Hughes Vs Gracie

[folsoml]

The UFC pay per view is tomorrow night! The current champion, Matt Hughes, vs the legend, Royce Gracie. Royce says he invented the UFC. "I built this house," he says. Matt says Royce can't hang with the current crop of fighters because they all are truly "mixed martial artists," not all devoted to one style like in Royce's day. Royce asks when was the last time Matt had to fight four guys in one night with no time limits. What's everyone's take on this?

Plus fights with The Ultimate Fighter 1 alumni, Deigo Sanchez and Mike Swick.

Complete fight card

[spook]

I don't know about the MMA fans out here, but I have been counting the days towards UFC 60.

I love MMA, and although I am more of a Pride fan than a UFC fan, I am really looking fowards to UFC 60, because of Royce's reappearance.

I hope Royce can pull off a submission on Matt, but my gut tells me it will be a grueling 5 rounds of ground and pound from Hughes and a struggeling Royce trying but failing to submit (kind of like the Royce/Tokoro fight).

Anyone else here going to watch this?

[SmittyFL]

I'll probably watch it, and I'd love to see Royce win. I just don't think it's going to happen. Matt is right, everybody uses Royce's style now along with stand up abilities he doesn't have. At least he didn't have.

I actually got to fight Royce once, in a controlled training environment. This was way back in the beginning of the UFC when most folks had never heard of it. I remember thinking how skinny and weak he looked. I didn't figure I would beat him, but thought I would be able to hang just on a strength advantage. Ha.....I have never been more wrong in my life. I think it lasted maybe 4 seconds, and I still don't know what happened.

[spook]

I guess I'm not alone

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...topic=35974&hl=

I hope Royce can pull off a submission on Matt, but my gut tells me it will be a grueling 5 rounds of ground and pound from Hughes and a struggeling Royce trying but failing to submit (kind of like the Royce/Tokoro fight).

Edited May 26, 2006 by spook

[Flexmoney]

I don't know about the MMA fans out here, but I have been counting the days towards UFC 60.

I love MMA, and although I am more of a Pride fan than a UFC fan, I am really looking fowards to UFC 60, because of Royce's reappearance.

I hope Royce can pull off a submission on Matt, but my gut tells me it will be a grueling 5 rounds of ground and pound from Hughes and a struggeling Royce trying but failing to submit (kind of like the Royce/Tokoro fight).

Anyone else here going to watch this?

I'd like to real bad. I think it is pay-per-view, and I would have to go somewhere to see it. (Wonder if any of the local bars are carrying it...)

[Putty]

Gracie still likes the no weight class, one man leaves rules of ole. I want to see him fight someone his same weight.

Going out on a limb.......Gracie by submission/decision. What does Enos pay out on current odds?

[Bruce]

The rules favor Hughes in this fight.

No rounds, no time-limit, no re-starts to standing position---would be the fight that Royce needs. Scoring takedowns, scoring rounds, standing fighters up as soon as the action "stalls" on the ground, favor Hughes.

If I had to bet this fight, under the rules they will have tomorrow, I would bet Hughes. If it had no time-limit, no rounds, no re-starts, I would bet Gracie.

I hope Royce wins.

[Jake Di Vita]

I have all the respect in the world for Royce, but I just don't think he is well rounded enough to survive in MMA today. I could be wrong but I really think Matt is going to walk away with it.

[Radar]

Haven't watched much since Royce left. I did happen to see their respective interviews. Unfortunately, got rid of the box recently so I won't be able to watch. Would love to see Royce win but he will have a hard time against Hughes.

[Bob Hostetter]

Gracie all the way..............

[rubberneck]

This one won't even be close. I have a lot of respect for what the Gracie's have done but his day has come and gone. This isn't your father's MMA anymore. The advantage that the Gracie's used to enjoy is no longer there. I don't think Hughes has nearly as big disadvantage on the ground that Gracie does standing up.

I want to see him fight someone his same weight.

You do realize that Royce is taller and heavier than Hughes?

[folsoml]

I guess I'm not alone

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...topic=35974&hl=

D'oh! Should have done a search! I just checked the other UFC threads to see if anyone updated them.

(Edit: Oh, I just checked the times, and this is just a case of great minds thinking alike!)

Things were a lot different when Gracie was in his prime. Hair pulling, head butting...all that was legal then. Bruce hit the nail on the head, too. Gracie would take people down and just hang on to wear them out. Now, they will stop it if it gets boring and stand them back up--back into Matt's world.

I just afraid of both guys trying to play it too safe--instead of fighting to win, they fight not to lose. I like Hughes in this fight. I want to see him do one of trademark slams, but I don't know if he can pull it off with Gracie.

Edited May 26, 2006 by folsoml

[spook]

I guess I'm not alone

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...topic=35974&hl=

D'oh! Should have done a search! I just checked the other UFC threads to see if anyone updated them.

(Edit: Oh, I just checked the times, and this is just a case of great minds thinking alike!)

Yeah, crazy that both of us start a thread about the same subject within 4 minutes of eachother

Man, 4 more hours and it's the 27th over here. Makes it feel a little closer

Too bad I can't watch this on PPV. I'll have to download it immediately after and not watch any forums aor other possible spoilers

[chp5]

Love watching MMA!

My prediction: Hughes will smash Gracie!!

Spook - why do you like Pride better than UFC?

Edited May 26, 2006 by chp5

[BEDELLCUSTOM]

I don't think Royce can take much of a beating so if Hughes can get a few good hits on him i don't think Royce will last long. all of Royce's matches were won by submission and his chin has never been tested much but he was the best submission fighter of his time but i think his time may has come and gone. Hughes is not only a great submission fighter but he can lay out a beatin' pretty well too.

[spook]

Spook - why do you like Pride better than UFC?

I like Pride rules. I don't really like elbows (UFC), because they just cut and don't really knock out. I don't like it when a fight ends because someone was cut. I do like knees on the ground and being able to kick a downed opponent.

I also like it that fighters can use the Gi in Pride (like Yoshida)

I like fighters of different weight classes fight eachother as in the Pride OWGP.

And somehow, I can't shake the feeling that Pride has more talented fighters (especially in the Heavy Weight Division).

What I really like about Pride is the audience and the commentary. Bas Rutten is very skilled and funny as hell. The audience will actually applaude guard passes etc.

I don't know, it's probably the whole setting. I feel Pride has so many "signature fighters" like Rampage (who unfortunately just left), Wanderlei, Fedor, Nogueira, Cro Cop, Yoshida, Sakuraba.

I really like UFC though

[Putty]

This one won't even be close. I have a lot of respect for what the Gracie's have done but his day has come and gone. This isn't your father's MMA anymore. The advantage that the Gracie's used to enjoy is no longer there. I don't think Hughes has nearly as big disadvantage on the ground that Gracie does standing up.

I want to see him fight someone his same weight.

You do realize that Royce is taller and heavier than Hughes?

Like Royce says "thats why we fight, to find out"

Close enough. Final weigh in will be about 5 lbs difference. Better than the historical 100 lb diparity...wouldnt you say? Ididnt know there was a height limit

[dirtypool40]

half of me wants to chime in on one side or the other, half of me wants to shut up for fear of showing how little I know.

My questions are:

Why didn't Royce continue to fight / dominate the UFC once people woke up, fighters developed and he quit facing mismatch style? He doesn't have anything to prove here. He ain't past his prime, Matt is mid 30's Coutre, Liddell, etc etc.

Why won't Royce make weight and fight for the title? Come on, 5#, that's skipping a late night snack and 30 min on the tread mill before weigh in. They are letting him walk in after this long off into the #1 spot. Is there some reason he doesn't want to go 5 rounds?

What is Royce's recent record? Some people think he's laid off for a decade, and that's not true, he's been fighting. But who has he been fighting, how do they stack up with current good, well rounded MMA guys and how'd things go? Sure Royce can learn and evolve too, but has he?

Matt has shown a vulnerability in submissions in early fights, and in some cases a willingness to let someone get something, and sometimes get caught whn he thought he could power out (ala Newton and Penn). I think that's a major mistake, but I also think that as he's matured as a fighter, that sometimes over-confidence has been tempered with more respect and patience. He's also trained to be more well rounded and seems better every fight.

Watching Matt against top grapplers, he still throws them around "like fish", ala Carlos Newton x2.

I'm anxious to see how it goes, I could see it go either way, but I think it's going to take a lucky break for Royce to win. There's no time for Gracie's patented patience at the pace Hughes fights.

I think the crowd is there to see Royce get slammed (Matt does it to everybody) and hit. Neither has ever really happened.

[L9X25]

half of me wants to chime in on one side or the other, half of me wants to shut up for fear of showing how little I know.

SNIPPAGE--->>>>

I think the crowd is there to see Royce get slammed (Matt does it to everybody) and hit. Neither has ever really happened.

Eric,

I too know very little anymore. I was very "into" this in the begining and followed it during the Gracie, Shamrock, Severn days then kinda lost interest and my dish.

I always assumed that Gracie would be in trouble if he were unable to get a quick submission, but seem to remember he and "Dan the Beast" having a long battle where he had the crap beat out of him until he finally found a choke after almost 30 minutes of battle. Dan seemingly worked on him forever with his 100lb weight advantage. He beat on him and tossed him around a lot. Parts of the fight were not pretty but he really gave Gracie a workout. There was more to Gracie than what I expected.

[JFD]

According to the pre-fight show, Gracie has been fighting some in Japan. We all know how well the Japanese are doing in UFC

Gracie is dangerous and always will be. Matt makes a mistake and the fight is over. Gracie doesn't have to make a mistake for Matt to beat him severely.

I think that due to Gracie's comments about today's fighters not being able to fight multiple fights (hardly a fact), they should just match him up against Hughes, Franklin, and Lydell tomorrow. Let him see what it's like to fight 3 killers instead of a bunch of single-skilled folks who weren't even close to the quality of today's fighters.

Right now I still say it's a toss-up. Gracie will always be dangerous if he gets hold of an arm, leg, throat, etc. Matt is well rounded, tough as hell, and knows how to use his strength.

I was thinking Gracie used to fight at around 185 - 190 lbs, so 175 shouldn't be too much trouble for him.

[folsoml]

I think that due to Gracie's comments about today's fighters not being able to fight multiple fights (hardly a fact), they should just match him up against Hughes, Franklin, and Lydell tomorrow. Let him see what it's like to fight 3 killers instead of a bunch of single-skilled folks who weren't even close to the quality of today's fighters.

And the statement itself does not take into account that the three or four fighters he fought each night had also each fought three or four fighters to get to the point where they were facing him. It is not like he was fighting fresh guys each time.

[Jake Di Vita]

Fedor is just the baddest mamma jamma I've ever seen.

[al503]

I have a feeling that if Gracie gets an arm, he's going to break it even if Hughes is tapping with all three other appendages.

[folsoml]

I don't watch too much Pride, but I've got a buddy who does, and he says that the current UFC fighters would get killed in Pride. He said Chuck Liddell couldn't hack it over there. How can that be?

I like the UFC because you cannot get a stoppage by getting on the ropes. I don't like it when they stop them and move the back to the center "in the same position." There's just no way to get the exactly the same way. The cage eliminates that problem.

[folsoml]

I have a feeling that if Gracie gets an arm, he's going to break it even if Hughes is tapping with all three other appendages.

He does seem to have a tendancy to hold a submission until the ref pries him off.