IronArcher Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Just because you can buy an expensive gun doesn't mean it's comparable to Open. You could just as easily get a Lim Pro (I got mine for $700) and a $200 Optic, and have less than $1000 in a gun that for all intents and purposes would be just as competitive as the $2000 extreme+Optic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Its the perception thats the issue. An outsider will see a $2000 CO gun and THINK thats what they need to be competitive in the sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 The BOD never gave this division a chance, they should have left the rules as they were for 2016, opened up L2 and L3 matches and see what happened, then make a decision at the end of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strick Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 If you don't want to spend the money on an expensive gun then don't. I have never felt that I am out gunned using a Glock in Prod, the fact is I switched to it after shooting a Witness and CZ supposed hottness. I think the most interesting thing is requiring a dot, that is an interesting twist. My question is......what happens if my dot breaks mid match, can I use my co-witnessed backup sights or back up gun without a dot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 (edited) I love the changes, Production Optics/Carry Optics was never about cost to me, it was only about shooting a production gun with a slide mounted optic and minor ammo. Cost, not important. I can afford any gun I want. I always laughed at the "welfare" remarks Why to go BoD So, right there in your own words it's not about cost. It's about shooting a cheap open gun.Correct in that it was never about cost for me. I laughed every time you posted "Welfare Optics".Production with a dot is nowhere near Open. But you have never opened your closed thinking. 10 rounds versus 30 rounds No Comp versus compensated No Magwell versus Magwell Slide mounted versus Frame Mounted Restriction of holster and mag pouch location versus no restrictions Minor scoring versus Major scoring Ability to buy over the counter ammo versus mandatory reloading or buying of custom ammo Yep, they are exactly the same. Edited January 29, 2016 by zhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 Its the perception thats the issue. An outsider will see a $2000 CO gun and THINK thats what they need to be competitive in the sport. That is an incorrect assumption Go back and read your article about equipment from the 2015 Production Nationals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 So, did the board open CO up for Level 2 and level 3 matches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 So, did the board open CO up for Level 2 and level 3 matches? Yes, and Level 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 I love the changes, Production Optics/Carry Optics was never about cost to me, it was only about shooting a production gun with a slide mounted optic and minor ammo. Cost, not important. I can afford any gun I want. I always laughed at the "welfare" remarks Why to go BoD Then why not shoot open? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 because some people don't like Open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeMartens Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 A slide mounted optic is required, doesn't say you have to use it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 A slide mounted optic is required, doesn't say you have to use it I can see this being gamed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 (edited) I love the changes, Production Optics/Carry Optics was never about cost to me, it was only about shooting a production gun with a slide mounted optic and minor ammo. Cost, not important. I can afford any gun I want. I always laughed at the "welfare" remarks Why to go BoD Then why not shoot open? because open sucks. The guns are loud and expensive and hurt my ears. I have less than zero interest in ever shooting open, but if CO takes off I might give it a try in a year or so. Low recoil, reasonably priced guns that run, lots of reloading, minor scoring.... sounds like fun. Edited January 29, 2016 by motosapiens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 A slide mounted optic is required, doesn't say you have to use it I can see this being gamed. I can see no one caring. If someone really thinks that using cowitnessed irons through an optic gives them an advantage, then they should be free to do so, and also to buy the bridge I'm selling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 I love the changes, Production Optics/Carry Optics was never about cost to me, it was only about shooting a production gun with a slide mounted optic and minor ammo. Cost, not important. I can afford any gun I want. I always laughed at the "welfare" remarks Why to go BoD Then why not shoot open? I have ALWAYS said I have no interest in shooting Open. Loud, tough on arms, and most importantly, I have ZERO interest in loading for Open. I like the challenge that limited capacity creates for stage planning and the importance placed on accuracy. I also like the importance of reloads. But I have said all of this many times on multiple threads before I love the changes, Production Optics/Carry Optics was never about cost to me, it was only about shooting a production gun with a slide mounted optic and minor ammo. Cost, not important. I can afford any gun I want. I always laughed at the "welfare" remarks Why to go BoD Then why not shoot open? because open sucks. The guns are loud and expensive and hurt my ears. THIS^^^^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gooldylocks Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 I love the changes, Production Optics/Carry Optics was never about cost to me, it was only about shooting a production gun with a slide mounted optic and minor ammo. Cost, not important. I can afford any gun I want. I always laughed at the "welfare" remarks Why to go BoD Then why not shoot open? See this post: I love the changes, Production Optics/Carry Optics was never about cost to me, it was only about shooting a production gun with a slide mounted optic and minor ammo. Cost, not important. I can afford any gun I want. I always laughed at the "welfare" remarks Why to go BoD So, right there in your own words it's not about cost. It's about shooting a cheap open gun.Correct in that it was never about cost for me. I laughed every time you posted "Welfare Optics".Production with a dot is nowhere near Open. But you have never opened your closed thinking. 10 rounds versus 30 rounds No Comp versus compensated No Magwell versus Magwell Slide mounted versus Frame Mounted Restriction of holster and mag pouch location versus no restrictions Minor scoring versus Major scoring Ability to buy over the counter ammo versus mandatory reloading or buying of custom ammo Yep, they are exactly the same. Why not shoot open? Because they DON'T WANT TO. I do shoot open and I'm not so close minded as to think that they are even remotely the same, except for maybe on hoser classifiers without reloads (like Fluffy's revenge or something, but even then you still get punished for C/D hits more than in open). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 One thing I am happy about is its still no more than 10 rounds in a magazine after the buzzer, makes it easier for R.O.'s. I hope it does well, a few guys are shooting it at our club. Hope there is enough people for recognition next month at the Florida Open, maybe I can get pictures and an article in Front Sight about C.O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 I'm signed up to shoot it at the FL Open, hopefully with this announcement more will sign up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 (edited) Hope there is enough people for recognition next month at the Florida Open, maybe I can get pictures and an article in Front Sight about C.O. You might want to drop a note to Jake Martens and let him know you are interested in submitting an article, I think he was trying to pull a schedule together for match coverage in 2016, Edited January 29, 2016 by BritinUSA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 I'm signed up to shoot it at the FL Open, hopefully with this announcement more will sign up You could be 1st if your wife doesn't beat you and no one else signs up. I will talk to Jake maybe a husband wife carry optics team with her shooting only because of the new division would be a good story for Front Sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocMedic Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 (edited) Nothing in those rule changes stops me from shooting my Glock 34 MOS with FF3, so I'm happy. EDIT: Oh I can add more grip tape! Edited January 29, 2016 by DocMedic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Nothing in those rule changes stops me from shooting my Glock 34 MOS with FF3, so I'm happy. EDIT: Oh I can add more grip tape! Can I jb weld an optic on my 34? If I classify this weekend will I need an optic on my 34? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 I'm signed up to shoot it at the FL Open, hopefully with this announcement more will sign up You could be 1st if your wife doesn't beat you and no one else signs up. I will talk to Jake maybe a husband wife carry optics team with her shooting only because of the new division would be a good story for Front Sight. Cool, she is not signed up for the FL Open, but she is for the Hoser Match in Gainesville and the North Florida Section match in April Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 Nothing in those rule changes stops me from shooting my Glock 34 MOS with FF3, so I'm happy. EDIT: Oh I can add more grip tape! Can I jb weld an optic on my 34? If I classify this weekend will I need an optic on my 34? I'm pretty sure those rules are effective immediately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Nothing in those rule changes stops me from shooting my Glock 34 MOS with FF3, so I'm happy. EDIT: Oh I can add more grip tape! Can I jb weld an optic on my 34?If I classify this weekend will I need an optic on my 34? I'm pretty sure those rules are effective immediately I will look into it, there are two classifier matches this weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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