CZinSC Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 So I had my first, and hopefully last, kaboom at the range today. Shooting a CZ P07, my reloads, MG124 FMJ, WSP, Win Case, 4.3gns N320. When I pulled the shot, from what I remember there was a blue/smokey flash and the shock caused me to drop the gun. Thankfully, no damage to me or the gun. When I finally picked up the gun, the magazine was still seated, the slide was slightly open with the case still inside, and the only obvious indication that something went wrong was the slide stop was halfway out of the frame. Other than that, all looked normal. So here is the picture of the case below. I load on a 550, and have had some issues lately so I suppose this shouldn't be a huge surprise, but the issues i was having was low FPS issues, not HIGH! In fact, these rounds were the same ones that i just shot the Ohio State match with, and none of them had any issues. The obvious answers are overcharge ( can't double charge N320 in 9mm, I may not have witnessed every single round and the powder in it, but i would have damn well noticed a round with powder spilling over the top ), or a bad case. Any thoughts? Also, one other factor....which I want to hear some thoughts on. It was 90 degrees at the range today when I was shooting. The bullets that I used, including this one below, were sitting in the sun for about 30 minutes prior to using. Yes, this may have been dumb, but I was teaching the girlfriend today how to shoot, so I was distracted. ( not blaming her...it was my own stupidity). Anyway, when I went to load some rounds in the magazine, they were so hot, it actually burned my fingers getting them in the mag. Is it possible that this could have caused the blow out?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 What is the history of the brass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CZinSC Posted May 31, 2012 Author Share Posted May 31, 2012 Not exactly sure, but if I had to guess I would say it's been loaded 4 or 5 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshidaex Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I'd say its an instance of "super face" than anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I doubt the heat played a factor as N320 is very stable. I guess the brass could have just been bad but generally something goes wrong to make this happen. You may have gotten an overcharge somehow but I would guess you got some bullet setback. Can you push a loaded round against the bench with significant effort and have absolutely no movement of the bullet? Does the case have a crimp ring around it where it is not blown out? i.e. from being expanded too much and then the size die works it down and leaves a little crease around the base. I have heard that can cause a weak point. Heck it could have had a small rock or clump of media in it when you loaded it causing the pressure to spike. More questions than answers I know, but several things can cause failures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Not exactly sure, but if I had to guess I would say it's been loaded 4 or 5 times. I have loaded minor loads many more times than 4-5 with no problems. Heck I have loaded some of my 9MAJOR brass 4-5 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CZinSC Posted May 31, 2012 Author Share Posted May 31, 2012 I doubt the heat played a factor as N320 is very stable. I guess the brass could have just been bad but generally something goes wrong to make this happen. You may have gotten an overcharge somehow but I would guess you got some bullet setback. Can you push a loaded round against the bench with significant effort and have absolutely no movement of the bullet? Does the case have a crimp ring around it where it is not blown out? i.e. from being expanded too much and then the size die works it down and leaves a little crease around the base. I have heard that can cause a weak point. Heck it could have had a small rock or clump of media in it when you loaded it causing the pressure to spike. More questions than answers I know, but several things can cause failures. No, no movement pushing against a solid surface Doesn't look like there is a crimp ring. I think it's the clump of media. I did have a few that had media in them when I was loading them. I distinctly remember stopping and pulling one out because I noticed the powder level looked higher than the others. Sure enough there was a clump at the bottom. I'm thinking this is the culprit. I was very vigilant after that one, but up until then, this round that blew up today might have slipped through. Thanks for the feedback Sarge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWFAN Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Looks like a case separation to me. In my opinion, the primer would be FLAT if it was over charges or super high pressure, and possibly would have caused more damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
open17 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Out of battery ignition. See the bulged ring all around in front of the extractor groove? The case was not fully chambered when it went bang-- or in this case BOOM. If it were a hot round there would be some primer flattening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CZinSC Posted May 31, 2012 Author Share Posted May 31, 2012 Out of battery ignition. See the bulged ring all around in front of the extractor groove? The case was not fully chambered when it went bang-- or in this case BOOM. If it were a hot round there would be some primer flattening. For the ring around the front, yes, that is what it looks like, the back side of the case looks normal though ( you can't see that on the picture). If it was out of battery, would the ring go all the way around the case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anm2_man Posted June 3, 2012 Share Posted June 3, 2012 Thats not out of battery, This is out of battery ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EEH Posted June 3, 2012 Share Posted June 3, 2012 Thats not out of battery, This is out of battery ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirty whiteboy Posted June 3, 2012 Share Posted June 3, 2012 A lot of 9mm major shot at the ranges these days. Are you picking up all the 9mm you can at the range, or do you mark your brass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbosik Posted June 3, 2012 Share Posted June 3, 2012 Im no expert, but I think it may just be bad brass, maybe from a 9 major open pistol. Your primer looks great, so it is not a hot load. I did not think the cz would fire out of battery? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griz Posted June 3, 2012 Share Posted June 3, 2012 (edited) Out of battery ignition. See the bulged ring all around in front of the extractor groove? The case was not fully chambered when it went bang-- or in this case BOOM. If it were a hot round there would be some primer flattening. +1 The rounded edge on the primer absolutely rules out any kind of over pressure in my mind. It actually looks like much lower pressure than normal to me, which would be consistent with an out of battery ignition. I have seen a buddy's 1911 fire slightly out of battery and that is exactly what the case looked like. Afterwards we were able to intentionally make it happen dry-firing, the disconnector was not working correctly 100% of the time. Some of the remaining ammo was not fully resized and wouldn't chamber fully, which combined with a flaky disconnector caused the kaboom. His kaboom blew the floorplate out of the mag and sprayed brass fragments in his face. For weeks afterwards, he'd occasionally get what looked like a zit and have speck of brass come out when he popped it. Edited June 3, 2012 by Griz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motochris Posted June 4, 2012 Share Posted June 4, 2012 His kaboom blew the floorplate out of the mag and sprayed brass fragments in his face. For weeks afterwards, he'd occasionally get what looked like a zit and have speck of brass come out when he popped it. Dang... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wayne Posted June 4, 2012 Share Posted June 4, 2012 "but I was teaching the girlfriend today how to shoot," I'll bet she just can't wait for the next lesson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theycallmeingot Posted June 4, 2012 Share Posted June 4, 2012 "but I was teaching the girlfriend today how to shoot," I'll bet she just can't wait for the next lesson. too soon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CZinSC Posted June 10, 2012 Author Share Posted June 10, 2012 "but I was teaching the girlfriend today how to shoot," I'll bet she just can't wait for the next lesson. too soon? LOL, no, not at all. I just didn't get back in here until now to see the last couple of responses. That was funny! I'm just damn glad the gun went kaboom in my hands, and not hers. I don't sleep well on couches! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HI5-O Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I've had a couple of those shooting production. Seems like a problem with the brass (mine happened with the same brand). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhyrlik Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I vote media clump. If you decrease case vlolume by a significant margin, you create a pressure spike which can blow the casehead. In all the KB aftermaths I ever saw, the primer looked normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftee Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 (edited) Sorry, old thread. Edited July 17, 2013 by leftee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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