Is this too much crimp?

[Goat259]

Just got my Apex 10 all set up and am using the Lyman Pro Die pack.

 

in the picture shared, it shows a shiny ring just around the mouth of the case. On my 650, I was using a Lee Carbide Factory Crimp Dir. On my Apex, I’m using the Lyman Micrometer Crimp die. I never seen this ring using the Lee crimp die. I test fired a few rounds and had a power factor of 176, and everything is case gauging decent for mixed range brass. 

I worry if I take crimp off, I’ll have gauging issues. Is this too much crimp? With the brass rubbing off, if that is what it is, is it safe to reload after I shoot these?

 

Thank you.

 

[Cowguy]

What was the power factor on this load on the 650?  If it is higher with the new loader you probably have too much crimp. You can pull a bullet and check how deep into the side of the bullet the crimp is.

[IHAVEGAS]

I called one of the more popular coated bullet manufacturers a week or two ago. The guidance I got was to pull the bullet and insure that you are not crimping enough to leave a ring, i.e. that all you are doing is bringing the brass back far enough to meet the bullet. 

 

This is the way I have loaded thousands of rounds of bayou & sns bullets & (mostly 9mm) it has worked fine for me, just called him for a sanity check. 

 

 

[Goat259]

My Power Factor on my 650 was about 172-176 at the matches that had a chrono. I am using Blue Bullets 180 grain. There is a slight indent on the bullet at the crimp, but is exposing no lead. 

49 minutes ago, Cowguy said:

What was the power factor on this load on the 650?  If it is higher with the new loader you probably have too much crimp. You can pull a bullet and check how deep into the side of the bullet the crimp is.

Here is a photo of the indent.

 

 

[45 Raven]

Based on the photo provided, I would say you are good to go with the current crimp.

[Cowguy]

I would say your in a good spot as well.

[Farmer]

Looks perfect! The shiny ring on your brass could be caused by the die’s being new or a slightly different crimp angle on the die. I have noticed this between my Lee and Redding die also. 

[IHAVEGAS]

That is a more pronounced crimp ring than I see with my reloads, but I suspect that the others are correct and it is not enough to cause an issue. 

[shred]

That will not matter at all.  I did far more damage to some bullets as a test and they still grouped fine at 25 yards.

 

 

[Goat259]

4 hours ago, shred said:

That will not matter at all.  I did far more damage to some bullets as a test and they still grouped fine at 25 yards.

 

 

Shred, 

 

What are your thoughts of the shiny ring on the mouth of the brass?

 

 

[Postal Bob]

The shiny ring happens when the flared case enters the crimp die, and the case mouth rubs along the inside of the die body before being crimped. Some dies are narrower or wider than others, so some will rub, and some won't. Reducing the amount of case flaring might help if it's too much. But it's more a result of the dies internal dimension.

I'd gues that you might be seeing some brass dust on the shell plate, the results of the case mouth rubbing along the inside of the die.

And btw, it doesn't affect accuracy at all.

[shred]

What he said.  Don't worry about it.  Maybe flare less if you really want to use that particular piece of brass over and over again, but it'll crack sooner or later anyway.

 

 

[ltdmstr]

Crimp should be .002" smaller than the bullet od+brass thickness (at the case mouth).  Any more than that is excessive.  All you're really doing is removing the flare from the case. 

[shred]

Undercrimping is the #1 problem I see when people send in ammo that 'doesn't fit the gauge' to be inspected. 

 

Almost nobody overcrimps or notices if they do because it just doesn't matter at pistol distances.

 

 

[IHAVEGAS]

On 11/2/2023 at 9:34 AM, shred said:

That will not matter at all.  I did far more damage to some bullets as a test and they still grouped fine at 25 yards.

 

I got curious about the crimping issue only after I found that I was throwing curve balls that broke somewhere slightly past the 20 yard mark. I suspect, but don't know, that several factors are in play (bullet weight, rate of twist, type of rifling, bullet hardness, possibly whose coating, etc). 

 

 

[shred]

Lots more things matter once you get far enough out, but I suspect any normal crimp probably gets swaged right out as the round fires.

 

Here's a 9mm 147gr Blue Bullet, one fresh from the bag and another after having  about 1800 lb applied to it in a press.

 

Given the base surface area of a 9mm bullet is about 0.1 sq in, that's roughly equivalent to an 18,000 PSI load (applied time is obviously way different).

 

Somebody needs to sponsor me one of those crazy high-speed video cameras so I can see for sure. 

 

 

[HHjr]

Chamber Check your round in your removed barrel at your bench.  Flush with hood??  . Your pic looks good. Chamber one the extract and measure OAL for setback.  If So then maybe a bit more. 
 

Been reloading since mid 80’s…. IDPA/IPSC…..  my SOP for semiauto crimp is turn crimp down until you see a burnished shiny ring All around the Outside of case mouth… Done!  
 

H

[StefVanHauwe]

 

Edited December 18, 2023 by StefVanHauwe
Wrong YT-video

[HHjr]

My standard is to taper crimp ( in a Separate Step!!) to a point of Just seeing a shiny burnished edge on case mouth … all semi auto cals.  That’s it  ! 

[cole440]

I say run it. Which seems to have been the consensus here!

 

I don't mean at all to hijack the discussion but since this thread seems to have run its course already, how do you like the blue bullets in 40 cal? I have used them in 38 and love them but haven't branched out yet. Once I deplete my supply of MBC bullets I was considering giving these a shot...

Cole