EDA Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Question for the reloading gurus (sorry, long post with lots of numbers, but I want to show the results): I finally got to chrony the rounds I cooked up for my new (used) 9mm Open pistol. It's a customized STI Matchmaster. It has the stock 4.15" no-hole barrel and T2 comp. For this reason, I know it's a bit harder to make Major PF with the shorter barrel. I loaded a progressive series using the following: 124gr Precision Delta JHP, Win SPP, Speer Nickel +P Brass, Loaded to COAL of 1.160. Powder is Winchester Auto Comp - I loaded rounds for each powder load: 7.0gr, 7.1gr, 7.2gr, 7.3gr, 7.4gr. Press: Hornady LNL AP (Go red!). I checked the weight of each powder load even though it's a progressive press to verify accurate powder weights. Here are my velocity results (note - 1331 fps needed to make major with the 124gr bullets; actually 1330 since they are 124.3+gr bullets on the scale). I will skip 7.0gr because too many fell below 1330fps. Location: Albuquerque, NM (Elevation ~5300 ft, 92 deg, sunny, clear). Chrony: ProChrono Digital ~10ft from barrel 7.1gr ------- 1375 1364 1352 1332 1394 1355 1332 1317 (only 1 missed major pf) 1340 1349 Avg: 1351fps (167.5 PF) 7.2gr ------ String 1 String 2 1350 1359 1346 1364 1364 1336 1335 1344 1346 1341 1339 1352 1349 1348 1325** 1345 1359 1390 1337 1337 (only 1 missed major PF) Avg: 1345 Avg: 1351 PF 166.8 PF: 167.6 7.3gr ------- String 1 String 2 1342 1353 1337 1350 1348 1366 1342 1357 1432(!) 1352 1330 1349 1361 1349 1345 1332 1330 1363 1349 1352 Avg:1343 Avg:1352 PF:166.5 PF:167.7 I think the 1432 was a misreading (or there must have been something about that round that I didn't catch, so it is left out of calculation) 7.4gr ------ 1345 1356 1355 1364 1325** 1346 1317** 1344 1344 1360 Avg:1346 PF:166.9 (Interesting, 2 rounds didn't make PF even with a tad more powder. I wonder if I hit the plateau) In none of these tests did the brass or primers show signs of increased case pressure. So based off of this, I am planning on loading 7.3gr of WAC. Now, on a couple of these rounds, I JUST made PF with a 1330fps. If I'd like to get a bit more cushion, what are the suggestions? I know because it is a shorter barrel that these same rounds would easily make major PF in a 5" barrel, but this thing transitions so nicely that I really want to shoot it! Options (and I don't know if some of these would actually make any difference) More powder? Change the COAL? Add a bit of crimp? (I am not adding any right now) Something else I haven't thought of? or Just leave it! (the average of 3 should be fine, I am being too picky about this, etc.) Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshidaex Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Your PF margin is a bit on the low side (if you are targeting 165). You should target a pf of 170 to give you a cushion if ambient conditions aren't ideal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDA Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 Suggestions to do so? I don't think adding powder will help as I think I have hit a plateau there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Well, it is a shorty in 9. That's a tough combo. You need to get up to over 170 for a cushion as well as to work the comp. 166 isn't going to cut it. I have maxed out with WAC before. Velocity stopped climbing and groups blew out. But I must say I don't think it should have maxed out on you at only 166ish. Maybe you could try sticking a no shoot target on top of the screens of your chrono and retest? I always do just that with my PCD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Try a shorter OAL that can increase velocity too. I recently played with my OAL due to feeding issues and ended up running .2 grains less powder with the same PF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDA Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 Thanks for the suggestions. We put the plastic cover over the chrony and I was checking other rounds in this gun and my .40's and they all seemed accurate, so I think the numbers were fine. I could try to push the powder a bit more, but I am hesitant as it seems to have started to plateau. I will shorten the OAL a bit (I know I have a bit of room between the top of the powder and the bottom of the round). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcs Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 I don't think you should go any shorter with that powder. Try HS 6. You should be able to dial in a load in the 170s with room to spare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDA Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 I can't locate HS6 and have a good amount of WAC. Anyone load over 7.5gr of WAC? All the recipes I can find max out at 7.5gr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 I can't locate HS6 and have a good amount of WAC. Anyone load over 7.5gr of WAC? All the recipes I can find max out at 7.5gr I was 7.4 with a 121 bullet and got 174 PF. But that was with a full size gun. I run 7.8 with 115's but do not try that with a 124 in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 It only takes 7.3gr of WAC under a 124 to make 177pf in my CZ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcc7x7 Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 (edited) I went with Blue Bullets (coated) 125gr Made 170 Pf with 6.8 grs. WAC, Fed SRP, 1.170 COL May be an option if you have a lot of WAC Seems to be Ok with the coating Hit a1000 rounds with it over the week end at a 208 round match. Has some stuff in the comp that comes out with a rounded screw driver Key thing for me is I've got the WAC as you do and the bullets are available I've also shot Bayou's and SnS hytek coated out of my 38SC with good results Got about 4000 rounds total of hyteck and blue bullet coated through the 2 guns with no problems to date Shot in conditions from about 40degress to 85 Coated seem to need less powder to make PF Just a thought for you to meditate on, not claiming its the answer you need Edited June 29, 2015 by jcc7x7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDA Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 What OAL's are all of you running? The seller of the gun told me he used 1.130 with 7.4gr WAC and 115gr bullets. I wanted to give it a tad more hence I loaded to 1.160 with the 124gr. Maybe I'll make a progressive series where I load shorter to 1.155, then 1.150, and maybe 1.145. I check the brass after each string so I should be able to ID any signs of excessive case pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 What OAL's are all of you running? The seller of the gun told me he used 1.130 with 7.4gr WAC and 115gr bullets. I wanted to give it a tad more hence I loaded to 1.160 with the 124gr. Maybe I'll make a progressive series where I load shorter to 1.155, then 1.150, and maybe 1.145. I check the brass after each string so I should be able to ID any signs of excessive case pressure. While your doing all of that put a target down range so you can kill two birds with one stone. Put an aiming point on it and take dead aim every shot through the chrono. You will find the adjustments you make to the loads will affect accuracy, group size, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDA Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 Great idea, thanks Sarge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S&W686 Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 I have a Freedom Gunworks 9mm Open Gun with 5 " KKM barrel, 3 poppel holes, and Cheely Comp. My load is 7.1 grs. AutoComp, Precision Delta 124gr JHP, OAL 1.165 and making 173 PF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 You seem to have inconsistent chrono data ... I would do a few things a little differently, and see what results you get: 1. Set your powder charge for 7.3 gr and leave it = let the powder flow thru your reloader - don't measure each charge 2. get a larger sample size thru the chrono - try 25 rounds 3. If I can get 25 rounds thru the chrono so that they ALL make PF, I'm happy BTW, are you planning on shooting major competitions? If you are, then I'd also try to get that PF up a little bit above 167, if you can. If NOT, I'd leave it at 7.3 gr and work on reliability and accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDA Posted July 5, 2015 Author Share Posted July 5, 2015 Thx for the suggestion. I plan to eventually shoot b level 2 matches with it. I set my powder drop to 7.3gr and have loaded about 20 rounds each at OAL from 1.140 to 1.150 to see if there is any difference too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcc7x7 Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 1.170 oal 6.8 AutoComp Fed srp 125 blue bullets 170pf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glock26Toter Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I'll throw in a few things I've experienced with this same type of load. I had two guns, one with a 24 in 1 twist barrel, and one with a 32 in 1 twist. It's been a while so forgive me if I have something wrong in the barrel specs and also can't remember which was which. Anyways, both are shorties with no holes. I was shooting 7.3 of WAC in one of them and when I got the other one it was super hot. With the same load I was at 185pf. All this was with 124gr and I ran them short... maybe 1.15 or so. (long story as to why I got Round Noses running that short.. don't do it) So, I tell that story as maybe you'll find the rifle twist might have something to do with you loading up that combo but getting short on PF. I've since re-barreled the "slow gun" and was shooting 7.3grains of WAC on the 124 rounds for a long time in both guns and making 170pf no sweat. I believe I still ran them very short and while I think I may have been compressed, I never blew anything up. So maybe you'll be fine getting into the 7.6 territory. Load a few up, and then unload them and see if the powder falls out. It won't if you compressed it even a little bit. (I've done that too) And one more thing. I've never personally seen an appreciable change from .1 gr change in powder. I always load in .2 increments and find that .2 gr changes nets me about 50fps (averaged out) with all other things unchanged. I don't know if I helped or just spewed, but there you go. oh, now I shoot 7.6gr WAC OR 8.3gr HS-6 with 115gr JHP's and run 170PF consistently in both guns with 1.125 OAL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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