Steve RA Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 Poor planning ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 3 hours ago, Sliv2 said: Is that causation or correlation? It was not well received by the membership I know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuckinMS Posted April 3, 2018 Share Posted April 3, 2018 2 hours ago, Sarge said: It was not well received by the membership I know that. And survey says.....absolutely correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatJones Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 It was not well received by the membership I know that.The A zone is too small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 1 hour ago, PatJones said: On 4/2/2018 at 6:35 PM, Sarge said: It was not well received by the membership I know that. The A zone is too small. True but it was not about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 9 hours ago, PatJones said: The A zone is too small. ?? "Honey, do these smaller targets make my butt look big?" Aiming is fun, and there is no minimum distance on paper. The complaints I have heard have been along the lines of political correctness being force fed. I think of you told those folks they were not allowed to use turtles then they would flop sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gooldylocks Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 People need to get over their complete and totally ridiculous fear of anything they deem "PC". This is a game, pure and simple. The turtle targets are more challenging, in the spirit of that game. This game has martial roots, just as judo or javelin do. But at this point, it is nothing but a game, and people pretending that it is self defense training are misguided. It does, however, improve your gun handling and marksmanship under pressure, skills that transcend into any armed encounter someone could find themselves in. If you can shoot alphas at will at speed on a classic target, I don't think there would be any issues hitting an attacker in a SD scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 32 minutes ago, Gooldylocks said: People need to get over their complete and totally ridiculous fear of anything they deem "PC". This is a game, pure and simple. The turtle targets are more challenging, in the spirit of that game. This game has martial roots, just as judo or javelin do. But at this point, it is nothing but a game, and people pretending that it is self defense training are misguided. It does, however, improve your gun handling and marksmanship under pressure, skills that transcend into any armed encounter someone could find themselves in. If you can shoot alphas at will at speed on a classic target, I don't think there would be any issues hitting an attacker in a SD scenario. We are entitled to our opinions. For me its less about PC but more about constantly being forced to just take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gooldylocks Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 6 minutes ago, Sarge said: We are entitled to our opinions. For me its less about PC but more about constantly being forced to just take it. And what exactly are you being forced to take in this instance? A different cardboard target for a game, that is more challenging while also improving competitive equity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 7 minutes ago, Gooldylocks said: And what exactly are you being forced to take in this instance? A different cardboard target for a game, that is more challenging while also improving competitive equity? Not being forced to take it currently, but yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 58 minutes ago, Gooldylocks said: It does, however, improve your gun handling and marksmanship under pressure, Not necessarily. I have data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OPENB Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Why didn't they just chop off the upper A/B zone instead of creating the Turtle? Seemed like the easiest thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Getting rid of metrics would be a bad idea. USPSA is about options, anything that limits those options is no bueno. If a match director wants only turtles, that is fine, if he only wants metrics, fine too, a little of both, fine too (not on the same stage though :-). Why anyone would purposely reduce options always dumbfounds me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 2 minutes ago, RJH said: (not on the same stage though :-). Why anyone would purposely reduce options always dumbfounds me Irony anyone ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 4 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said: Irony anyone ? Not by me, just the rules. I personally don't care if they are on the same stage and at a couple of club matches I have even seen it happen. But don't tell anyone their head might explode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 1 hour ago, RJH said: Not by me, just the rules. I personally don't care if they are on the same stage and at a couple of club matches I have even seen it happen. But don't tell anyone their head might explode Hmmm. The reason I was told that you could not mix targets was that back in the days of flintlocks & stone tablets it created a scoring complication when some of the targets did not have a B zone. Since the B zone is being eliminated from the metric target I wonder if the no mix rule will go away? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Just from a OCD standpoint, I think it looks a lot more professional to use all the same targets on a stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Racinready300ex said: Just from a OCD standpoint, I think it looks a lot more professional to use all the same targets on a stage. At least half of the guys I see at matches are wearing multicolored tech wear shirts that probably fit 10 years ago, and pants that might stay up if it wasn't for the weight of the gun and all associated hardware. I think my eyes could tolerate seeing a different target here and there. But if you want 100% this or that, that is cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatJones Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 Getting rid of metrics would be a bad idea. USPSA is about options, anything that limits those options is no bueno. If a match director wants only turtles, that is fine, if he only wants metrics, fine too, a little of both, fine too (not on the same stage though :-). Why anyone would purposely reduce options always dumbfounds me Right? We could use a couple more divisions too. More options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 8 hours ago, PatJones said: Right? We could use a couple more divisions too. More options. Well, we could always stand and shoot bullseye, or if that is too slow how about 5 stages of el prez, cause you know, options suck? PS I would be fine with 1-4 divisions, but then a crap ton of people would cry about fairness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 17 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said: At least half of the guys I see at matches are wearing multicolored tech wear shirts that probably fit 10 years ago, and pants that might stay up if it wasn't for the weight of the gun and all associated hardware. I think my eyes could tolerate seeing a different target here and there. But if you want 100% this or that, that is cool. It just looks nicer, at a club match it may not matter as much. But at majors I think it's worth going the extra mile to make things presentable. Having all the walls build and painted the same, no barrels and little things like that can make a match that much nicer. Having each stage have all the same target looks adds to that. I wouldn't say the whole match needs to have the same target, although I wouldn't have a problem with it. We can't really control what people wear, I don't really notice it much other than the weirdos in kilts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 5 hours ago, Racinready300ex said: It just looks nicer, at a club match it may not matter as much. But at majors I think it's worth going the extra mile to make things presentable. Having all the walls build and painted the same, no barrels and little things like that can make a match that much nicer. Having each stage have all the same target looks adds to that. I wouldn't say the whole match needs to have the same target, although I wouldn't have a problem with it. We can't really control what people wear, I don't really notice it much other than the weirdos in kilts. No worries, you like what you like & I'm sure a lot of folks feel the same way. Any match cosmetics beyond keeping the trash picked up is completely wasted on me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 4 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said: No worries, you like what you like & I'm sure a lot of folks feel the same way. Any match cosmetics beyond keeping the trash picked up is completely wasted on me. I was asked once if it was possible to replace gravel with astroturf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 Good idea if you have an NFL type budget ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuckinMS Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 Astroturf is way too hot. Cushions your body, but will burn you up in the process. Neat and orderly will do, don't really matter if all the mesh is the same color or if the wall construction is identical go me that just cost $$$$$ and makes my pocket hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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