Favorite loads for 77s 1-8 twist

[openclassterror]

Just looking for a starting point. I finally wore out my Noveske barrel and the replacement doesn't like 55s like the old one did. Here is the skinny-

16" barrel, mid gas, 1-8 twist

Nosler 77s (or Hornady 75s, I have a few hundred of those to try as well)

I have on hand Varget, H335, H322 for powder. Lots of primer choices.

Lake City brass, fully prepped (not reamed primer pockets or turned necks. I am only anal-retentive on my benchrest guns )

If these components won't get me there, what do I need? I have never had to go to heavies for 3gun 'til now. 69s are as high as I have ever gone.

Thanks!

Edited March 25, 2015 by openclassterror

[Fordfan485]

24 gr of Reloader 15, Remington 7 1/2 primers, mixed brass, OAL 2.25in. This load is good out to 600yds out of my 20" 1 in 8 223 Wylde Rock River Arms NMA2.

[bwikel]

Hornady 75gr HPBT

24.0 gr Varget

COAL 2.295"

Base to Ogive 1.89"

2650 fps

18" JP Wylde 1/8

[triggerman300]

23.6gr of TAC runs great in my Noveskes (14.5, 16, 18...all 1/7 twist) with a M41 primer, LC brass, mag length, with a Nosler 77gr CC.

[openclassterror]

Great...... I haven't seen Reloder 15 or TAC in about 6 months . Thanks guys, keep em coming!

[michael1778]

Tom, it doesn't like the 68 or 69 grain bullets either?

I'm glad you started this thread, BTW.

[openclassterror]

I haven't even tried 69s yet. I just have a pile of Nosler custom comp 77gr bullets I bought for the last barrel and never used because it liked the cheap 55gr burner ammo. I am open to trying, but I only have a couple hundred of those and probably over 1k of the 77s

[Mthomas0001]

www.reloadingunlimited.com has TAC, just lowered their prices. I use 23.5 grains TAC loaded to about 2.245-2.250 with a SMK 77gr. Fantastic load out of both 16" and 18" Barrels - 1-8" twist.

[bbates]

23g 8208 w 75g hornys

[michael1778]

I haven't even tried 69s yet. I just have a pile of Nosler custom comp 77gr bullets I bought for the last barrel and never used because it liked the cheap 55gr burner ammo. I am open to trying, but I only have a couple hundred of those and probably over 1k of the 77s

Then there you go. I wasn't sure if the 69s had sucked out of that barrel also or if it was about what was on hand. You've already paid for those so yeah.....use them!

Reloading seems interesting but the component shortages, especially powders these days, is a huge turn off.

The TAC at reloadingunlimited.com is $65 more for 8 pounds than Natchez, for example. Of course, they actually have some in stock. Natchez is out like so many other places. So, the economics of handloading can get all fouled up too.

<sigh> None of this stuff is easy.

[Dan Sierpina]

Have you tried some 55 Ballistic Tips, or 55 V Max bullets? My Lothar Walther barrel likes 23.5 of Varget with Sierra 77's. But I shoot either of the above 55's even at Rocky Mountain.

[openclassterror]

No I haven't Dan. I am trying to make a combo with stuff I have. I have about 6lbs of H335, but I think it is beyond its efficient zone with heavy bullets. I always have Varget because I use it for the .308. I only have maybe 80 of the Nosler 55BTs. I am afraid it might like em and then I will have to buy more. I would rather use my cheap 55s for anything under 150 yds but keep the rifle zeroed for heavies. In our neck of the woods most matches have targets to 350 or 400 yards. The 2-3 MOA I am getting from 55s means 3-4 extra shots per target. Anything in front of the 100 yard berm gets 55s, which is what my offset red-dot is zeroed with.

[CmbtEngr]

77gr Nosler Custom Comp bullet

LC brass

23.9gr Varget

CCI BR4 primer

2.25" COAL

18" Noveske 5.56mm barrel, 1:7

2547ft/sec

0.77 MOA at 100yds (best test group). Have used out to 500yds in 3-Gun matches with good success for over a year.

Edited March 26, 2015 by CmbtEngr

[Dan Sierpina]

Tom,

My load of 23.5 of Varget seems to be the light one here. You won't get much more than 24.0 of Varget into a .223 case, even 23.5 is slightly "crunchy" when seating 77's to mag length. I use a long drop tube when charging also.

[bwikel]

I load the hornady 75gr really long (2.295") and they are still a little crunchy at seating with 24gr of varget.

[openclassterror]

Nice, guys. I will work up some ascending loads starting at about 23gr of Varget and see what I get. I have been running some pistol loads that are essentially flush with the case mouth, so a little crunchy sounds good to me At least they wont spill when my Dillon indexes like my 9major loads haha

[Shooter115]

I just recently worked up a load for the Nosler 77gr CC's. Finally settled on 24gr of TAC with CCI BR4 primers at an OAL of 2.250. Was easily sub MOA in both an 18" 1/8 twist barrel and a 16.5 1/7 twist. Trouble is now I'm out of TAC too. Word of caution......this was starting to flatten primers pretty good, but it's where I really hit the accuracy node. Velocity out of the 18" barrel was right around 2750fps and 2690 out of the 16.5.

Edited March 26, 2015 by Shooter115

[mic2377]

I have used 23.5 gr of Varget under either a Hornady 75 BTHP or Nosler 77 CC with good success, with an OAL = 2.250. I would recommend CCI-450 primers - I have had one or two CCI-400's pierce with this load, even though they were not flattened. As the BR4's are the same cup thickness as the 450's, I would imagine they would work just as well.

This was from a Nordic 18" 1/8 twist barrel.

[dauntedfuture]

The standby powders for 69 and 77 and heavier bullets are on the slower side to get the velocity that you need. 748 or H335 is about as fast as you want to go for a 69g. For the 77g the "go to" load is 24-24.5g RL15 in a LC case. Varget works just as good or better and is not temp sensitive. I have been shooting 77g with TAC and it has shot well in all my match and 3G rifles. I shoot 24.2 with a rem 7.5 primer in WCC 1x cases that have been trimmed. I suspect you can get H335 or H332 to work but you are not going to get the velocity you want and or need. I have had best results with rem 7.5 primers in heavy bullet loads.

Edited March 28, 2015 by dauntedfuture

[openclassterror]

Finally made a quick run to the range this afternoon during a break in the rain. 77gr Nosler CC ran at 2628 fps avg with 24.0 gr Varget in Rem .223 cases. Avg group size for 5 groups was 1.03 MOA under windy (+/- 10mph gusts) conditions. No pressure signs evident. I ran a string at 23.5gr and 23.8gr of powder to watch for overpressure instead of just going for it. Minus one weird aberration that clocked 130fps fast and dropped 1.5" below its group, average of all groups from 23.5 to 24.0gr was 1.1 MOA. Seems like a stable spot to be. I would like a little more velocity so the ballistics match my Vortex Razor JM-1 reticle, but I didn't have the guts to try for more with the little amount of time I was able to escape the shop. I shouldn't feel guilty with 68 hrs under my belt already this week, but sometimes a couple hours of me time needs to happen

Edit- I should mention that a buddy of mine was shooting at the next bench over. His rifle has a Black Hole ( same 1-8 poly twist as my Noveske) barrel. After seeing my groups he wanted to try a couple in his rifle. At 100yds he got approx. 6" horizontal dispersion and visible keyholes. I have NO explanation for this. He went back to his 55grainers and got a 1.5 MOA group in a stiff cross-wind, with less than 3/8" vertical dispersion. I have never seen a 1-8 twist keyhole 77s before. Anyone else seen this phenomenon?

Edited March 28, 2015 by openclassterror

[billdozer]

23g 8208 w 75g hornys

Max load is 22.7 be careful recommending going over. If he has a tight chamber, it's gonna cause problems...not blow up your gun problems, but flat primer, and extraction problems.

[Dan Sierpina]

Zero your rifle with the accurate load at the longest distance you have acces to. Matching the reticle exactly is impossible. It's 3 gun, not benchrest.

[dauntedfuture]

a 5 shot 1 MOA group is a good honest group for any 3G rifle. I am always highly skeptical of most any claim of better then .5 MOA. Remember that we are shooting low power scopes. What is more important is the consistency of your ammunition, can you shoot a 1 MOA group this week and next AND does it print in the same place? One can put a 20X scope on a rifle and chase smaller groups but its usually not worth it.

Regarding velocity with heavy bullets in .223, experience tells me that more often then not if you are not happy with the velocity you are getting you need to try another more powder or another powder.

I did some brief experimentation with MR2000 before I left and there appears to be some promise of higher velocities. Ill report when I can.

Remember that not all heavy bullets are created equal, the H68 eats more case capacity then the 69 SMK. The H75 eats more then the 77 SMK or NOS and has a slightly higher BC. Weight alone is not everything, you can use more powder with 80g+ bullets because more of the bullet is seated out of the case. As always use caution and remember that a blown primer gumming up the works will ruin your day for sure.

[mic2377]

2000 MR has good potential - it is like RL-15 in burn rate, but extremely dense and high energy, allowing more to be fit into the case. This is one of the few powders that I have really experimented with over factory max in the 223, and seen ZERO pressure signs. I was using Hornady 75 BTHP's, with powder charges I will not mention, but will say they were >100% load density. Unfortunately I did not chrono these. Accuracy was OK, in the 1.0-1.2 MOA range.

It has provided EXCELLENT performance and velocity in 308, with both light and heavy bullets. In fact, it was capable of matching .30-06 velocities from a 22-24" barrel from an 18" barrel AR in 308. The one caveat was that accuracy was very "hit or miss" across the load data range, IE is was less consistently accurate or tolerant of different load ranges.

[Flatland Shooter]

Edit- I should mention that a buddy of mine was shooting at the next bench over. His rifle has a Black Hole ( same 1-8 poly twist as my Noveske) barrel. After seeing my groups he wanted to try a couple in his rifle. At 100yds he got approx. 6" horizontal dispersion and visible keyholes. I have NO explanation for this. He went back to his 55grainers and got a 1.5 MOA group in a stiff cross-wind, with less than 3/8" vertical dispersion. I have never seen a 1-8 twist keyhole 77s before. Anyone else seen this phenomenon?

For distant targets, I run 77 gr Nosler CC JHP over IMR 8208xbr powder at velocities that nearly match your loads. I've shot them in guns with 16" and 18" Black Hole Weaponry barrels without any problems like your friend. That load using an 18x scope the 18" gun will consistently shoot under 1/2" groups at 100 yards.

Has he seen tumbling with any other ammo?