New Fed Primers

[Farmer]

Has anyone tried the new batch of Federal primers to see if they are as soft as pre-Covid ones? With supplies of everything getting disrupted I sort of wondered if where they got their stock from may have changed. Plus also making Remington primers, if they are the same. I never had any luck with Rem’s so maybe they improved. 

[ysrracer]

Fed's are the same for me. My revo has a 6 pound double action trigger pull.

[Squirrel45]

Federal same as they always been. Remington stay away, hard as a rock.

[Farmer]

3 hours ago, Squirrel45 said:

Federal same as they always been. Remington stay away, hard as a rock.

I always had misfires with Rems and it wasn’t because of light springs. Most were in my SRH and even had some in my TC Encore. 

[gargoil66]

15 hours ago, Farmer said:

Has anyone tried the new batch of Federal primers to see if they are as soft as pre-Covid ones? With supplies of everything getting disrupted I sort of wondered if where they got their stock from may have changed. Plus also making Remington primers, if they are the same. I never had any luck with Rem’s so maybe they improved. 

Farmer:

 

Something tells me the quality of the new Fed 100's has dropped but the sensitivity has not.  Same as before the shortages.

 

GG

[pskys2]

Been running new cci 500 in my 45 acp 625 with a 5# action with no problems.

 

Will find out on feds have some f100m being delivered tomorrow, loading for the irc.

 

Remingtons I've used haven't been close.

[MikeyScuba]

Tell me where anything is getting better?  My wife just noticed the raisin walnut bread this week was weak on both counts.

 

The remingtons are available up here now and doing research on the 1 1/2" it seems they are made for 9mm and lower while the 5's are 9mm and up

 

https://www.ssusa.org/content/remington-1-pistol-primers/

 

Odd that the softness of the 1 1/2" is not useful

[Farmer]

1 hour ago, MikeyScuba said:

Tell me where anything is getting better?  My wife just noticed the raisin walnut bread this week was weak on both counts.

 

The remingtons are available up here now and doing research on the 1 1/2" it seems they are made for 9mm and lower while the 5's are 9mm and up

 

https://www.ssusa.org/content/remington-1-pistol-primers/

 

Odd that the softness of the 1 1/2" is not useful

Trying to find a niche market that really doesn’t exist? Rem has never been my first choice in reloading components mainly because they are usually more expensive and quality wasn’t any better but most of the time worse. Plus all the bizarre crap they come out with. As far as everything else, yes I’ve noticed quantity shrinkage too. Had an old cereal box that was 16 oz, new one is 14.8 and box is same size. Drinks are another area too. 

Edited September 11, 2023 by Farmer

[Joe4d]

I dont really get it with remington,, used to shoot lots of remington 9mm, various rifle, and other center fires and rimfire without a problem.  Winchester and remington was about all I ever bought..
But yeh tryign to use Remington primers and they were hard hard hard.. Why wouldnt they just use the same primers they loaded their ammo with ?

[shred]

They do.  No primers are made specially for retail sale, not today for sure.  They're all overruns from factory ammo production.

 

[Joe4d]

3 hours ago, shred said:

They do.  No primers are made specially for retail sale, not today for sure.  They're all overruns from factory ammo production.

 

simply not true,,,
Ammo mfg primers and retail reloading primers are not the same.
Care to look at the CCI primers I have in my shop ?,,, Retail for reloaders, vs made for ammo mfg.. Different primers. 
Ever see CCI primers that are softer and brass colored ,, just like the ones used in blazer ammo,,, vs the nickle plated reloader cci primers

[shred]

I have a manufacturer wholesale account.  I can buy "OEM/not-for-resale" plated CCI that are identical to regular retail plated CCI except for the packaging (they even have the same CCI lot codes), or I can buy "OEM/NFR" unplated CCI.  They don't sell the unplated ones retail, but there's no indication they make special "retail" primers.  Why would they?

 

I talked to a guy at Federal that said the same thing.  They don't make special primers for reloaders.  They're normal in-house ammo primers put into retail packaging.  I'd be amazed if Remington did differently.  

 

[DougCarden]

What Shred said.

When I was a Commercial reloader I bought the OEM unplated primers at a discount, but I could not resell them.  If I got caught then they would ban me from buying them.  Nothing different except the plated versus plated.  Federals are all the same.  The match primers are weighed for variance.  If they are within specs they are match grade.  Same cup material and priming compound. The manufacturers sell the excess primers to the reloading market when they have excess.  The last shortage was caused by them being short on extra primers due to the fact that they were loading them all into ammo they were selling.  I am pretty sure that the new upstart companies that are making primers will follow suit, but time will tell.

[Joe4d]

Speaking double speak... 
Unplated (only for mfg ammo) and unplated arnt the same.. whole "UN" thing going on.

[ysrracer]

I just bought 5000 Federal Small Pistol Primers at the Phoenix gun show for $375, no shipping no hazmat, but I did spend 10 bucks to park and 15 bucks to get in.

 

Milwall sells them for that online, but there's shipping and hazmat.

[pskys2]

11 hours ago, DougCarden said:

What Shred said.

When I was a Commercial reloader I bought the OEM unplated primers at a discount, but I could not resell them.  If I got caught then they would ban me from buying them.  Nothing different except the plated versus plated.  Federals are all the same.  The match primers are weighed for variance.  If they are within specs they are match grade.  Same cup material and priming compound. The manufacturers sell the excess primers to the reloading market when they have excess.  The last shortage was caused by them being short on extra primers due to the fact that they were loading them all into ammo they were selling.  I am pretty sure that the new upstart companies that are making primers will follow suit, but time will tell.

Good to see you're still around Doug, side note cliff even came out of hiding and shot the free state with us kicked my butt for sure even with his 6 shot, what factory cartridge uses f100m primers?

[DougCarden]

 

Joe, they are using the same cup material, anvil, and priming compound regardless of whether the cup is plated or not.  It costs more to plate the material, so they sell the cheaper ones to the Commercial reloaders.   Last current pricing on the OEM primers was 40.00 per 1K, which went up from the 24.00 per 1 K when I was loading. 

I am not here to argue, just 'splaining what I know as fact from my time loading and my colleagues that are still loading.

[DougCarden]

HI Dave,

Good to hear from you.  I looked at Free state but only have so much time off and funds.  Glad you all got Cliff up to the match.  Hope all is well.

Last I knew, the factory AE ammo and the higher priced Federal ammo had the FED primers in them.  I shot a bunch of Syntech and I know it does have FED primers in them.  Honestly since their facilities are all together in MN I can't imagine them not using them in the loaded ammo......

[Joe4d]

7 minutes ago, DougCarden said:

 

Joe, they are using the same cup material, anvil, and priming compound regardless of whether the cup is plated or not.  It costs more to plate the material, so they sell the cheaper ones to the Commercial reloaders.   Last current pricing on the OEM primers was 40.00 per 1K, which went up from the 24.00 per 1 K when I was loading. 

I am not here to argue, just 'splaining what I know as fact from my time loading and my colleagues that are still loading.

 Thats exactly my point,,, they are separate runs, they are different, 1 for reloaders plated, one for mfg ammo not plated.  I wouldn t expect there to be much other differences but in some cases there are. Which is the original thing I was questioning..  I would think they would just make primers,, but as you mentioned there is some cost cuttings for different applications.
These brass ones seem to seat alot easier,, softer maybe ? 

[DougCarden]

I would imagine the plated cups have a little larger diameter, which might make them tighter in some primer pockets.  

[shred]

7 hours ago, Joe4d said:

 Thats exactly my point,,, they are separate runs, they are different, 1 for reloaders plated, one for mfg ammo not plated.  I wouldn t expect there to be much other differences but in some cases there are. Which is the original thing I was questioning..  I would think they would just make primers,, but as you mentioned there is some cost cuttings for different applications.
These brass ones seem to seat alot easier,, softer maybe ? 

I guess we're arguing the same thing... CCI makes plated primers which they sell to commercial reloaders and home reloaders-- same primer, just in different packaging.  I don't know if they currently use those in their own house-brand ammo, but they used to as I have some CCI shotshells and old Blazer and Speer JHP with nickel primers.  They also make unplated primers they use and sell to commercial loaders, but don't sell to home reloaders.  So yeah, they have primers you can't buy retail, but I still don't think they make a primer specially for home-reloaders.

 

I'd guess Doug Carden is right the plating adds a few thou of thickness that makes them seat harder.

[Farmer]

I have some of the older WW primers that on the packaging states New Finish Better Sensitivity. Basically they are non plated.   You have to figure that the plating adds size but generally makes them slicker. Back in the 80’s CCI primers were larger because of what I figured stamping die wear. You would mash every one getting them to seat properly. When I bought some WW to try they just popped right in. 

[shred]

I remember when WW changed to non-plated.  A lot of suspicious folks and conspiracy theories back then.

Turns out they're cheaper to make and work as well, but it took them a while to be accepted.

 

Nickel-plated still gets used in most 'premium' ammo as there's still some vague perception of superiority, while it probably really is just some more shiny and a bit stiffer.  Corrosion-resistance in consumer ammo doesn't seem to be much of a thing.

 

Dillon and CCI had a little spat around that time because CCI wouldn't work well in their loaders-- either they were a bit big or slightly out of round or the Dillon was off-spec or something, but whatever it is is long fixed.

 

[DougCarden]

I got my Square Deal B in 1989, and the local shop sold me some CCI primers.  That was my first call to Dillon support.  Yeah, CCIs are a little bigger, don't use them.  Sometime in the 1990s CCI changed their primers and they worked well in most presses and here we are.  

[Farmer]

4 hours ago, DougCarden said:

I got my Square Deal B in 1989, and the local shop sold me some CCI primers.  That was my first call to Dillon support.  Yeah, CCIs are a little bigger, don't use them.  Sometime in the 1990s CCI changed their primers and they worked well in most presses and here we are.  

Previous ones were ok, it was just the ones in the beige packs that I had trouble with. The later ones are ok too. That’s kinda why I figured that their stamping die was getting worn. I’ll have to look and see if I still have some to measure and compare with the new ones.