long range shooting as it does not completely obscure the targets.

I don't really know. The one I have been shooting has the dustcover screwed into the receiver w/ several screws. Welding would work as well. There is some slack on most dustcovers and that is not helping accuracy at all!

Les, I have not heard that fix before. Accuracy Speaks also has a modification to reduce gas flow to make 16s more reliable. However, the problem is w/ the design itself. The AR was designed to have a 20. 16s can work (mine does) but I don't think that they handle any faster than a 20. I used to shoot a 15 lb AR w/ 20inch barrel and won plenty of short range stages with it. The only reason, I don't shoot it now is the fact that comps are now legal in limited. Avalanche, Mounting the scope on the right and the dot on top of the receiver is backwards. Most dot shooting is done close up and offhand, most scope shooting is done from position (kneeling, prone, off a rest). If you mount the scope to the right, you will never obtain a good solid firing position as you will have to awkwardly turn the rifle to the left. You won't be able to use a bipod and you will have to lift your right arm up which will destroy the prone, sitting, and squatting postions. However, shooting the dot mounted on the right poses no problems. When shooting offhand/standing, you simply turn the rifle by raising your right elbow and the dot is now lined up with your eye. I know Chris likes the EGW mount but I don't. The line of sight and the line of bore are WAY off. To shoot close range targets, you have to hold very high. You can't effectively zero a dot mounted that high. The zero is only good for one distance. Remember that most of the big dogs rely on low-powered variables as their SOLE sight. If I remember right, at the last 3 Gun Nationals and Myst Mtn, Miculek, Clark, Piatt, and Bednorz all relied on a scope alone. Jake Kempton and I were the only ones to have dual optics and I only used my dot for about 4 shots. Save some money and buy ammo. (Edited by kellyn at 6:53 am on Oct. 6, 2001)

Avalanche, Sorry, I can't remember much about Voight's AR. I do remember that he often shoots a holosight and that he has a full length barrel. For SOF he shoots an ACOG w/ the fiber optic powered reticle (bac) and not the crossharis. Eric, Don't get a CMore, the adjustments are too coarse for rifle work. CMores are good pistol sights but I don't like them on a rifle. ACOGs are good but WAY overpriced. They are SOF legal though. If I got one, I would get the 3.5X ACOG w/ the BAC (red circle reticle) and not the one w/ all the crosshairs. I would take a good low-powered variable over an ACOG any day. Leupold has better glass than ACOG and you could have 2 Leupolds for the price of one ACOG. A variable gives you the speed of little magnification (1.5X) and the benefit of higher magnification (5 or 6X). I disagree with your statement about speed of target acquistion. True enough, a dot maybe faster at 10 yards but it is not faster on a 10 inch plate at 300 yards.

Not a bad idea!

Well I've shot a DSA .308 w/ a 16 in barrel in 2 big matches: SOF and WC3gun. I like the rifle and was able to win short range stages w/ it at both matches. It is the long range shooting where it starts to fall short of the AR. The rear sight on an FN is much more coarse that that of the AR. There are no positive click adjustments, you simply slide the sight up and down a rail that was calibrated at one time for some shooter, somewhere, with some load. The rifle really needs a good trigger kit and a reliable 1/2 MOA click-adjusting rear sight that is adjustable for windage and elevation. Now shooting one w/ a ACOG might be a whole different story.....

I agree w/ icer. Stick to Colt, Armalite or Bushmaster. I would add DPMS, JP and perhaps ASA to that list. ASA has had some quality problems that I think they have been resolved. They and JP are the only mfg. to build ARs for 3-gun from the ground up. I shoot Colt lowers and have uppers built on colt, dpms, and bushmaster receivers - never had a problem with any of them. I would note that ASA, JP, DPMS and Armalite actively support 3 gunning and Colt and Bushmaster don't. I would get a 20 inch barrel or a custom 18in barrel. I can't recall a top 3 gunner shooting a 16 inch barrel. The full length gas system is more reliable as it does not overpressure the gas tube and bolt. 16 in guns are more prone to extraction problems due to too much gas. I prefer the balance of a 20 in and feel no handicap when shooting close range targets. As far as scopes go - Leupold is king of the hill in term of quality and customer service. They stand by their excellent product. A Leupold 1.5-5X is IMHO the ultimate 3 gun scope. Burris is good too. Bushnell's low-powered variables are also popular plus they're cheap. I don't care for mounting a dot on top of a normal scope. The difference between line of sight and line of trajectory is too great. You have all sorts of elevation problems. I would mount the dot on the handguard at about 2 o'clock. It is much closer to the bore. Another option is the Grahams ring which holds the dot and is mounted on the scope tube. It is very adjustable but I don't like the idea of mounting optics on other optics. I've seen some custom mounts which attach to the top of the weaver rail on the receiver and hold the dot directly to the right of the scope. Pretty cool. My aimpoint is attached to a weaver rail which is attached to my handguard at 2o'clock. As far as dots go, I like aimpoints w/ a 5 MOA dot as a close range sight but not as a main sight. Most top 3 gunners seem to be going to low powered variables as their only sight. Mike Voight often shoots w/ a holosight alone. He told me that he could shoot 300 targets as fast w/ the holosight as w/ a scope. I believe that he can but I can't. I would not rely on a dot as my only sight as I get much more feedback w/ just a little magnification.

That is a smoking Dozier! My best EVER was 1.89 w/ an 1187 and a 1.99 w/ an 870.

This is my ultimate bragging rights story. In 2000, I shot the Mystery Mountain 3 gun in tactical class with an iron-sighted rifle. So far so good... There was one stage where you started out in a helicopter and shot 8 shots from a bungee mounted DSA FN .308. You then proceeded to run to your own rifle (an AR) and engage a bunch of paper targets down a wash (5 to 50ish yds) and then engage several paper and steel flashers through a port. The ranges to these were 100 to 250ish. In 3 Gun, I tend to rely on my rifle scores so I really looked this stage over, walking through again and again. I visualized where all the targets were, again and again. Finally, I said I was ready to shoot. I started blazing w/ the DSA and on the last shot, the rear sight popped the lens out of my Zeiss shooting glasses. Now, I am very near-sighted. I had to decide whether to find the lens, to shoot w/o it or to shoot left handed. I choose to shoot righthanded w/ no lens and shot out of pure fear. I grabbed my AR and could pretty much see the front sight and a bunch of blurry desert. I almost fell down running w/ one eye corrected and the other not. I could not even see the steel and only vaguely make out the 200 yard paper. I just put the front sight where I remembered the targets to be and slapped the trigger several times. When done, I was sure I would be last on the stage w/ a bunch of misses. I won the stage w/ a smoking time and shot it clean!

There are competitions for snipers/designated marksmen/whatevers. The Steel Safari put on by Dave Wheeler at the Blue Steel Ranch in New Mexico is a blast. There is also Dave Lauck's match in Wyoming - which has quite a following. USPSA is having a bolt-action championship side match in the 2002 3-gun Nationals. Check out The Accurate Rifle or Precision Shooter magazines. A lot of matches are advertised there. I agree w/ Pat about Remingotn PSS rifles. They tend to be very accurate and are a good value. Plus it is better to wear out a factory barrel learning how to shoot than burning up a Hart! I got to shoot a Tubb rifle in .308. AWESOME! The rifle does away with so many of the problems associated w/ bolt-action rifles and stock fitting. I would not want a .308 in unknown distance long-range shooting though. Get a 6.5!

Just back from the WC 3 gun championship. I looked at a lot of limited shotgun setups. Ghost-rings seem to be on the wane. A lot of of good shooters are relying on a front sight alone. Fiber optic front sights are definitely very popular. Todd Salmon's Benelli has a .70 fiber optic front sight milled into the rib and a flip-up 10/22 mounted on the barrel. He shoots the fiber only when shooting shot and flips the 10/22 sight up when using slugs. Pretty cool. I liked it so much that I might setup my Benelli the same way.

Get a 6.5 X 284, the darling of the long range crew. Less recoil and better ballistics than a .308 or even a .300 Win/Norma Mag. If your budget is more limited, get a 6.5X06 for cheaper cases. You can certainly build a sweet long range rifle for under $4,000. Remington 700s are the most popular action for a long range gun but you may want to look into some benchrest actions. I've always been very partial to pre-64 Model 70s, which are the basis of many across the course highpower rifles. Any custom barrel will do but Kreiger seems to be the latest fave. McMillan stocks kick ass - others are good but McMillan is the standard by which all other are judged. I have 4 McMillan stocked rifles and my dad has 3 more, they are all great stocks. Beware of the label "tactical" or "sniper" to any rifle. IMHO that is merely a marketing gimmick to jack the price up. Find yourself a good highpower gunsmith and have him build you a better gun for less money. I would call Derrick at Accuracy Speaks and have him build you a rifle to your specs.

The SOF swingers made my MGM (??) in Idaho mentioned by Les are a great target. Easy to score and no need to go downrange except to occasionally paint. They are expensive though. Steel lollipops on fiberglass rods are also good.

You can shoot skeet w/ a ghost ring with little (but definite) handicap. My skeet scores drop about 5-10% when I shoot my limited shotgun w/ a Williams aperture and fiber optic front. Tough to have a limited shotgun to do both skeet and 3 gun well. The Williams sight allows you to slide the aperture off but you would constantly be rezeroing. You can shoot 3 gun w/ just a bead but slug targets may be more difficult. If you wanted to shoot open, put a dot on the shotgun. My skeet scores are unaffected or even slightly improved when I shoot w/ a dot (but don't tell Brian!)

Pat, All good shooters have (or should have!) goatees.

I have a goatee and whenever I shoot a collapsible stock I lose some facial hair. Plus they don't offer the stock weld that a standard stock does. If you are worried about length just get an A1 length stock. I prefer full length (20 inch) barrels or 18 inch barrels b/c you can use a full length gas system which is more reliable than the shortened gas system used on a 16 inch barrel. I like DPMS products and they support 3 gunning (unlike Colt and Bushmaster!)