ClutchUSMC Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Gentlemen, I never said that they shouldn't build a rifle. Nor did I make any statements about capitalism. I simply said: "But I do not think for one second that the current management/ownership of Armalite cares at all about 3gun or 3gunners so I won't recommend their products to people who are looking for a 3gun rifle." You guys are smarter than me if you can figure out a persons ideas about society and politics from a few paragraphs about guns. Maybe when I'm telling people about matches that were put on 30 years ago and how awesome the quad load was once I'll be as smart as you guys. And for what its worth I have had my sponsors tell me they notice a sales difference when they have sponsored less matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClutchUSMC Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 And please some one give me one solid reason to recommend the Armalite over a similar model by Stag, DPMS, Colt, or Double Star? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigLucky Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I for one am curious to see the direction Armalite will take with their new ownership. Their new parent company also owns Surgeon Rifles, which is a huge sponsor in the Precision Rifle Series. I wouldn't discount that companies interest in getting back involved with 3 gun. Only time will tell. I will tell you that if we don't make them feel welcome they will probably just stay away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigLucky Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Gentlemen, I never said that they shouldn't build a rifle. Nor did I make any statements about capitalism. I simply said: "But I do not think for one second that the current management/ownership of Armalite cares at all about 3gun or 3gunners so I won't recommend their products to people who are looking for a 3gun rifle." You guys are smarter than me if you can figure out a persons ideas about society and politics from a few paragraphs about guns. Maybe when I'm telling people about matches that were put on 30 years ago and how awesome the quad load was once I'll be as smart as you guys. And for what its worth I have had my sponsors tell me they notice a sales difference when they have sponsored less matches. Tyler, are you referring to the new ownership as of about 2-3 months ago?? I don't think that is a fair assessment as they are just getting spun up..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClutchUSMC Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 No I was just making a generalization. I know nothing of the ownership of the company. I would be more than happy to recommend their products to 3gunners, but since there are already a score of companies producing rifles that are the same quality that do support the sport we all love... why would you not recommend one of their products over an armalite? I'm sure their rifles are fine and would be happy to throw them in the Stag, DPMS, Doublestar, Colt, etc conversation... but as long as long as those companies are keeping us at the range and armalite isn't it's an easy choice for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tactica Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 (edited) To the OP, I'm not familiar with the Armalite rifle you mention.My suggestion, as someone only a year into 3-gun career, but a competition shooter in other sports since 2010 is - make an informed decision. You indicate this is a competition gun. Great, I would pick a division first. Then, then consider the ranges and competition circuit you are going to compete in. Look for any control preferences you have in how the gun operates. Then, IMO, you are ready to decide, manufactured or custom. Look at buying (or building) something that is going to fit your needs, desires and purposes is something you will ultimately be more happy with than just buying from a favorite manufacturer or the latest new / shiny model of xyz. The barrel is arguably one of the most important decisions you will make about your rifle. Example: If your longest shot is going to be 100 yards at the clubs you frequent, and your not shooting more than 20 rounds in a course of fire, then you probably not going to justify popping for a top end barrel. On the other hand, if your clubs regular shoot at 400-600 yards and love to make good short plus precision long shots in the same courses, that barrel is going to be taxed... I'd steer you to JP's supermatch and nothing else for high demand work. Whether you go with a shorty or 18"+ barrel, 1:7, 1:8 or 1:9 twist and choice of gas system will also depend upon the balance of weight, accuracy and cycling differences you may wish to employ. Questions on your mind should include, do you want: - Gas Impingement vs. Gas Piston? - Carbine, mid or rifle length gas? - Adjustable gas system for different loads or to tune the bolt cycling to your load? - Low mass or full mass bolt / carrier group - Stock buffer, flat spring, or JP silent capture buffer system - Specific stock / grip / handguard? - Ambi / oversized charging? - Want ambi safety? - Enhanced bolt release or BAD lever? - Tuned trigger with a competition pistol feel? - A specific compensator / muzzle treatment - (etc, the list is far from exhaustive...) The more information you have about what you want in the performance and where / how you will use the rifle, the more that will guide your decision to the parts you put in your ideal black rifle. Even if you don't build one to your exact specs right out of the gate (which would be my preferred approach), knowing what you want to get too allows you to start buying something that's closer to your ideal blaster. Edited October 30, 2013 by Tactica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Tyler, where did anyone bring up quad loading? Armalite doesn't even sound like Quad loading! I can tell you think it is the lastest way, and I hate to be the one who tells you, the first time I saw anyone Quad load was way back in 2003 in Italy. The Swiss teams were doing it, They even went as far as putting a drop of super glue on the rim of the bottom shell to keep it aligned with the top shell when loading fast.....see you can learn from the past! The German teams were doing the "load two" matter of fact the whole concept started in Europe before that time and was pioneered by George Moskop (a German). The "Whole new system" was brought over here by Bernd Wiesner a Geramn who came and shot the first Pan-American held at Rock Castle. Ty Gentry bought Bernd"s loading chest rig and had Mark Otto duplicate it...the rest is as they say "history" which doesn't seem to hold much for you,. I would say there is no reason to recommend an Armalite over any other rifle you mentioned, But I wouldn't go out of my way to say don't buy them either, they have a history of supporting our sport and that should count for something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClutchUSMC Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 It's a metaphor, armalite may have been the hot thing then, quad loading is the hot thing now. I brought it up to illustrate my point. Here's another on for you... about the same time as those SOF matches we were giving al qaeda weapons, since they were on our side then we should give them credit for being on our side now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sono Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Two simple suggestions... 1 Buy once cry once. Get quality that you will be happy with for the long term. If you don't like it big names sell easier than less praised. 2 As a personal opinion I try to buy from those that do support our sport. Company X puts product and such on prize tables as well as the guy or gal wearing their jersey is cool. I buy from company X and send emails stating that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shooter115 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 (edited) From Armalite rifles, to purchasing ethics, to brand loyalty, to SOF matches, to a discussion on capitalism, to quad-loading, to al qaeda. Wow.....this thread is like an octopus on meth Though it has been informative and entertaining. Edited October 30, 2013 by Shooter115 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 this thread is like an octopus on meth Though it has been entertaining. Maybe in the same way a train wreck is entertaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 But wait...not only will you get the octopus on meth, but if you order right now... Tyler, it,s that darn history thing again!! The Soviets left Afghanistan in 1988. Al Qaeda was formed in 1989. We were arming the Mujahadeen...not Al Qaeda...cause they weren't even an entity yet! so in this "metaphor" no they don't get credit. Now the Muj went onto form the cadre of the Taliban and Al Qaeda, but at the time you are talking about....NOPE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oak hill Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 hey, its a forum..... your bound to get opinions :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaise1 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Ok I've got to put my .02 in Armalite has always made good guns. Good barrels and what I thought was the best factory SS trigger short of JP and the had those cool green carbon fiber forearms. I just googled their 3Gunner and it's not perfect but it is reasonably priced for the quality, I thought. Tyler, there's a bunch of TV stars from Louisiana putting stuff on prize tables at matches I've seen you at. Does that mean I should call them up for my new Super Duper 3gun Rifle? Don't think so. I'll just keep my old Rock River with all the parts I added on that I bought from some companies that do support this sport. It's about shooting and having fun for me and having reliable equipment. If STI didn't donate a little here and there would anybody really care enough to run something else? I think I'm going to go practice weakhand and Qauds while y'all sort this out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaise1 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 (edited) Yep '88, Rambo 3, No Al Qaeda. Just Ruskies and Muj And back in '88 there were only about 4 brands of AR's Edited October 30, 2013 by Blaise1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Can someone post a link to the 3 gun rifle from the OP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gose Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Can someone post a link to the 3 gun rifle from the OP? http://oakhillguns.com/armalite-ar-15t-3-gunner-18-ss.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Donald Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Armalite makes a good product. I have couple of their AR10's and they are sweet guns. If I was in the market I would look at theirs for a good base gun to tweak to what I want. However I prefer building my own if not I'd buy a JP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskapopo Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Well "THIS" for "this^^^", and "this^^^ again" Armalite may not be doing that much here in the U.S. at the moment, but how quickly we forget that they were HUGE sponsores of the S.O.F. match and Mesa. They had a shooting team and lot,s of product on the prize table. Over seas they are still quite active especially in the Nordic countries and even have several shooting teams over there. If it wasn't for Armalite we probably wouldn't have brakes and they pioneered the flat top. They were the ones that conmvinced Trijicon to make a flat top mount for the ACOGS. Yeah bellittle them all you like but they HAVE been supporters of 3-gun before most of you guys even decided to own a BB gun. I would look for them to re- invest in the sport like they did before. They certainly have done more for 3-gun than Colt ever has and yet you guys are all about giving Colt a pass! Now why is that? Agree. Did not always feel this way but after being involved in running matches I buy from people who support us. Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskapopo Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Ok I've got to put my .02 in Armalite has always made good guns. Good barrels and what I thought was the best factory SS trigger short of JP and the had those cool green carbon fiber forearms. I just googled their 3Gunner and it's not perfect but it is reasonably priced for the quality, I thought. Tyler, there's a bunch of TV stars from Louisiana putting stuff on prize tables at matches I've seen you at. Does that mean I should call them up for my new Super Duper 3gun Rifle? Don't think so. I'll just keep my old Rock River with all the parts I added on that I bought from some companies that do support this sport. It's about shooting and having fun for me and having reliable equipment. If STI didn't donate a little here and there would anybody really care enough to run something else? I think I'm going to go practice weakhand and Qauds while y'all sort this out. Armalite has had their problems. My own horror stories. 1st was an AR10 T that had a doubling issue and hammer follow with the trigger. Paid big money to ship it back to the factory twice to correct the problem and it never did. I ended up putting on an after market trigger and the issue was solved. The factory rep told me I need to pull the trigger harder. LOL. 2. Extractions issues with an AR10 carbine. took forever to get that gun running with tons of so called factory up grades. 3. AR180 polimer lower cracked. Armalite did fix this gun and I sold it after that could not trust it again. Not saying all their guns are bad buy to say they have always made good guns is not true. Not saying Armalite is terrible all companies have their lemons but I am a little shy towards them after my experiences. Pat Edited October 31, 2013 by Alaskapopo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Only Armalite I ever had any personal experience with was an AR-17 shotgun, was great for dove hunting. Sorry I ever sold it although this was back in the 70s. Since most people have never seen one: http://www.chuckhawks.com/armalite_AR-17.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orangeman711 Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Can't believe we've had this many posts knocking a firearms manufacturer that goes back so many years producing the type of firearm we all love and compete with. If not for Eagle Arms,Armalite,DPMS,Colt,Daniel,Rock River,Wilson,and all the other AR type manufactures where would not only the American military be but all of us 3-gun competitors also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling White Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Trivia question....where are Armalite products assembled? I think I know but not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskapopo Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Can't believe we've had this many posts knocking a firearms manufacturer that goes back so many years producing the type of firearm we all love and compete with. If not for Eagle Arms,Armalite,DPMS,Colt,Daniel,Rock River,Wilson,and all the other AR type manufactures where would not only the American military be but all of us 3-gun competitors also? Armalite is not the Armalite of Eugene Stoner days. Eagle Arms purchased the rights to the name so the firm does not go back as far as you think it does. Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MILDOTS Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 My first 3gun rifle was an Eagle Arms purchased in '92or'93 It shot under a inch at 100 yards still have it (the lower) Then I found JP and all was lost (Money that is) I have always applied a hardware solution (guns) to a software problem(practice and ammo). My point is the Eagle arms would still be great rifle for 3gun but I like buying guns. And yes the reason I purchased the Eagle Arms was because of John Cook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now