RDunn Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I have been shooting uspsa and idpa for a year now. mainly Esp and Limited class. but the entire year i have been shooting all i can think about is open division. well after talking with Shay from Akai and describing the gun i wanted. he actually had it in stock. no waiting for it to get built at all. So I told him i would take it and sent my money order off today. So it looks like my journey to the darkside has begun. I am very excited and cant wait to get my pistol. So what tips would you give to yourself if you were just starting out in open and knew what you know now? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExtremeShot Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Bring it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDunn Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 Well thank you Darren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gng4life Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Practice, practice, practice...it was pain trying to find that dot off the draw and then in awkward positions. Getting the right load for you and your gun is important. I'm still new to Open but I'm loving it so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neomet Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 My tip for myself would be to manage my expectations. It was/is really easy to think you have just gotten a belt fed laser guided alpha destroyer instead of an Open gun. Here are a couple basic tips: Focus on the target, not the dot. Yes, the dot pretty much never sits still like iron sights do. Get used to shooting with a certain amount of movement in the dot. Pulling the trigger when you see red on brown will not lead to your desired results. Shoot alphas. Practice shooting on the move. It is easier with a dot than irons and will save you an amazing amount of time on your stages. Make your hits of course. Change your battery before every big match. Really consider double plugging. Open guns are loud and it is distracting. Shooting one in a tunnel or a shoot house can be brutal. Hope that helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDB Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Dump the C-More and get an Aimpoint Micro. 1. Made of metal not PLASTIC. No cracked body from over tightening locking screws. 2. No sun washout, regardless of where the sun is on the range. 3. Low mounting with the DAA mount SIGNIFICANTLY lowers learning curve. (Shot a C-more for 2 years and after mounting the AP, one the FIRST draw it was just there.) 4. Gun is more easily tuned since nothing is anywhere near the ejection port. 5. Don't have to worry about turning it off and on during the match, turn it on and leave it alone. I've screwed around and left mine on for a week once, a couple times, still the same battery a year later. 6. No need to worry about zero drift, these things are solid. And finally,,,no, I do not, have not, and do not expect to work for A-P. They just work!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donnyglock Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 neomet has some exc advice. It took me all season and now I am confortable with the dot. I just could not understand why I was not as fast as I was with my limited rig. Practice alot and be careful open will ruin you for wanting to shoot anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxshooter Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 The first thing to learn is how to find the dot. Practice from awkward positions as well as from the holster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircooled6racer Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Hello: Get a sideways mount like the Quinn II, Cheely or Cameron 90degree mount. They will help the learning curve alot coming from iron sights. Get a larger dot, I use a 12MOA one. Don't be affraid to try different loads till you find what you like. Shoot with both eyes open and double plug. A good friend told me that you should shoot an open pistol 15% better/faster than a limited pistol. Have fun Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpops Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I will sort of go against the grain here. Open is different ....but not too much! First piece of advice - Open is a fast game...don't think you will keep up at first. Ask me how I know that. Just relax and "see what you need to see". As far as the dot - see what you need to see (have you heard that before?) Some of the best advice I ever got was to use the dot how I needed it. Dont think for one minute that it is "wrong" to look at the dot. If I am taking a long, difficult shot, darn right I am looking at the dot. I use it as a sight (isn't that what it is?) Basically use the gun for what you need. Opinions are like.... Open, Limited, Single Stack etc....get the gun out NOW! You will be surprised at how much that will help you. Being ready to shoot when you arrive is another big step. As mentioned - double plug! Whether it helps your shooting or not it will save your hearing! Find the perfect load and stick with it! Your gunsmith is a great place to start. Once you find a load that feels good and keeps the dot in the glass then quit chasing your tail and run with it. I know several people that spend too much time chasing the holy graille of loads...only to waste time. Find it, load it, shoot it! Use what works for you! If TJ or Max stated that Double Bubble Bubblegum made them shoot better then you would see the sales increase! Point is....nothing will work for you like it works for someone else. If a 90 degree mount is your desire then go for it....if not then dont. Holster - choose a sturdy one. I have tried them all and I have the checkbook to prove it. In Open (and all divisions) you need a solid setup. Dont waste time and money - get one that works and is solid. Basics - get back to them. Open is no different than any other division. You wont' set the world on fire if you don't practice. Dryfire is your friend. Did I mention dryfire? But before you leap into all of that...make sure you know and understand your "natural point of aim". How do you find it? Close your eyes and draw the gun on a target. Is it aligned? If not then adjust your feet. Once you find it then know it! Knowing your NPOA is huge in Open...for some of us anyway. Lastly....keep it simple. I have purchased it all. Its like having the right lures in your tackle box! Bottom line is this - PERFECT PRACTICE! There...now you owe me $500 Feel free to PM me...good luck! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpops Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 (edited) Darn - one other biggie! Get with Open shooters that are waaaaay better than you! I was fortunate enough to shoot with some great ones around here (the Francisco's, TJ, Rebecca Jones, Todd Sindelar, Paul Mason, Ravin Perry etc) Once you get use to the speed...instead of standing there with your mouth open and drooling , it becomes more "normal". I strongly feel you must get accustomed to the sound and speed before it becomes natural for you. Edited October 11, 2011 by Bigpops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 So what tips would you give to yourself if you were just starting out in open and knew what you know now? I'm just starting out myself. So here is my take on it. Shooting Open is not VOODOO! This whole, "welcome to the darkside", mindset is funny to me. It's a gun! Don't expect to tear it up in Open. I was on the verge of making A in Production with a Glock and now am just a middle of the road C shooter in Open. I do shoot the Open gun a little faster and more accurate than the Glock but the problem is that EVERYTHING is amped way up in Open. You have to shoot much faster period. Shoot on the move! As has been said it is easier with a dot. Plus the other Open shooters are all doing it and you have to learn to keep up. Take advantage of the dot! Shoot longer range targets if it helps with the stage. Look for small gaps between props etc to exploit that other divisions won't dare shoot. Learn to find the dot. This will take a lot of initial practice. Once you can draw the gun and find the dot every time then practice weak hand, strong hand, leaning, squatting, moving etc. Trust me, if you don't see the dot you won't hit the target, so don't take pot shots and hope to get lucky. You can easily miss a target 10 feet away if the dot's not there. Find a gun and load that work 100% no questions asked. Getting the right gun is critical. I had a 9MAJOR built by Matt Cheely. Of course we all know that 9MAJOR guns don't run and are hard to make reliable. Total Bull$#!t. So far mine is every bit as reliable as my Glock has been. Make good ammo! I have not had one single malfunction out of my new gun all summer. It is a lot more fun shooting when everything just works. Somebody told me to not chase after the perfect load initially. Make a decent load that runs the gun and shoot a few cases of it, then use that as a baseline to start looking for the best(flattest). Study up on the new division because once you strap an Open gun on people will start asking you all about it. Be prepared to dazzle them with brilliance or baffle them with bullshit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDunn Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 the rig i use now is a cr speed belt,versapouch and wsmII on my limited gun. i would imagine i can adjust the holster around to fit the open gun. thanks for the advice guys, it has been great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpops Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 the rig i use now is a cr speed belt,versapouch and wsmII on my limited gun. i would imagine i can adjust the holster around to fit the open gun. thanks for the advice guys, it has been great. and that is what I have come back too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriojas Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 RDunn you made the right choice getting an Akai open gun. I just got min a few months ago and it is by far the most flat and accurate open gun I have ever shot. Start slow accuracy=speed! Trust the gun and the dot squeeze the trigger and with time speed will come. Good luck on your journey open is a fun and challenging division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gng4life Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 One thing I have to say also that I've learned/learning so far...don't "just let speed" happen or thinking it will magically come one day. I thought that for years with my Limit guns and I never got faster, just more accurate. You have to push yourself to go faster. You'll know when you are going too fast by missing targets, taking a lot of Deltas, etc. but don't stop pushing yourself. Remember this is a sport of BALANCE with power, SPEED and ACCURACY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDunn Posted October 12, 2011 Author Share Posted October 12, 2011 thanks guys, i knowm im going to have alot to learn. but since i started shooting this is the class i have been wanting to be in.i said i would give myself a year of shooting to make sure i wanted to stick with it before i went into open division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgkeller Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 You cannot dry fire too much when starting Open. The best and cheapest way to be able to put the dot where you are looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Merricks Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Like the others have mentioned dry fire from ackward streched out positions; strong hand only, weak hand only. Finding the dot on demand is key. I would suggest the next thing to work on is transitions. Speed is one of the hardest things to teach and learn. Let it hang out in practice, push it as hard as you can then learn to see what you need to see at the same speed. I forgot that on my recent return back to open and got reminded about it at my first match back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathtrap Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 I just started shooting open about a month and a half ago. I just switched to a 12moa dot and it helped me a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Adamson Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 (edited) This is a subtle difference, but you *must* learn it... DO NOT *push* the dot to the desired point of impact watching the dot the entire way.... DO *pull* the dot to the desired point of impact watching the point of impact and bring the dot to it. The best way to practice this... 2 targets at 45 degrees to the shooter and 10-15yrds away. Start at low ready (you can go to a draw start later), snap your eyes to the target, focus on where you want the hits, now bring the dot to that point, but don't look away for where you want the hits, once the dot arrives... pull the trigger 2 times. Now snap your head/eyes to the second target, focus on the point of impact, bring the dot to it... pull the trigger 2 times - repeat. For added credit... *don't* become a double tapper. focus on the desired POI, break the first shot, continue to focus on the POI, watch the dot come back to that POI and break the second shot when the dot is at the POI for the second shot. Start slow to get the feel for the dot movement, then work to quicken up the timing... but remember NO double taps, you want to see the dot on the second shot. Is there a place for double taps... yes, IMHO, it's when you are shooting index only shots and you are close enough that you might as well turn the dot off... Sometimes I think the dot is *way* overated ... Good luck! Alan Edited October 14, 2011 by Alan Adamson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDunn Posted October 14, 2011 Author Share Posted October 14, 2011 thanks for the advice. very quality post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Adamson Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 I just started shooting open about a month and a half ago. I just switched to a 12moa dot and it helped me a lot In my opinion, having a *large* dot is a crutch... It helps new open shooters see the *glare* in the glass to know which way to *wiggle* the gun to find the dot. A better solution would be a dot appropriate for the use (4 or 6 moa) and practice to get the index right. When I shoot close up classifiers or bill drills, I usually turn the dot off and just work on index shooting. Get the index correct and it's much easier to find the dot. The problem I have with a 12 moa dot is that it completely covers small plates when you shoot them. I like to turn my dot down in brightness, use a 6moa dot and have a distinct difference between what I'm shooting and what the dot is doing. Also I suspect you like the larger dot because you are driving the dot, not getting your eyes to the next target, focusing on the POI, and waiting for the dot to arrive at that point to break the shot. There is a distinct difference. But shooting open is just like open guns themselves, there are a million varieties and for those there are a million different approaches to shooting... Just my .02, Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 I just started shooting open about a month and a half ago. I just switched to a 12moa dot and it helped me a lot In my opinion, having a *large* dot is a crutch... It helps new open shooters see the *glare* in the glass to know which way to *wiggle* the gun to find the dot. A better solution would be a dot appropriate for the use (4 or 6 moa) and practice to get the index right. When I shoot close up classifiers or bill drills, I usually turn the dot off and just work on index shooting. Get the index correct and it's much easier to find the dot. The problem I have with a 12 moa dot is that it completely covers small plates when you shoot them. I like to turn my dot down in brightness, use a 6moa dot and have a distinct difference between what I'm shooting and what the dot is doing. Also I suspect you like the larger dot because you are driving the dot, not getting your eyes to the next target, focusing on the POI, and waiting for the dot to arrive at that point to break the shot. There is a distinct difference. But shooting open is just like open guns themselves, there are a million varieties and for those there are a million different approaches to shooting... Just my .02, Alan Lots of misinformation here. Maku mozo. 12 moa is approx. 3" at 25 yrds. Nothing wrong with using the large dot. You need to go with what works with your eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgkeller Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 IMO, the best way to shoot Open is to NOTICE the dot not SEE the dot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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