rustybayonet Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 This will be my first Progressive press. Brian suggests a 550 for starters, But I do have complacated machine experince. I think I would like a 650. My wife and I shoot over 1000 9mm a month. I also shoot and would like to reload 45acp. is it hard to switch calibers in a 650, case feeder, primers and all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copecowboy22 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Go with the 650. You'll want to eventually anyway. I can change from 45 to 40 in about 10-15 min. Even faster if you use SPP 45. I keep everything on its own tool head. Powder drop and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orangeman711 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Go with the 650 now, you'll be happier in the long run. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustybayonet Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 Thanks! I was headed in that direction and now I know it's the way to go. Money is tight for me so I better go to the roof, or at least the gutters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 When I announced I had ordered a 550 one of the first posts in response said, "I'll give it six months until you want a 650". They were way off. It took just over a year until it hit me. BUT, the 550 will load your monthly 9mm needs quite easily in 2-3 hours. Sure a 650 with all the add ons can do it in an hour give or take but but it's not really NEEDED. You really can't go wrong unless, like you say, you are leaning towards the 650 anyway. For the cost difference you may as well just get what you want from the start. The 650 is not all that complicated if you have any mechanical inclination at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walnut Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I agree with Sarge, I have run two 550's for 20 years, finally got a 650. I could load 1K in two hours on a 550 with regularity, my average speed was 100 rounds in 6-7 minutes. But here is my advice though, 550 cal changes are $45.00 each and you can do it in 5-10 minutes. 650 cal changes are a 15 to 20 min depending on the cam adjustment and cost $78.00. If you time is more important than $ and you like to go fast, the 650 is the way to go, however, you want to load ammo for just two calibers and you want it simple, go with the 550. If you put two people running 550 and 650 side by side and were going to load 500 rounds of 9mm, change cal, load 500 rounds of 45 ACP in one afternoon. The difference in time with the cal switch would only be 15 minutes at most between the two different loaders. Be sure to look at the cost of the machines too. 550 is less than 1/2 the price, you can buy a lot of bullets and powder for the difference. I love them both equality, just each one has its strengths and weakness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youngeyes Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 A lot of the answers to your questions can be found on Brian's store page.He does say that if you're not afraid of a complex machine, then get the 650. Good luck with your Dillon. The 550 or the 650? FAQ Top Although one of the tougher comparative decisions, I seldom recommend the 650 over the 550 as your first progressive machine, and even less as your first reloading machine in general. The 650, w/Casefeeder and auto-indexing, is a complex machine compared to the 550. However, a few exceptions for the 650 might be: You're shooting USPSA or IDPA pistol competition, or are planning to. You're an experienced reloader looking to upgrade from another brand. Plan to use the machine to load one or two calibers in high volume. Are not only tired of messing with your current piece of junk, but in general, would prefer to spend more time either shooting or hanging out with your wife or kids than reloading. Price is not an object. Your're not afraid of a complex machine. You usually know if you are ready for the 650. Almost always, the 550 is a better choice over the 650 because of the reasons mentioned in the Sq Deal vs 550 comparison above.Sill not sure: 550 vs. 650; or 650 vs. 1050Here's another way to help make your decision: How many rounds you will load in one caliber before switching to another caliber? (Apply this logic to ALL the calibers you will ever load on the press.)Rounds you will load before changing to another caliber: 550: 100 - 200+ rounds 650: 1000 - 2000+ rounds 1050: 5000+ rounds It's so easy to switch calibers on the 550 - if you just load 100 or 200 rounds, you won't mind changing to load another caliber. On the 650 however, I wouldn't want to change calibers unless I'd loaded a minimum of 1000 - 2000 rounds. And on the 1050, that number would be 5000 or more rounds, at the absolute minimum.If this will be my first press, is the 650 too complicated? (Answer opens new window in my forum.)Video: Quick, efficient operation on the 550 - quicker than you might think (new window, in my Forums)If you think the 550 is best for you, but feel you'd really like a 650, especially if you have friends with 650's who are pressuring you to buy one - check this discussion in my forum (Weed through all the "buy from Brian" stuff at the beginning to get to tazmo65's post.) (opens new window) If you are leaning toward the 650 (over the 550) because of the Powder Check System - Check this thread in my Forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
safeactionjackson Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Being new to reloading I started with a Dillon 550b purchased from Brian. Initially I was in the same boat as you, but with a single caliber (9mm) and a monthly round count of roughly 2000 rounds. Don't get me wrong, the Dillon 550b is an outstanding press, and does just about everything well. After a few months I found myself reloading 350-400 rounds and hour (comfortable pace, yes you can go faster but YMMV), and spending 5-6 hours pulling a handle plus the time associated with brass preparation. Within six months of purchasing my Dillon 550b I added a Dillion s1050, it was a tough call but seeing how I planned on processing .223 and converting .223 to 300blk.... for me it was a no brainer to go with the s1050 over the xl650 (on press swaging, and priming on the down stroke were huge considerations). That said I recently added a Dillon xl650 to my bench, and have been extremely happy with it. Considering you situation, the need for multiple caliber (9mm/.45), and a fair amount of production for each (1000 per cal)..... the Dillon xl650 would be hands down the best option for you. It is a little more complicated than the 550b, but once you get the hang of it you should be able to produce the same quality ammo as the 550b, in a fraction of the time (roughly half the time). Case feeder is not optional, even though they list it as an option, I have no idea why someone would purchase a xl650 without the case feeder. ~g Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlightMurse Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Do you currently reload at all? If not, please understand that the cost savings for reloading is kind of a moo point. Yes, reloading is cheaper, but that just means that you will shoot a lot more. Your 1,000 rounds a month will turn into at least 2,000 and at that rate you will be wishing you had a XL650 with a case feeder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeinctown Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I bought the 650 without the case feeder. i learned really quick that when you get a good pace going that stopping to put 20 more cases in the tube SUCKS!!! So I did the next best thing... had my kid stand on a chair and feed the tube. LOL Texted my guy on Saturday asking if he had any case feeders in stock. Never did get back to me, so I can only assume he changed his number in the last 9 months. Going to give it one more shot through email, but I'm not going to go too far out of my way to try to give someone $$$ in business. BTW, the 650XL was my first ever press. It is a bit overwhelming at first but within a couple hundred rounds, you will realize just how nice the case feed function works, how well the platform advances, and how much more you can concentrate on the process of verification of powder in the case and proper seating of each bullet. For the price difference, I just couldn't see myself getting the 550 vs the 650. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NatureBoy Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 (edited) I'm relatively new to reloading (~6 months). So far, exclusively .308. Once I had decided that I would buy a Dillon, I entered the "550 or 650" phase you're in now. One life lesson I keep learning, over and over, is that I usually regret going small (cheaper) and rarely regret going big (not cheaper). Trucks, lawnmowers, rifle scopes, power tools, you-name-it. So, I decided at the last minute to switch my order from a 550 to a 650. No regrets. Edited August 18, 2015 by NatureBoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRod61 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I went from a single stage to the XL650 what a difference. I never looked back. If your wife shoot as well. In no time will you be wishing you had a XL650. You won't be sorry with the XL650 Good luck with your decision. HotRod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimitz Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 (edited) buy once, cry once ..... with 2 shooters in the house you'll end up with a 650 eventually and it will have cost you more than simply starting out with one ... Edited August 18, 2015 by Nimitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy1629 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I ran with a 550 for over 20 years and it worked well but a couple of years back I got the 650 and later a bullet feeder. Both presses are great and will do what you want them to do but if you are planning on loading a lot of rounds I would go with the 650. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustybayonet Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 The votes are in and in military terms I would say "ALL THE WAY, SIR" so now for the shopping list. I do have my Rock Chucker from the 1980's which started my going back to reloading. Brian said that would probably be good for small amounts of rifle. I have all my little extras, so that will get me started. The Lyman 49th is on it's way. The spot in the basement is claimed and the bench is almost done. Here's the start of my list. Feel free to add to it, I want to load 9mm and .45 ACP to start. XL650 Case feeder 9mm die set .45 ACP die set As it should be set case feeder plate Quik change set Primer slide? Powder check ? Spare parts kit Spare primer tubes 4lg 4sm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 The votes are in and in military terms I would say "ALL THE WAY, SIR" so now for the shopping list. I do have my Rock Chucker from the 1980's which started my going back to reloading. Brian said that would probably be good for small amounts of rifle. I have all my little extras, so that will get me started. The Lyman 49th is on it's way. The spot in the basement is claimed and the bench is almost done. Here's the start of my list. Feel free to add to it, I want to load 9mm and .45 ACP to start. XL650 Case feeder 9mm die set .45 ACP die set As it should be set case feeder plate Quik change set Primer slide? Powder check ? Spare parts kit Spare primer tubes 4lg 4sm Ditch the powder check and order 8 more tubes of each size! I found a $10 clamp on light at Lowe's that shines right down into the case on my 650. I run ten primer tubes because with a case feeder and bullet feeder it's just dumb to stop and reload primer tubes with all that potential speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copecowboy22 Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Ditto what Sarge said. The only reason I have a powder check is because I bought the press used and it came with it. I use a floor lamp with one of those moveable arms to light the inside of the case (wife was going to throw it out and I repurposed it). I use 5 primer tubes per size. Thats about 30-45 min of loading and then I take a break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
safeactionjackson Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 (edited) I'd agree, the powder check can create a false level of security if you depend on it. I also found it annoying when it held a few flakes of powder each time it entered a case, adding some extra crud to my presses. I do not run one on any of my presses, like others have said.... invest in a decent light and eye ball each case to ensure powder drop. I started with ten of each primer tube size, but have migrated my SPP loading to a Dillon RF100..... which for the record is the cats meow (wish I had one for LPP, but the majority of my loading is SPP based). ~g Edited August 19, 2015 by safeactionjackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 I'd agree, the powder check can create a false level of security if you depend on it. I also found it annoying when it held a few flakes of powder each time it entered a case, adding some extra crud to my presses. I do not run one on any of my presses, like others have said.... invest in a decent light and eye ball each case to ensure powder drop. I started with ten of each primer tube size, but have migrated my SPP loading to a Dillon RF100..... which for the record is the cats meow (wish I had one for LPP, but the majority of my loading is SPP based). ~g There is an inexpensive kit that will convert the spp RF100 to lpp and back... jj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
safeactionjackson Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 I'd agree, the powder check can create a false level of security if you depend on it. I also found it annoying when it held a few flakes of powder each time it entered a case, adding some extra crud to my presses. I do not run one on any of my presses, like others have said.... invest in a decent light and eye ball each case to ensure powder drop. I started with ten of each primer tube size, but have migrated my SPP loading to a Dillon RF100..... which for the record is the cats meow (wish I had one for LPP, but the majority of my loading is SPP based). ~g There is an inexpensive kit that will convert the spp RF100 to lpp and back... jj Yep, but like I said I don't really load enough LLP brass to justify the extra cost and time, just simpler to use the large primer tubes I already have. ~g Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 (edited) $50 and 2 minutes? Ok then... Edited August 19, 2015 by RiggerJJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 The votes are in and in military terms I would say "ALL THE WAY, SIR" so now for the shopping list. I do have my Rock Chucker from the 1980's which started my going back to reloading. Brian said that would probably be good for small amounts of rifle. I have all my little extras, so that will get me started. The Lyman 49th is on it's way. The spot in the basement is claimed and the bench is almost done. Here's the start of my list. Feel free to add to it, I want to load 9mm and .45 ACP to start. XL650 Case feeder 9mm die set .45 ACP die set As it should be set case feeder plate Quik change set Primer slide? Powder check ? Spare parts kit Spare primer tubes 4lg 4sm Say you order the press in 9mm - be sure to get a Caliber Conversion Kit for 45. On the "primer slide" - the 650 comes with everything to load small and large primers. But Dillon does sell a Priming Quick Change Assembly, which allows you to keep each size primer magazine and disc together as an assembly. Over the years I've seen the votes on buying the Priming Quck Change hover around 50/50. Personally, if I could throw some money at something that would save me even just a little time when changing calibers, I would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Miles Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 The votes are in and in military terms I would say "ALL THE WAY, SIR" so now for the shopping list. I do have my Rock Chucker from the 1980's which started my going back to reloading. Brian said that would probably be good for small amounts of rifle. I have all my little extras, so that will get me started. The Lyman 49th is on it's way. The spot in the basement is claimed and the bench is almost done. Here's the start of my list. Feel free to add to it, I want to load 9mm and .45 ACP to start. XL650 Case feeder 9mm die set .45 ACP die set As it should be set case feeder plate Quik change set Primer slide? Powder check ? Spare parts kit Spare primer tubes 4lg 4sm Smart man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NatureBoy Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 (edited) He's a genius, because we are smart and he's doing what we told him to do! Edited August 21, 2015 by NatureBoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustybayonet Posted August 23, 2015 Author Share Posted August 23, 2015 The LT. That follows the book gets a posthumous medal, an LT that listens to his sgt gets home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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