EGW and Lee U dies

[JD45]

I have a simple question. When loading 9mm mixed brass, a few fail a case gauge. Most go in a box for practice only, but some are really oversized. If I get a U die will it make them chamber? I don't need to crimp them much more, just need the whole case sized down.

How to you adjust for that? And what brand should I get?

I'm tired of trashing ammo.

[nevadabob]

Surprised nobody got back to you on this. I use 9mm range brass and Lee dies. Have found a couple of fatties along the way. I bought the EGW u-die to replace the std. Lee sizer. It is made by Lee and seems to work well.

[4me2ply]

I've used the lee U die on my .40 and it pretty much eliminated those rounds that won't case gauge. I don't get more than 1 or 2 at most out of 100. I'm about to start loading major 9 with a Lee U die and expect the same results. I'll say that if you aren't lubing your cases you will probably want to when using the U die. In my opinion it just makes loading that much smoother.

[GregJ]

Not applicable to 9mm, but I use the Lee U die for 45ACP. I got a lot of setback using mixed headstamp brass, and got tired of sorting brass for matches. The U dies fixed that issue.

[Bob DuBois]

Loading on 550 and 9mm on a 650. Spend a little time inspecting mixed brass.

Using a couple of factory plastic trays. Put one in a box and pour a hand full of

brass into the tray in the box most will land mouth up, inspect for trash, berdan

primers cups or splits on the case mouth. Turn the tray side ways and 380's or

Supers that worked there way into the tumbler can easily be spotted.

Use the other factory tray like a primer flip tray and inspect the head stamp's.

Military cases have a smaller case volume and are swagged, remove these

along with any others that are swagged or have a head stamp you don't trust.

Either a U die or a standard Lee sizing die is in station one on every pistol caliber

I load. They will size closer to the extractor groove and tighter than other brands

Lee's carbide ring is closer to the mouth, so come back to station one after setting

the other dies. Use a small strip of paper as a go no go gauge, should pull out

but not go in. You may run a little slower and the press needs to be in time.

May need to put the locking nut on the bottom of the tool head. Don't care

for Lee's nuts and would purchase a set of Dillon nuts.

Lee's seating die has a small knob on top for fine adjustments. For a few bucks

you can send Lee the bullet your shooting and they will cut an insert for your die.

I shoot a varied bullet size and weight in 9mm so had a flat insert made locally.

Keeps OAL tight.

Don't care for the Lee FCD and if used back it off so it just crimps, Use a Dillon

crimp die. FCD was designed to use with Lee's tumble lube bullets and can

affect accuracy.

Always Lube cases, makes the whole process easier on the dies, brass,press

and the operator. Little time inspecting 9mm brass saves lots of time loading

and produces quality ammo. Once you get the feel goes quickly.

I have seen several S-I guns that didn't run start running after going to either

a U die or a standard Lee sizing die. 40 S@W is where the U die really shines.

[Sarge]

. 40 S@W is where the U die really shines.

Does a pretty good job in 9 as well. 9 generally is not bulged like 40 but there is a bunch of 9 out there with thin case walls. I was getting setback with several. The Udie cures it quick. And yes, OP, you will really need to lube cases or the udie will roll material right to the bottom of the case and make it worse than before you sized it.

Get either one of the Udies. They both work. Make sure to set it right down just kissing the plate for maximum sizing down low.

[IDescribe]

A few things:

Lee's U-Die is made for Lee by EGW. They're the same die.

A case gauge is not the end of the story. When the case gauge tells you they're too big. Put them aside, then pull the barrel out of the pistol and see if they'll plunk in the chamber. If they plunk and spin, the case gauge is irrelevant. You might be trying to fix a problem that doesn't actually exist.

Mixed brass. The biggest favor you can do for yourself in terms of accuracy is to sort by headstamp. If it helps this problem as well, so much the better.

The technique Bob DuBois gave you for sorting brass is awesome. I use a .45ACP box for 9mm. The 9mm brass fall right in headstamp down. There's a video of it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpkUnUqMo8U

Good luck.

[Chutist]

A few things:

Lee's U-Die is made for Lee by EGW. They're the same die.

A case gauge is not the end of the story. When the case gauge tells you they're too big. Put them aside, then pull the barrel out of the pistol and see if they'll plunk in the chamber. If they plunk and spin, the case gauge is irrelevant. You might be trying to fix a problem that doesn't actually exist.

Mixed brass. The biggest favor you can do for yourself in terms of accuracy is to sort by headstamp. If it helps this problem as well, so much the better.

The technique Bob DuBois gave you for sorting brass is awesome. I use a .45ACP box for 9mm. The 9mm brass fall right in headstamp down. There's a video of it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpkUnUqMo8U

Good luck.

Funny I'd always heard the EGW die was made by LEE FOR EGW. And that it's to "EGW's" specifications... Never been a definitive answer that they are the "SAME". Don't think I've ever even seen a picture of the EGW and Lee U die's side by side.

Sorting pistol brass by headstamp for action pistol games seems like a completely unnecessary step. I'd bet lunch that at the ranges we shoot at there is no measureable difference in accuracy. I'd have to see DATA to believe other wise.

Edited February 4, 2016 by Chutist

[Sarge]

A few things:

Lee's U-Die is made for Lee by EGW. They're the same die.

A case gauge is not the end of the story. When the case gauge tells you they're too big. Put them aside, then pull the barrel out of the pistol and see if they'll plunk in the chamber. If they plunk and spin, the case gauge is irrelevant. You might be trying to fix a problem that doesn't actually exist.

Mixed brass. The biggest favor you can do for yourself in terms of accuracy is to sort by headstamp. If it helps this problem as well, so much the better.

The technique Bob DuBois gave you for sorting brass is awesome. I use a .45ACP box for 9mm. The 9mm brass fall right in headstamp down. There's a video of it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpkUnUqMo8U

Good luck.

Funny I'd always heard the EGW die was made by LEE FOR EGW. And that it's to "EGW's" specifications... Never been a definitive answer that they are the "SAME". Don't think I've ever even seen a picture of the EGW and Lee U die's side by side.

Sorting pistol brass by headstamp for action pistol games seems like a completely unnecessary step. I'd bet lunch that at the ranges we shoot at there is no measureable difference in accuracy. I'd have to see DATA to believe other wise.

I believe you are correct about the gauges. Both made by LEE for sure but they are not exactly the same. I think the determination was an EGW has more milled off the bottom?

[IDescribe]

You're right. I went too far. Lee's and EGW are both the same manufacturer -- EGW -- but they're the same die in the same way the Sierras and Silverados are the same trucks.

[IDescribe]

Sorting pistol brass by headstamp for action pistol games seems like a completely unnecessary step. I'd bet lunch that at the ranges we shoot at there is no measureable difference in accuracy. I'd have to see DATA to believe other wise.

Chutist, I do not have any data on that of my own because I've been loading for as-accurate-as-possible since before I was loading for action pistol. And I do all my load development with my own Starline brass. This is not a secret, though, for people in disciplines shooting at 50 yards. Sorting by headstamp and case length is a common practice. How a bullet's precision degrades between 25 and 50 is certainly more dramatic than between 7 and 25 -- I promise you I get that -- but until I never miss an A or a plate at 25, I'll take the extra half inch to inch of precision.

That said, I am curious enough to test this out, and I will run some mixed brass tests off of a Ransom. I'll let you know. If you'd be interested in someone else's data, I offer the following article I stumbled upon last year:

Secrets of reloading 9mm

[Sarge]

You're right. I went too far. Lee's and EGW are both the same manufacturer -- EGW -- but they're the same die in the same way the Sierras and Silverados are the same trucks.

you sure? Edited February 4, 2016 by Sarge

[IDescribe]

I fear the edit. Did you go too far?

I mean that yes, same manufacture, no, not exactly the same.

Edited February 4, 2016 by IDescribe

[Sarge]

I fear the edit. Did you go too far?

I mean that yes, same manufacture, no, not exactly the same.

From the EGW website:

Lee Precision, Inc manufacturers the dies to our specifications, meaning these dies are made solely for us.

[Yeti]

LEE manufactures them for EGW to EGW specs (EGW .001 under std). There are slight differences (LEE branded .002 - .003 under) . Helps to maintain good neck tension using range brass with inconsistent case thickness.

Go with EGW. I am sure LEE branded work fine too, but .003 it is a bit much. I use EGW in 40S&W and 9mm.

[IDescribe]

From the EGW website:

Lee Precision, Inc manufacturers the dies to our specifications, meaning these dies are made solely for us.

Ha! Wow. I see now that both of your and Chutist's responses corrected that mistake. I wasn't disagreeing after the fact. I just didn't see your disagreement in manufacture. Just that they were to different specs. Thanks for sorting me out there.

[Southpaw]

I have the Lee U die. It works well and is $10 cheaper than the EGW

[Chutist]

Sorting pistol brass by headstamp for action pistol games seems like a completely unnecessary step. I'd bet lunch that at the ranges we shoot at there is no measureable difference in accuracy. I'd have to see DATA to believe other wise.

Chutist, I do not have any data on that of my own because I've been loading for as-accurate-as-possible since before I was loading for action pistol. And I do all my load development with my own Starline brass. This is not a secret, though, for people in disciplines shooting at 50 yards. Sorting by headstamp and case length is a common practice. How a bullet's precision degrades between 25 and 50 is certainly more dramatic than between 7 and 25 -- I promise you I get that -- but until I never miss an A or a plate at 25, I'll take the extra half inch to inch of precision.

That said, I am curious enough to test this out, and I will run some mixed brass tests off of a Ransom. I'll let you know. If you'd be interested in someone else's data, I offer the following article I stumbled upon last year:

Secrets of reloading 9mm

I'd be interested in the results.

For big match in the past - I'd use new brass so it would be all the same.

That said, the most accurate gun I own is a EGW built Para in .45 and it will shoot tight groups at 50 yards with random range brass reloads!

my gut... no data to back it up, but my gut says consistent OAL and powder drop...running the press "smoothly" and consistency is more significant than brass head stamp. But data would confirm it either way

[earthshine402]

I think use of the U-die can hurt or help you.

I love it for .40, when loading MG 180 JHPs, 180gr Ibejiheads and 200gr Ibejiheads.

However, after switching my press back to 9mm and loading some Bayou 147's (when last batch was Zero JHPs), it seemed the U-die was possibly contributing to crooked bullets - maybe too tight when seating the bullet, perhaps in combination with a not-so-perfect seating plug alignment with the bullet ogive? I don't know.. I switched over to a regular Lee sizer and my issues mostly went away.

[ruleyoutoo1911]

LEE manufactures them for EGW to EGW specs (EGW .001 under std). There are slight differences (LEE branded .002 - .003 under) . Helps to maintain good neck tension using range brass with inconsistent case thickness.

Go with EGW. I am sure LEE branded work fine too, but .003 it is a bit much. I use EGW in 40S&W and 9mm.

I was unsure of the differences in specs other than what EGW states on their site about them being made to EGW specifications, I had read elswhere that the EGW one sizes down lower on the case. I figured 10 bucks more wasn't that big of a deal, so I chose the EGW one as well.

[BeerBaron]

The EGW u die sizes lower than other dies (like dillon) but not lower than any other lee made sizing die.