shooting for M Posted November 12, 2007 Share Posted November 12, 2007 All I know is that was the most fun match I have ever shot. I'll be there next year, hopefully, maybe I can get picked on the initial lottery drawing. Being my best finish didn't hurt either. Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokarev Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 All I know is that was the most fun match I have ever shot. Jason Shooting the annual Nogales Police Games doesn't count as previous match experience! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooting for M Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 All I know is that was the most fun match I have ever shot. Jason Shooting the annual Nogales Police Games doesn't count as previous match experience! You mean the tactical Turkey shoot? Smarta$$. But almost true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokarev Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 All I know is that was the most fun match I have ever shot. Jason Shooting the annual Nogales Police Games doesn't count as previous match experience! You mean the tactical Turkey shoot? Smarta$$. But almost true. You know I'm just teasing. Congrats on the win, BTW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 13, 2007 Author Share Posted November 13, 2007 That hit factor talk was taking on a life of it's own (almost 2 pages) and seemed to deserve it's own thread. So, I split off those posts and moved them here: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=56042 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 That hit factor talk was taking on a life of it's own (almost 2 pages) and seemed to deserve it's own thread. So, I split off those posts and moved them here: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=56042 That why you get paid the REALY big bucks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 13, 2007 Author Share Posted November 13, 2007 My thoughts on the trip... This was my first trip for a match out west (other than Nationals in Tulsa). Phoenix is nice. We stayed up in Scottsdale...which is a bit of a drive compared to the match hotel. Traffic in Phoenix sucks. They must have a lot of Ohio transplants out there, as they all like to get in the fast lane and poke along at Miss Daisy speeds...like they do here in Ohio. Three cars, in three lanes, all going the same speed...log jam. I liked the stages. Lots of nice props. Good shooting tests. Good mix. There were a few little things that bothered me (and some others I spoke with). I hesitate to bring them up, but I probably should. I guess I am a stickler for the rule book...and may be spoiled a bit. A match of this caliber...probably ought to follow the rule book closely. - I think all the written stage briefings (WSB) featued wording about not taking a loaded sight picture. Of course that is allowed the rule book. I don't know what penalty could be applied anyway. No big deal...just weird. - On about half the stages, they scored behind the shooters. Usually they let you know about this in the walk-thru. But, sometmes it was just the RO on the clip board writting scores down as he saw them. No call out, no checks and balances. I've shoot plenty of big matches, I don't know that I have seen any staff ever get the calls 100% right. And, in fact, on the stages here that they did call out scores, I caught two corrections that needed to be made (for other shooters, while I was taping). - On one stage the CRO read the WSB and then told us that the start postion didn't stipulate a hand position..."but this is what we want". OK...just have the RM put the proper wording in the WSB. Simple. - There was a position that I was going to shoot from that had the possiblity of a shoot through on a paper target onto a piece of steel. I gave the RO a heads-up on this before I shoot (as they might not have been in a position to see it). His take was that he'd just go ahead and give me the hit if it happened. - Another stage had me as the last shooter on the Production squad. The Limited squad had shown up and everybody from both squads were kinda crunched into a little choke point...which wasn't too far from the start position. Of course, people were joking and talking a bit. The CRO got on everybody a bit hard...telling them to be quiet (in not so many words). Noise usually doesn't bother me on a stage (and it wasn't a bother here). It probably helps me a bit, as I remember to focus on my plan and ignore the distractions. But, it seemed to bother the CRO. Later on, it occured to me that the CRO was busy yelling at them while I was hot...and waiting to shoot (maybe yell at them on CRO time...not shooter time?). Then, after my run, then CRO singled out one of our squad members (a local shooter with a distictive voice) and started to chew on him a bit. The CRO's displeasure was misplaced and our shooter replied as such. Which turned into a back-and-forth game of... "shut-up"..."it wasn't me". This went on for about six or eight exchanges, ending with the CRO kicking the shooter in the shins. After we left that stage, I asked the shooter what was up with that. He defended the CRO, so I chalked that up to them being local and knowing each other. From my perspective it seemed weird. Kinda like going to a nice place to eat and then having to hear the kitchen/wait staff have an arguement in front of everybody. I was able to laugh about it, but I wondered how other that might have been around the Production and Limited squads might have percieved it. OK...that was all little stuff, in my opinion. I hesitated about posting it here, as I fear it may get taken out of context. But, then again, I didn't feel right to leave it out and just say how great everything was. Things were pretty cool though. The prize table was really deep. The stages were great to shoot. My squad was super professionals and easy going. With 14 shooters...you had to hustle to get to tape a target. The stages all ran quickly for us...no back-ups. The vedor tent was as big as any. There was nothing that I'd consider too "goofy". We did have one stage that was quite a memory stage. I'm biased against those. But, one out of eleven might be OK. The shooting really was a good mix. I got to visit with one of my best frineds that had moved out to the area a few years ago. We had dinner at his beautiful home on Saturday night. On Sunday I went to Casey's and got to hang with BE, Henning and company. I also got to meet a number of forum members that I wouldn't otherwise get to meet. It was a great trip. I'm very glad I got to go. Oh...and thanks to the sponsors. I was able to take a Rock Island Armory 1911 off the prize table. And, my trusty GLOCK ran like a top and did all that I could ask it to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Flex, It is sort of ironic that you won a 1911 . I asked the RO on stage 6 about the sight picture on a single target instruction (after we were done so I didn't seem like I was arguing with the guys) and he said that it was the rule. I pointed ou that it was an IPSC rule and not a USPSA rule but that seemed lost on him. What number was the memory stage? And, it was good to meet you, albiet briefly Later, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaels Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) My thoughts on the trip... - Another stage had me as the last shooter on the Production squad. The Limited squad had shown up and everybody from both squads were kinda crunched into a little choke point...which wasn't too far from the start position. Of course, people were joking and talking a bit. The CRO got on everybody a bit hard...telling them to be quiet (in not so many words). Noise usually doesn't bother me on a stage (and it wasn't a bother here). It probably helps me a bit, as I remember to focus on my plan and ignore the distractions. But, it seemed to bother the CRO. Later on, it occured to me that the CRO was busy yelling at them while I was hot...and waiting to shoot (maybe yell at them on CRO time...not shooter time?). Then, after my run, then CRO singled out one of our squad members (a local shooter with a distictive voice) and started to chew on him a bit. The CRO's displeasure was misplaced and our shooter replied as such. Which turned into a back-and-forth game of... "shut-up"..."it wasn't me". This went on for about six or eight exchanges, ending with the CRO kicking the shooter in the shins. After we left that stage, I asked the shooter what was up with that. He defended the CRO, so I chalked that up to them being local and knowing each other. From my perspective it seemed weird. Kinda like going to a nice place to eat and then having to hear the kitchen/wait staff have an arguement in front of everybody. I was able to laugh about it, but I wondered how other that might have been around the Production and Limited squads might have percieved it. Flex, I was watching that exchange also and thought it was out of place, but then when you guys got done with your scoresheets and moved on, the CRO & AH hugged.....some shooters on that stage earlier told me that had been instructed it was weak hand only for the first 3 targets. Very strange there. The swinger that you mentioned was covering the foward falling popper, a couple of shooters got the activator behind it and then got the popper with the shoot through, it was painfully obvious that it would then be REM, but they were giving the hit anyway. I tried for it since I was only shooting with 6 - didn't happen... But yes, a great match anyway michaels Edited November 13, 2007 by michaels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 13, 2007 Author Share Posted November 13, 2007 Flex,It is sort of ironic that you won a 1911 . heeeey...I never said I didn't like 1911's. they are fun to work on. (Really, they are cool.) What number was the memory stage? Stage 8 was the memory stage. At least for us with a limit on the number of bullets in the gun. Five minutes for fourteen shooters makes that rough, to say the least. And, it was good to meet you, albiet briefly You too. Thanks for coming up and introducing yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 13, 2007 Author Share Posted November 13, 2007 .....some shooters on that stage earlier told me that had been instructed it was weak hand only for the first 3 targets. Very strange there. When I heard some mof our guys talk about how they were going to approach that I made it a point to go over and read the exact words in the walk-thru. It said..."retrieve the baby with the weak hand", and to "deposit the baby after engaging T1-T3". (or words to that effect) The wording on the WSB didn't say it had to be held in any certain way. Sometimes it is good to be a range lawyer. (I didn't do anything special with the baby, but knew I could.) The swinger that you mentioned was covering the foward falling popper, a couple of shooters got the activator behind it and then got the popper with the shoot through, it was painfully obvious that it would then be REM, but they were giving the hit anyway. I tried for it since I was only shooting with 6 - didn't happen... Hmmm...the possible shoot-thru I was thinking of was on the star fighter stage. Engaging the left paper on the center array from the far right of the stage might have netted the 2 o'clock plate from the left star. It turned out to be a non-issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Flex,It is sort of ironic that you won a 1911 . heeeey...I never said I didn't like 1911's. they are fun to work on. (Really, they are cool.) What number was the memory stage? Stage 8 was the memory stage. At least for us with a limit on the number of bullets in the gun. Five minutes for fourteen shooters makes that rough, to say the least. And, it was good to meet you, albiet briefly You too. Thanks for coming up and introducing yourself. Flex, Yep, stage 8 was a major memory test and I'm also biased against those. It also turned out to be my disaster stage. The 5min didn't seem like it and I was the third shooter...never had it set in my head and ran past a target that I thought I'd taken from another port....ouch, FTE and two mikes. We actually had a shooter on our squad get a procedural for not having the baby on his person when he took the first three targets. The MD was called and said "you signed for it, you get it" or something along those lines. The WSB didn't say retain the baby while engaging, but that's what they wanted. As I understand it, signing a score card locks the shooter in to prevent anything negative from being added (like a missed no-shoot) but, it shouldn't prevent a correction in the favor of the shooter. Live and learn...if that ever happens to me I'll wait to sign until after the final decision has been made. I'll be there next year if I get a slot. Still, it was a fun match and I walked away with a class win and one of the RIA 1911s after my "disaster at 8" as I'm calling it....hard to complain about that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Hmmm...the possible shoot-thru I was thinking of was on the star fighter stage. Engaging the left paper on the center array from the far right of the stage might have netted the 2 o'clock plate from the left star. It turned out to be a non-issue. Funny you should mention that. A guy on our squad engaged the middle array from right to left and when he was on the last (left) target, he got his feet busy to move to the right. He pulled the shot left, through the wall, and nailed the 2:00 plate . The RO didn't see it since he was on the right side of the starfighter. I didn't know it was unitentional and I thought what an interesting stage plan! The CRO was just going to just score it as it stood but I pointed out that it looked like a REF and after noticing the ONLY bullet hole in the left wall, he changed it and gave the guy a reshoot. And he did a bit better on the reshoot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HI5-O Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Squad 20 was a great squad to be with It was perfect shooting weather for me (warm). Good to see old friends and make new ones Hope to bring more reinforcements from the 50th state next year Mahalo to all the organizers and RO's who put in their valuable time so we could shoot the match barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipscbob Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 (edited) I asked the RO on stage 6 about the sight picture on a single target instruction (after we were done so I didn't seem like I was arguing with the guys) and he said that it was the rule. I pointed ou that it was an IPSC rule and not a USPSA rule but that seemed lost on him. Ahhh. Didnt know that this is an IPSC rule but I was certain that it is NOT a USPSA rule. I got warned by the RO on that stage for transitioning between targets while taking an unloaded sight picture. Thought it was strange but I accepted it and didnt give her a hard time over it. Edited November 14, 2007 by ipscbob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynn jones Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 (edited) What number was the memory stage? Stage 8 was the memory stage. At least for us with a limit on the number of bullets in the gun. Five minutes for fourteen shooters makes that rough, to say the least. And, it was good to meet you, albiet briefly they always have memory stages at area 2. you just can't let your guard down and go to lunch. you really have to prep the stages. don't ask me why! lynn Edited November 14, 2007 by lynn jones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 they always have memory stages at area 2. you just can't let your guard down and go to lunch. you reallyb have to prep the stages. don't ask me why!lynn Yup! As much prep as possible is the order of the day! But, if you think that one was bad, you should of tried a 5 minute dope of "Dead Dog Saloon" or "Rudy's Big Top" at the 2005 classic! Later, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viggen Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 (edited) they always have memory stages at area 2. you just can't let your guard down and go to lunch. you reallyb have to prep the stages. don't ask me why!lynn Yup! As much prep as possible is the order of the day! But, if you think that one was bad, you should of tried a 5 minute dope of "Dead Dog Saloon" or "Rudy's Big Top" at the 2005 classic! Later, Chuck Those were memory stages !!! On "Dead Dog Saloon" after the buzzer sounded and while running through the door I remember thinking, " I wonder how I am going to shoot this?' And then as I stepped through the door some sort of plan materialized in my brain.... LOL This match was very straight forward and challenging at the same time. It looked like you could go fast but if you went just a little too far it would bite you. A great match. Edited November 14, 2007 by Viggen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Intel6 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Squad 20 was a great squad to be with It was perfect shooting weather for me (warm). Good to see old friends and make new ones Hope to bring more reinforcements from the 50th state next year Mahalo to all the organizers and RO's who put in their valuable time so we could shoot the match barry Barry, Glad to see you made it back across the water safely, it was great to meet and shoot with you. Squad 20 was a great squad! We were fighting each other the whole time to paste and set targets which is always nice. Having Dave Thomas and Bruce Gary on the squad was great also. I don't care what people say about those guys (especially Bruce) , they were great guys to shoot with. Neal in AZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgary Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I don't care what people say about those guys (especially Bruce) , they were great guys to shoot with Hey! I work hard at my reputation, don't you go messing it up now! <vbg> It was great shooting with you, too. I dunno about the other squads, but I'd be hard-pressed to believe any of them had more fun than ours. b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HI5-O Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I don't care what people say about those guys (especially Bruce) , they were great guys to shoot with Hey! I work hard at my reputation, don't you go messing it up now! <vbg> It was great shooting with you, too. I dunno about the other squads, but I'd be hard-pressed to believe any of them had more fun than ours. b This was our bunch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 14, 2007 Author Share Posted November 14, 2007 I see you guys have Dave trained to keep ahold of that target tape. He looks happy to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 15 thank you notes many more to go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtr Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I hope this isn't the wrong place to post this. I've never shot A2, but I wanted to go this year. A lot of local folks here have shot it every year for the past 4 or 5 years and they seemed to give it mixed reviews in the past with criticisms of the memory stages in '05 and some issues with not being able to see the stages and get on the berms in years before. It sounds to me like this year everyone really enjoyed the match with the only complaints being very minor things. I don't want to travel to a match with a bunch of memory stages that I don't get hardly any time to look at beforehand. So what would you recommend to someone who wants to shoot this match but is a little worried about the experiences some of my shooting buddies have had in the past? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n2ipsc Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Squad 20 was a great squad to be with Squadmates can certainly make or break the experience - I may have shot with a squad I enjoyed more, but I sure don't remember when... (Despite Bruce's best efforts... ) Thanks for posting the group pic, too! Steve, thanks for being "Squad Mom" and herding all us cats... Good to see old friends and make new ones Nice to finally meet folks I've only know by BENOS monikers to date! Hope we didn't traumatize Holy Terror...too much... ("window-licking, short-bus special" as we were) Here's hoping we'll all run into one another again at next year's match! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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