Thomx Posted June 18, 2023 Share Posted June 18, 2023 Hello there, Do you think IPSC will create a new division : Standard Optics, such as USPSA did with Limited Optics ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OpenshooterMclass4lyfe Posted June 18, 2023 Share Posted June 18, 2023 I doubt it. IPSC typically has more sense when making divisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted June 18, 2023 Share Posted June 18, 2023 I'm told there have been discussions along those lines. What the results are/were, I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomx Posted June 18, 2023 Author Share Posted June 18, 2023 29 minutes ago, OpenshooterMclass4lyfe said: I doubt it. IPSC typically has more sense when making divisions. They did Production Optics Light xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrydoc Posted June 19, 2023 Share Posted June 19, 2023 5 hours ago, Thomx said: They did Production Optics Light xD and it lasted no more than a year, can't see Std O ever being a thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perttime Posted June 19, 2023 Share Posted June 19, 2023 (edited) Only if there were a way to integrate Production Optics into it, without hurting current PO shooters. I see people searching for the limits of modding their Production and PO pistols, sooo.... Edited June 19, 2023 by perttime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted June 19, 2023 Share Posted June 19, 2023 I think eventually IPSC will introduce a Standard Optics, but I expect it would be Major/Minor. The box would be the same except for a cutout for the optic. The box limits the size of the magazine, so shooting minor will get you more rounds but at the cost of lower peripheral hits. But I don't think they will bring it in any time soon, rather the decision would be driven by any reduction in Open and/or Standard participation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted June 19, 2023 Share Posted June 19, 2023 A large number of IPSC regions can't reload and dislike Major PF (see: 22LR Handgun, Action-Air, etc) I wouldn't be surprised if they went minor only. Wouldn't prefer it, but wouldn't be surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 There's no doubt that 9mm ammo is far more prevalent than .40 and has more options in terms of velocity and bullet weight. If they went for a Minor Standard Optics then I think it would ultimately lead to a Minor for Standard and Open too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstone45 Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 7 hours ago, BritinUSA said: There's no doubt that 9mm ammo is far more prevalent than .40 and has more options in terms of velocity and bullet weight. If they went for a Minor Standard Optics then I think it would ultimately lead to a Minor for Standard and Open too. As in, they would do away with major altogether? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 3 hours ago, Blackstone45 said: As in, they would do away with major altogether? Production took about 3 years to really take off in IPSC (similar to USPSA) but when it did, the number of people shooting 9mm went through the roof. I think over the next few years Production optics will start draining more people from Open division. It won't happen quickly but the next time an Open shooters gun needs major maintenance they may look towards a cheaper option that still has a red-dot. Those in Standard division will one day start looking at a red-dot as their eye-sight deteriorates, they may go for ProdOptics or they may start a push for Standard Optics. And they may push then for a 9mm only division due to the cost and limited options of .40 ammo. That will further reduce the number of people shooting Major. New shooters will gravitate to the red-dot sights as it's a superior sighting system. So yes, I can see a time when Major gets wiped out, or perhaps they will change the Power Factor criteria: Minor = 125PF with minimum bullet weight 113grn (115) Major = 145PF with minimum bullet weight 145grn (147) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 IPSC has a structure that doesn't require much in the way of member input to do something if enough RDs, no matter how many shooters they represent, want it. (eg: "Light" divisions) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 I think the German RD was pushing that for years in Production as a way to get more people to shoot polymer guns. I think the main reason people shoot CZ and Tanfoglio is that there are more options with guide-rods so its easier to adjust for PF 125-132. Many of the polymer guns use a captured guide-rod and changing out the spring without modifying the rod can be tricky/impossible on some guns. If S&W, Glock, Walther, Canik etc. want to get more involvement in the shooting sports then offer an optional guide-rod design that allows for the springs to be changed easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 3 hours ago, BritinUSA said: I think the German RD was pushing that for years in Production as a way to get more people to shoot polymer guns. I think the main reason people shoot CZ and Tanfoglio is that there are more options with guide-rods so its easier to adjust for PF 125-132. Many of the polymer guns use a captured guide-rod and changing out the spring without modifying the rod can be tricky/impossible on some guns. If S&W, Glock, Walther, Canik etc. want to get more involvement in the shooting sports then offer an optional guide-rod design that allows for the springs to be changed easily. However, changing out springs is allowed now (with some minor caveats) so this is no longer an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstone45 Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 14 minutes ago, Schutzenmeister said: However, changing out springs is allowed now (with some minor caveats) so this is no longer an issue. Again, the rules aren't clear about how much of an aftermarket guiderod you can get away with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomx Posted July 28, 2023 Author Share Posted July 28, 2023 https://www.cbtp.org.br/nova-divisao-standard-optics/ Any idea if the next IPSC general assembly plans to try this division ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 It just started in USPSA ... Limited Optics. I suspect IPSC will wait and see how it fares here then decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyScuba Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 There will always be open shooters. I know many (inc myself) who have PO guns but still shoot open. Though I won’t indoors and shoot revolver instead (I’m weird). Going from a 2011 to a legion is a downgrade no matter how much cheaper you tell yourself it is. up here standard division is going the way of revo, dying a slow death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 On 6/20/2023 at 10:55 AM, BritinUSA said: German RD was pushing that for years in Production as a way to get more people to shoot polymer guns. sponsor interest from polymer gun makers. FIFY. Turns out many big gun makers do not really care about what IPSC (or USPSA) does or doesn't do. Somebody will propose it for the next IPSC GA. What happens after that depends on how well it has been socialized in advance and how many RDs support it. I would expect the rules to be a little different from USPSA LO, if only because they don't have a 141.25 mm mag gauge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomx Posted July 28, 2023 Author Share Posted July 28, 2023 Yeah it probably would be a standard box with a cutout on top of the box Question is : would they make it minor only ? I hope so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 22 minutes ago, Thomx said: Yeah it probably would be a standard box with a cutout on top of the box Question is : would they make it minor only ? I hope so If they are intelligent they would Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 So IIRC we added CO, then IPSC added PO right? Then we added PCC, and IPSC added PCC. My guess, based on how LO is already doing and knowing there has already been talk of it in IPSC it is very likely they'll add a SO division. I think they're more likely to go with major/minor version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 3 minutes ago, RJH said: If they are intelligent they would I think there are countries that have bans on 9mm, and probably other legal issues that may lead them to make choices we wouldn't. I talked to my AD about this a few months back and he mentioned something about it and that they seemed to want major/minor and he thought they wanted us to go first to see how it went lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstone45 Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 3 hours ago, Racinready300ex said: I think there are countries that have bans on 9mm, and probably other legal issues that may lead them to make choices we wouldn't. I talked to my AD about this a few months back and he mentioned something about it and that they seemed to want major/minor and he thought they wanted us to go first to see how it went lol. Which were circumvented by chambering guns in 9x21mm I would like to see minor only for any IPSC Standard Optics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted July 28, 2023 Share Posted July 28, 2023 33 minutes ago, Blackstone45 said: Which were circumvented by chambering guns in 9x21mm I would like to see minor only for any IPSC Standard Optics I don't know much about the worlds gun laws. You should probably contact your countries rep and let him know you're thoughts as I'm sure this is going to come up in the near future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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