Making the transition to Open?

[LeviRiley]

Hello All

Currently I have been shooting in limited for the last 2 years and have a blast.

In my humble local club matches In the tri-state area I consistently place top 10%

But lately i find this desire to move over to open division.

For those who shoot open i have a few questions...

How long does it take to get acclimated with a red dot/C-more to become comfortable with it?

Loading 9 Major... It seems to me that people spend considerable amounts of time working out the kinks in there new open gun regarding this load... Is this problem over stated or is it a real challenge?

It also makes me sad the my favorite powder (TightGroup) will no longer be able to be used..

From the outside looking in it seems that open division is the top tier of the sport... Now dont get me wrong, i know there are some fantastic limited and production shooters but looking at it from afar it seems to me at least that if i want to grow and compete in a more competitive game orientated division that open is it.

I started with a CZ shadow then moved to a tac sport in 9mm and .40 then to an STI and finnaly back to a CZ Tac sport..

This being the case i would most likely be purchasing a czechmate for open..

I guess my mane concern is that i will spend a Ton of money only to get the same amount of enjoyment as limited..

Looking forward to hearing from those wiser than I

Thanks in advance

Levi

[Maximis228]

I took the same path as you. I shot Limited (B Class) for about 2 years before diving into open at the beginning of 2015. It took me about 2 months of daily dry fire and weekly live fire to feel comfortable like I did with the limited gun. I went from a Glock 35 to a Custom STI. The change in grip angle really messed with my reloads/finding the dot.

After a solid year+ of work, I should be making Master at this months roll over.

As for the 9 Minor load, I think the problem is over stated. I had no issues working up two loads out of the gate that functioned flawlessly. My main powder is Winchester Autocomp. I also worked up a really good load with HS6. Soon I will try out some CFE Pistol as well.

I will say Open is kind of a different ball game in compared to limited. I would borrow a open rig from a buddy (If possible) to try out a local with. Hard to justify this big of a purchase on just a hunch. You will be doing lots for moving and shooting in comparison to other divisions to stay at the same competitive level.

[zzt]

I takes me no time to acclimate, because I use a dot for everything except Limited. I can't see the front sight on my TS unless I put a diopter insert on my shooting glasses. That's what I do for USPSA. I just bought a second top end for my TS so I could switch between Open and Limited. I've been shooting it in practice, and I'll probably try it out in a competition in April.

Whether you will have more fun in Open is up to you and the courses you shoot at. We have some great Open shooters at the clubs I shoot at; however the course designs remove some of the advantages Open confers. Usually they are set up to accommodate SS shooters and a lot of no-shoots are used to prevent Open shooters from shooting almost everything from the same spot. Also, targets are placed at the end of long courses in such a way that even Open shooters have to traverse the full "path" to access all the targets. The result is the best Limited shooters do as well as the best Open shooters. Even so, Open has a small advantage on these courses, because you can shoot more accurately and from farther away.

Rather than buy a CzeckMate, consider building another top end for your existing TS. It's not that hard to do, and waaay cheaper. Plus you get the same grip and trigger for each. It only takes 15 seconds to change, so you can look at the courses and decide which would be more suitable before you declare divisions.

Edited January 4, 2016 by zzt

[Trent1k1]

I shot Limited for about 2 years (B class) before making the jump to Open. In 3 months shooting Open I made A class. Probably because I spent a lot of time dryfiring. The change in gun/platform was refreshing for me and got me back in the garage dryfiring on a much more regular basis. One of the things I added to my routine, was shooting leaning around Bianci barricades, leaning around walls, shooting while kneeling, shooting prone and huge 180 degree transitions. These all surfaced as problems trying to find the dot which I had to overcome.

Open requires you to be very aggressive. Very. Any hiccups or problems during a stage in Open will cost you dearly compared to other Open shooters. In all divisions you need to be earning points while on the clock. In Open, it will become apparent that you need to take a 30 yard target instead of waiting to get closer just due to time. If you don't have 5+hit factors on every stage, and close to 9+ hit factors on hoser stages you cannot be competitive in the Division. (Obviously it depends on the stage)

Some stage designers will try to 'slow down Open shooters', but all they do is screw the new Production guy. Good shooters and Open shooters (not always the same thing) will still win the stages and often their times will be 75% of the top Limited shooter. It really helps to have some local competition to compare against.

[Hi-Power Jack]

1. How long does it take to get acclimated with a red dot ? Depends on YOU and how much dry fire you do. Some people NEVER get it, others LOVE it.

2. Loading 9 Major... is it a real challenge? No, real easy - easier than loading .40 major, IMHO. When I first got my OPEN 9mm Major, it was tough to load and keep gun running, but not anymore.

3. It also makes me sad the my favorite powder (TightGroup) will no longer be able to be used.. You can use it, but it won't work as well at Major - use it for practice loads.

4. I guess my mane concern is that i will spend a Ton of money only to get the same amount of enjoyment as limited.. Personal decision - what's wrong with Limited? what attracts you to OPEN?

[4me2ply]

Good information here as I too am on the fence of switching from limited to open like the OP. Thanks

[Hi-Power Jack]

See if you can "borrow" an OPEN gun and shoot the bejabbers out of it

(you'll have to pay someone for the ammo, unless they're really nice).

Don't fire 3-8 shots and decide ... try an entire match if you can, or at

least a COF.

Or, get a .22 pistol with a red dot - try that for a while.

[zombywoof]

I've been shooting USPSA for less than 15 months. Shot IDPA for a few months before trying USPSA. After two months of shooting Production and watching the open guns run, I had to have one. I found a used STI and started running. It was a very easy transition for me. I started my competition pistol shooting with Bullseye 30 years ago, so I familiar with dot guns. I shoot in a bowling pin league, so I have lots of dot guns. It's very easy for me to pick up the dot.

[bradsteimel]

Hey, if you're shooting limited, the only real advantage to move to open is 1) maybe 1 less reload on some stages, 2) less recoil, easier on your hands/wrists, and 3) if your eyes are failing you can see a dot easier.

It should be an easy transition from iron sights to a dot, IF you are committed and don't try to hop back and forth.

[Ultimo-Hombre]

Hey, if you're shooting limited, the only real advantage to move to open is 1) maybe 1 less reload on some stages, 2) less recoil, easier on your hands/wrists, and 3) if your eyes are failing you can see a dot easier.

It should be an easy transition from iron sights to a dot, IF you are committed and don't try to hop back and forth.

I would disagree with this. A dot is very different from iron sights. Advantage on longer shots, arguably a disadvantage on very close open targets. Weak hand only is a bummer with a dot! The mag capacity is s non issue to me. On a 32 round course a limited guy and I both have to do one reload. I may get a little more latitude in when I do it, meh.

The recoil is very different. Obviously the open gun is designed to shoot flatter, but that comes at the price of a much more violent rearward hit. After a lot of shooting, the palm of my hand hurts for about 24 hours. Never experienced any pain with limited.

No doubt that an open gun gets many advantages, but they aren't automatic. You will have some sort of learning curve.

Open is sharky waters. Best of luck!

[kneelingatlas]

Levi,

I prefer a horizontal CMore mount like this one:

In my experience it makes finding the dot significantly easier. Loading 9 Major is no problem. As far as the Czechmate goes, it's pretty heavy when compared to a Ti comped 2011:

I'm a big fan of CZs as well, but I prefer my Open guns on the lighter side. For comparison the light 2011 above weighs about the same as a TS. If the weight won't be an issue, you'll probably be happy with the CM, but if you're going to wind up customizing your CM to make it lighter, you'd come out a few thousand ahead starting with a TS.

With regards to Open being a more competitive division: that all depends on your area and who's shooting it; Eric Grauffel dominates whichever division he shoots.

Are you going to like Open more than Limited? Probably, I do But if you're getting burned out there might be something more going on which a shiny new toy won't fix for you.

[LeviRiley]

Awesome responses

I can't imagine a time before the Internet and forums for information.

Took the plunge and czechmate should be here this week.

Sounds like I'm gonna have to spend a lot more time pulling the handle on the old Dillon

Thanks again to all for the info.