Alliant E3 for Newbies

[azgoose]

Actually I had purchased one of the 8# jugs of Ramshot Comp. I just checked since I knew you had mentioned it and wanted to give everyone an update since they update their site infrequently. I'm interested in trying some, but only if I can get it reliably.

[2MoreChains]

I was fortunate to find a few pounds of e3 locally and based on information I found on this forum I worked up some pretty nice loads in 9mm, .40SW, and .45acp. I've come to really like this powder and its nice to have an alternative to N320 (9mm and .40) and Clays (.45) that up until now have been my main goto powders.

For 9mm I like that it fills the case above the halfway mark even with loads in the 3.1 to 3.8 range depending on my bullet. I need to do some tasters choice testing between my e3 and N320 loads to compare the felt recoil but they felt pretty soft at 132-137 PF. I also like how many loads I can get out of 1 lb of e3.

Thanks for all the info! Now hopefully we can get some mo!

[ZackJones]

I was fortunate to find a few pounds of e3 locally and based on information I found on this forum I worked up some pretty nice loads in 9mm, .40SW, and .45acp. I've come to really like this powder and its nice to have an alternative to N320 (9mm and .40) and Clays (.45) that up until now have been my main goto powders.

If you don't mind how about sharing your load info with us. So far I've loaded .40 and .45 but eventually I'll probably do some .38 Special and 9mm so load data others are using always helps.

[mjohn]

I guess it is too early to tell if it is temperature sensitive. What type of powder is it? Single based, double based, ball, flake granular?

[dave33]

I guess it is too early to tell if it is temperature sensitive. What type of powder is it? Single based, double based, ball, flake granular?

It's a double based flake powder. Based on info here it's not temp sensitive at all.

[2MoreChains]

I was fortunate to find a few pounds of e3 locally and based on information I found on this forum I worked up some pretty nice loads in 9mm, .40SW, and .45acp. I've come to really like this powder and its nice to have an alternative to N320 (9mm and .40) and Clays (.45) that up until now have been my main goto powders.

If you don't mind how about sharing your load info with us. So far I've loaded .40 and .45 but eventually I'll probably do some .38 Special and 9mm so load data others are using always helps.

I posted my .40 and .45 load data in those sub forums, but guess I haven't for my 9mm. Not at home where I have it written down but going off memory:

Out of a Glock 34:

124 gr FMJ (demilled) with 3.8 gr e3 resulted in 132 PF. Felt very similar to my load with this bullet and 4.0 gr N320.

147 gr Precison moly FP with 2.9 gr e3 resulted in 132 PF but was really sooty.

147 gr Precision moly. FP with 3.1 gr e3 resulted in 137 PF. Nice and clean

147 gr Precision moly FP with 3.3 gr e3 resulted in 141 PF. Nice and clean.

[dave33]

Please keep us posted on your progress with e3 in 9mm. That's one load I will probably work up for my son that just bought a Glock 19. As soon as I can get some more .38 Special projectiles I'm going to start working up a load for my revolvers with it.

Made it to the range yesterday before the ice storm hit and did a little more shooting with e3. I'm switching from traditional lead to coated lead projectiles and have it narrowed down to either thebluebullets or bayous in 147 gr most likely. With 147 gr I have found 3.36 gr of e3 to be the cleanest and most accurate, today I tried that as well as 3.58 gr of e3, didn't see any improvement, if anything accuracy may have been slightly less. Spent primers didn't look bad, but I'm not taking it any further. Interestingly the recoil is virtually the same from 2.9 gr to 3.5. All rounds shot out of an XDM 5.25.

[Justsomeguy]

Please keep us posted on your progress with e3 in 9mm. That's one load I will probably work up for my son that just bought a Glock 19. As soon as I can get some more .38 Special projectiles I'm going to start working up a load for my revolvers with it.

Made it to the range yesterday before the ice storm hit and did a little more shooting with e3. I'm switching from traditional lead to coated lead projectiles and have it narrowed down to either thebluebullets or bayous in 147 gr most likely. With 147 gr I have found 3.36 gr of e3 to be the cleanest and most accurate, today I tried that as well as 3.58 gr of e3, didn't see any improvement, if anything accuracy may have been slightly less. Spent primers didn't look bad, but I'm not taking it any further. Interestingly the recoil is virtually the same from 2.9 gr to 3.5. All rounds shot out of an XDM 5.25.

When you say you didn't notice any IMPROVEMENT and then mention accuracy I assume that is what you were looking for. I would be interested in any velocity differences at that point since I acquired some e3 last fall but the weather here turned on me and shooting outdoors has become unpleasant. What I am looking for, data wise, is LINEARITY of e3 at different pressure/velocity ranges to see where it might be turning "squirrely" or less linear... that is, at what point does an increase in powder NOT produce a more or less expected increase in velocity. So if you can post your velocity results from the last test at nearly 3.6grns of e3 in comparison with those obtained with it at 3.36grns that would be helpful to me.

Thanks.

Edited February 1, 2014 by Justsomeguy

[Shadowrider]

Please keep us posted on your progress with e3 in 9mm. That's one load I will probably work up for my son that just bought a Glock 19. As soon as I can get some more .38 Special projectiles I'm going to start working up a load for my revolvers with it.

Made it to the range yesterday before the ice storm hit and did a little more shooting with e3. I'm switching from traditional lead to coated lead projectiles and have it narrowed down to either thebluebullets or bayous in 147 gr most likely. With 147 gr I have found 3.36 gr of e3 to be the cleanest and most accurate, today I tried that as well as 3.58 gr of e3, didn't see any improvement, if anything accuracy may have been slightly less. Spent primers didn't look bad, but I'm not taking it any further. Interestingly the recoil is virtually the same from 2.9 gr to 3.5. All rounds shot out of an XDM 5.25.

When you say you didn't notice any IMPROVEMENT and then mention accuracy I assume that is what you were looking for. I would be interested in any velocity differences at that point since I acquired some e3 last fall but the weather here turned on me and shooting outdoors has become unpleasant. What I am looking for, data wise, is LINEARITY of e3 at different pressure/velocity ranges to see where it might be turning "squirrely" or less linear... that is, at what point does an increase in powder NOT produce a more or less expected increase in velocity. So if you can post your velocity results from the last test at nearly 3.6grns of e3 in comparison with those obtained with it at 3.36grns that would be helpful to me.

Thanks.

I did some testing in .38 Short Colt. For all intents and purposes we can consider this a 9mm case with a rim. I was loading 160 RN Bayous which is well over the normally seen bullet weights in 9mm. I took it to 146 PF looking for "where it might be turning "squirrely" or less linear...". I was looking for exactly what you are talking about because I too wanted to know how "forgiving" this powder might be. I never found it which tells me that at least with this combination and in this particular gun it's very forgiving compared to other powders of similar burn rate. The chrono data was very linear and I just started to get some primer flattening at that point. That was way past where I intended to go with that load so I didn't push it any further. It seems to me that a lot of people are afraid of it because of it's placement in the burn rate chart. That's understandable and bear in mind this is only one cartridge, one gun, one bullet weight, one powder lot. So it is far from scientific and set in stone. It is a fast powder and should be treated as such, but it's looking really good so far.

[dave33]

Please keep us posted on your progress with e3 in 9mm. That's one load I will probably work up for my son that just bought a Glock 19. As soon as I can get some more .38 Special projectiles I'm going to start working up a load for my revolvers with it.

Made it to the range yesterday before the ice storm hit and did a little more shooting with e3. I'm switching from traditional lead to coated lead projectiles and have it narrowed down to either thebluebullets or bayous in 147 gr most likely. With 147 gr I have found 3.36 gr of e3 to be the cleanest and most accurate, today I tried that as well as 3.58 gr of e3, didn't see any improvement, if anything accuracy may have been slightly less. Spent primers didn't look bad, but I'm not taking it any further. Interestingly the recoil is virtually the same from 2.9 gr to 3.5. All rounds shot out of an XDM 5.25.

When you say you didn't notice any IMPROVEMENT and then mention accuracy I assume that is what you were looking for. I would be interested in any velocity differences at that point since I acquired some e3 last fall but the weather here turned on me and shooting outdoors has become unpleasant. What I am looking for, data wise, is LINEARITY of e3 at different pressure/velocity ranges to see where it might be turning "squirrely" or less linear... that is, at what point does an increase in powder NOT produce a more or less expected increase in velocity. So if you can post your velocity results from the last test at nearly 3.6grns of e3 in comparison with those obtained with it at 3.36grns that would be helpful to me.

Thanks.

I was shooting at an indoor range, so no chrono data. I was looking for the best combo for accuracy for my particular pistol for some of the competitions I shoot. Everything I have ever seen about e3 has it being a very well behaved powder. I do plan to chrono as soon as I can though.

[nevadabob]

Went out to the range this morning, here are my e3 results for 9mm loaded with the Lee Pro Auto Disk:

Auto Disk #53, 3.3 grns, 0.357 124 lrn Darda's (non-shouldered) @ 1.105 COL via S&W M&P full size = 984 fps.

Auto Disk #57, 3.5 grns, 0.357 124 lrn Darda's (non-shouldered) @ 1.105 COL via S&W M&P full size = 1038 fps.

Auto Disk #53, 3.3 grns, 0.356 125 lrn SNS (shouldered) @ 1.125 COL via S&W SD9VE = 987 fps.

Auto Disk #57, 3.5 grns, 0.356 125 lrn SNS (shouldered) @ 1.125 COL via S&W SD9VE = 1043 fps.

In each category, the spent brass ejected well, landing around 3-4' from me. Slide action was great, no stovepipes or FTE's. Recoil was very manageable with each load. Next I'll be looking for any signs of leading as I shoot more rounds. So far, e3 is a great 9mm powder.

[stickboy44]

loaded some E3 today and I'm impressed with the way it shoots and feels

out of a G34 3.6gr berrys 124gr.bullet ola. 1.13 130 pf

[nevadabob]

Update to post # 86...didn't see an "edit" tab...Back out to the range yesterday shooting the e3 loads. I found the 3.3 grains loads a pinch too soft whereas the 3.5's were adequate. Looks like the 3.5's will be the keeper loads. I can't imagine going any higher without running into case fill issues.

[Idoktr]

Anyone try the E3 for 38 super comp yet????

[Ramag]

I tried E3 today in 9mm, and if recoil and ejection distance is any indication, the E3 I have it is faster than the N320 I have. I used 3.7 grains E3 with a Berry's 124 HBRN, and I got good strong ejection in a Glock 19. 4.1 grains of N320 with the same bullet and OAL resulted in fairly weak ejection and some BTF. No indication of overpressure on the brass or primers.

Hopefully when the weather improves I can use a chronograph and put some numbers to it.

Edited March 2, 2014 by Ramag

[bowenbuilt]

3.8 of e3 with your bullet puts all of my guns safely into 130 PF. 4.1 will do 1200 FPS with your bullet is getting very close to the max in 9mm.

Edited March 3, 2014 by bowenbuilt

[nevadabob]

I have a spare disk set for the Lee Pro Auto Disk setup. #57 was giving me 3.5 grns per throw. I took a drill bit and "lightly hogged out" the #57 cavity. Now I'm getting 3.7 grns using the modified #57. I also attached a Wal-Mart $7 aquarium pump to the powder reservoir to keep the e3 flakes dropping consistently. Chrono results reveal 1060 fps shooting 124/5 lead via M&P and SD9VE.

[lknbigfish]

Thanks for all the great info!

[ZackJones]

I posted this in another thread but I'll add it here just in case. My loads (2.7 - 2.9g of e3) with 180g Bayou Bullet made 135 power factor at the Alabama sectional match this past weekend.

Edit: using 180g Bayou Bullets.

Edited March 18, 2014 by ZackJones

[RH45]

I assume you are running 180 grain in .40 caliber?

[ZackJones]

I assume you are running 180 grain in .40 caliber?

Yes. I edited my post to include that information.

[ZackJones]

I finally got around to trying out the Lee perfect powder measure with e3. I like it! It took me a little while to dial it in but once I did I dumped 10 throws into the pan and weighed it and it was 28 grains as expected. I still weigh the 1st, 11th, 21st, 31st, and 41st cases as I charge them to make sure it's throwing consistently and so far so good. It sucks not charging on the press but I believe I can expand and charge as two separate steps faster than I could weigh every single charge when using the auto disk method.

My neighbor has one of the RCBS ChargeMasters and I'm going to take a bottle of e3 over to his place and see how well it dispenses the powder. They're expensive but if I can dial in an amount and get that amount every time it will be worth the expense.

[MarkCO]

I tried in the Chargemaster, not worth the time and effort as it throws no better than a volumetric. I think since this powder is so fluffy.

OTOH, I finally threw my CH in the trash. Kept the scale. I can throw charges faster and more consistently with a volumetric and trickling in the last few grains for my rifle charges anyway.

[ZackJones]

I tried in the Chargemaster, not worth the time and effort as it throws no better than a volumetric. I think since this powder is so fluffy.

Thanks for the feedback. I was loading last night and had a few cases were it threw a very light charge so I'm weighing more often and even though I weigh almost every powder charge I still visually check each case. If one looks like I dump it and re-charge. I loaded 300 rounds last night and it wasn't that bad so I'll probably stick with my current process.

[bowenbuilt]

A friend of mine purchased a Dillon powder measure to use on his Lee press. After a little trimming on the hardware and the purchase of a stiff spring to go on the power bar he now can use e3, 700X or most any of the flake type powers without a problem. I can get a picture of the measure if you are interested.