Benelli M2 - your opinion on a reliability question related to home defense?

[rc601962]

Hello.  I have a Benelli M2 with a 21" barrel and a Nordic +5 extension.  I took it to the range last week to run drills and practice with Federal 7.5 low base birdshot.    I had multiple failures where the action cycled and it loaded the next round, however the bolt did not move far enough back to cock the gun.  The gun was clean and lubed properly.  

So, I cleaned it again.  I really went after cleaning the barrel chamber thoroughly.  And, I flushed out the recoil spring tube with gun scrubber.  I lubed the trigger assembly and bolt in the right areas.  Nothing looks broken.  The gun has about 500 rounds through it.  I have not experienced this problem before.    

I am taking it to the range Saturday. 

My test:

1.  25 rounds of F127 9 pellet 00 buckshot.
2.  25 rounds of Federal low base 7.5 birdshot

My Question - if the guns runs 100% with buckshot, but fails occasionally with the lower powered birdshot, would you trust it for home defense?

I hate to give up on it.  But, I don't like unreliable guns.  What do you think?

P.S.  I shoot the same Federal 7.5 birdshot all the time at skeet, trap, and clays in my other 28" hunting M2s.  I have never had this happen once in my other M2s.

[ecn515]

Were you shooting fast when conducting these 'drills?' 

 

To me, it sounds like you are out running the gun and pulling the trigger before the bolt is closed all the way. That's relatively common on Benelli's, I can easily out run my gun. Especially with lower powered ammo, slower ammo, slower bolt velocity. 

[twodownzero]

I don't know how much shot is in your ammo that won't cycle your shotgun, but my 1100 won't cycle 1 ounce loads either--it wants 1 1/8.

 

I have never relied on any automatic shotgun for home defense but I have little doubt that any 9 pellet 00 buckshot is going to cycle any gun that isn't broken.

[Nathanb]

3 hours ago, ecn515 said:

Were you shooting fast when conducting these 'drills?' 

 

To me, it sounds like you are out running the gun and pulling the trigger before the bolt is closed all the way. That's relatively common on Benelli's, I can easily out run my gun. Especially with lower powered ammo, slower ammo, slower bolt velocity. 

I second this.  I’ve managed to do it as well

[rc601962]

4 hours ago, ecn515 said:

Were you shooting fast when conducting these 'drills?' 

 

To me, it sounds like you are out running the gun and pulling the trigger before the bolt is closed all the way. That's relatively common on Benelli's, I can easily out run my gun. Especially with lower powered ammo, slower ammo, slower bolt velocity. 

That is an interesting theory I had not considered.  However, if I were outrunning the gun, I would expect to get a “click” with no shot.  I do not think that happened. 

[ecn515]

35 minutes ago, rc601962 said:

That is an interesting theory I had not considered.  However, if I were outrunning the gun, I would expect to get a “click” with no shot.  I do not think that happened. 

 

You won't hear a click if you out run the gun. You will just feel a dead trigger. When out running the gun you release the hammer (by pulling the trigger) before the gun is back in battery. The gun doesn't allow itself to ignite a round out of battery for safety reasons. This is also referred to as 'hammer follow.' 

 

If the gun is cycling enough to eject a spent casing and feed a new round into the chamber, it's cycling far enough to cock the hammer. If you think about it, the hammer sits directly behind the bolt carrier, it has to to strike the firing pin. It is cocked when the action cycles way before a spent case is ejected or a new one is fed into the chamber.

 

Inertia guns are all about timing...

Edited December 3, 2021 by ecn515

[ltdmstr]

I think ecn has it right.  My M2 eats pretty much everything except for the real short, low power slugs, which are a problem in lots of other guns too.  But anything from light target loads to heavy slugs it runs just fine.  Now, on the question of whether a 21" barrel shotgun with +5 extension is a good choice for home defense, I'd say probably not.  But, I guess that depends on what your options are.

Edited December 3, 2021 by ltdmstr

[rc601962]

Ecn, I am convinced you are right.  Thank you very much for taking the time to reply!!!!!!   

 

Would you say the solution is just to run hotter loads?  Would I run this risk with 00 buckshot?

 

Edited December 3, 2021 by rc601962

[kurtm]

With page after page of inertia info on this forum this is what y'all came up with? Does said M2 have a pistol grip stock on it? Is it exhibiting bolt bounce? Is the cam pin ok? Is the cam pin and slot lubed? Are the locking lug recesses clean?........and about 30 more things? I really doubt you are "out running" your Benelli unless you are at .14 splits or less.....and yes that has been quantified, or for some real strange reason "buckshot" makes you pull the trigger slower!

Edited December 3, 2021 by kurtm

[RangerTrace]

My SBE won't run low velocity range ammo consistently, my guess is the loads were too light for your recoil system.

[roxymajor]

I’m with Kurt. I don’t think your out running the trigger. I’ve shot 1000s of rounds with 3 different M1, M2’s at 3gun matches almost as fast as I can pull the trigger.  Benelli’s factory test standard is 1200fps 1 1/8th oz of shot. If your using <1200fps that’s a problem. Since you’re just using for home defense, you should be using high brass anyways with high brass, turkey, buck, or slugs.  I’d start with more powder OR switch up ammo. AA 1300fps 1 1/8 (grey shell) has never failed me in the rain and after a 24 stage match 300+ rounds.  90% of my functioning problems are ammo related. 

Edited December 3, 2021 by roxymajor

[ecn515]

I could be wrong, I'm not perfect. But if you read the initial post, he states his gun is cycling. Ejecting the spent case, chambering the next round, but that his hammer is not cocked. Easy enough to determine as you can see the hammer in the charging handles notch in the receiver.

 

He didn't say that it goes click, as in hammer falls when he pulls the trigger and then doesn't fire, if that were the case I would suspect bolt bounce. 

 

He did say the gun isn't cycling, if that was the case I would suspect mechanical issues or ammo problems. 

 

I have spent a great deal of time testing M2's and various parts and springs, as I'm sure most of you have. While I have never outrun my gun in a match in real conditions, I regularly outrun my gun just dumping ammo testing things at the range or when trying to blaze a plate rack in practice. I'm glad that 1200's and 1300's work great for some of you but the way my gun is currently configured it will not work with anything above 3 dram, but thats not a factory configuration. 

 

Edited December 3, 2021 by ecn515

[rc601962]

ECN has it right.  The gun is cycling and the trigger is dead.  I will be testing it again tomorrow with 00 buck and Federal low base birdshot.  I was firing fast when the malfunctions happened. 

 

The gun is very clean and it is a standard straight stock.  Everything is lubed and the cam pin is okay. 

[Nathanb]

14 hours ago, kurtm said:

With page after page of inertia info on this forum this is what y'all came up with? Does said M2 have a pistol grip stock on it? Is it exhibiting bolt bounce? Is the cam pin ok? Is the cam pin and slot lubed? Are the locking lug recesses clean?........and about 30 more things? I really doubt you are "out running" your Benelli unless you are at .14 splits or less.....and yes that has been quantified, or for some real strange reason "buckshot" makes you pull the trigger slower!

Not all of us know enough about the benelli to have our picture on the wall at the factory. Lol. 

[rc601962]

I took the gun out again today. The guy on the ECN was right. I slowed down on the trigger and I fired 50 rounds of Federal low base loads without one malfunction.  

[5Shot]

Did you try to outrun it with 00 Buck?

[rc601962]

Yes.  I couldn’t do it.

[5Shot]

Then I would say you are good to go.  Mine functions 100% with Gun Clubs, but I have lots of rounds through it.

Edited December 5, 2021 by 5Shot