TGO Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 OK, time for you guys to get to work on my new gun. Scott, Daniel, Rich and anyone else in the biz, here is the challenge; drop in parts only, total reliability with standard primers, what can the trigger pull get down to. No stoning or tuning allowed, only bending springs. Remember, it's got to work all the time, even whilst totally ignoring a sane cleaning and maintenance schedule. Not fair but that's the rule! I know where we can get with tweaking and tuning and black magic, but there is a legit market out there for someone who will only want to do parts swapping. Also you must include the prices of the pieces used, and no prototypes, unless your gonna make them available to us all. I'm guessing springs only will get us around five lbs, parts changing maybe about four lbs. Trigger pull feel needs to be a factor also, to include takeup, reset distance, over travel and actual sear release. The next test will be which, if any of these changes help a guy shoot better. I think we can find out what the best bang for the buck changes are. I'll be glad to do the testing and comparison to stock, and I will try to measure an average of all these things on the 4 unmodified 5.25's I have here before I send them back. Interesting note. At the demo on Saturday I had 15 of my Action target steel plates and silhouettes lined up next to each other, ten yards down range and the game was; gun loaded on table, hands on table not touching gun, on buzzer, grab gun and hit all the targets. One of them was BTW a little 5 inch disc that swings back and forth behind the head of an ABC zone silhouette. My best run was not with my 3 lb. trigger pull gun! It was with the BiTone 5.25 totally stock. 5.67 seconds. GI ball 124 grain 9 mm ammo. OK guys, now is your chance to tell these guys what you as shooters want and for them to tell you if you can have it!! Let the games begin! Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhshooter Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 TGO, If you all need an avid, but average to fair shooter to test some of these firearms for real world-like use. It would be a great way to see if these firearms can indeed improve a shooters skill, because how much better can THE GREAT ONE get, I mean really? So in fairness I will take one for the team and the industry and offer to test a gun... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_striker Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 (edited) Using Daniel's Ultimate match drop in parts, my xdm breaks at 3.25-3.5 lbs. I'd like to see a sub 3 lb, drop-in trigger kit option. Something that didn't require pins and could easily be reversible if desired. Edited July 4, 2011 by d_striker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waynes_world_45 Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 TGO, If you all need an avid, but average to fair shooter to test some of these firearms for real world-like use. It would be a great way to see if these firearms can indeed improve a shooters skill, because how much better can THE GREAT ONE get, I mean really? So in fairness I will take one for the team and the industry and offer to test a gun... Having cut my teeth in USPSA with a CC "Production Ready" gun for a couple of years before switching to a XDM with a CC trigger and other do it your self upgrades......and now piloting a SPringer Precision Open XDM9Major, I feel my perspective would be uniquely valuable to above mentioned "test" and hence throw my name in the hat as Test Pilot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
de03x7 Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Well, if you are looking for volunteers for testing I will sign on for the cold weather portion. We shoot outdoor matches here in Alaska in October and April that see temperatures from the teens to the mid 30s. I would also be able to take one for the team and do some shooting in temperatures down to the minus 50s but not in a match. I could however leave a stage set up or maybe a steel course that could be shot for time comparison. I have been shooting an XDM 9 since last spring and have over 7000 rounds through it and an XDM 45 since December with over 4000 rounds through it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glockdirtyfour Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) Wow that's a cool challenge. I'm really interested on what cool upgrades these smiths can up with . I am fan of the xd/xdm pistols i have own 4 of them. I would love to see a market for good drop in performance parts for the xd. Edited July 5, 2011 by Glockdirtyfour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
szhttm Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Tagging along to see what the experts recommend and come up with. From what I can see and understand that the new XDm 5.25 comes with, I would probably want to upgrade the guide rod to something heavy and allowed by USPSA, magwell that fits the large backstrap, a 3.5ib. trigger, and running 40s&w ammo. Good Luck And Be Safe!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGO Posted July 7, 2011 Author Share Posted July 7, 2011 Tungsten Guide rod on it's way from Canyon creek, Replaced stock front sight .140 wide with .100 wide Dawson precision and Marty at Accuracy Speaks completed frame texturing today. Now I just need to get out and shoot it. It is very cool! I believe Springfield will soon release the pricing and availabilty. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avezorak Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Could you post pics of the grip texture please? Thanks!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWFAN Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 How's the out of the box accuracy.. for say.. NRA Action Pistol ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Wow that's a cool challenge. I'm really interested on what cool upgrades these smiths can up with . I am fan of the xd/xdm pistols i have own 4 of them. I would love to see a market for good drop in performance parts for the xd. We've had these out for many years. In talking with Rob, he want us to provide number for the various results of the increments of upgrades we offer, from simple spring swaps to the full blown trigger packages, and since that is a lot of combinations, we are working our way through it. Good news is I should have a 5.25 on Friday so I can verify the 5.25 is the same as the 4.5 from the chamber rearward. Front sights in several widths and types are on order already. We will be posting videos and photos on our facebook page Springer Precsion facebook since keeping track of all the forums is hard to do, we decided to deposit all our photos and videos there to make things easy to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Why not make a longer striker so it does not have to move so far forward to hit the primer? Wouldn't you be able to use lighter weight striker spring with a longer striker to achieve the same striking force? If you could use a lighter striker spring you could kill two birds with one stone (more secure lockup when cocked and less friction/resistance between the striker and sear when cocked and pulling the trigger). Another limitation that I have seen on the XD/XDm guns is due to the size and weight of the sear. The sear is so big and heavy it forces you to use a pretty stiff sear springs to make it resetting properly while shooting. A super light weight sear would allow you to use a way lighter sear spring. Maybe all of this stuff has already been tried and proven not to work? I just thought that I would mention it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Why not make a longer striker so it does not have to move so far forward to hit the primer? Wouldn't you be able to use lighter weight striker spring with a longer striker to achieve the same striking force? If you could use a lighter striker spring you could kill two birds with one stone (more secure lockup when cocked and less friction/resistance between the striker and sear when cocked and pulling the trigger). Another limitation that I have seen on the XD/XDm guns is due to the size and weight of the sear. The sear is so big and heavy it forces you to use a pretty stiff sear springs to make it resetting properly while shooting. A super light weight sear would allow you to use a way lighter sear spring. Maybe all of this stuff has already been tried and proven not to work? I just thought that I would mention it. We have a lighter sear and sear spring, but there isn't much pull weight to be gained there though for the cost to do so. The amount you can lighten the striker and lengthen it has it's limitations and payback is negligible when reliability is number 1. We do have a reduced power striker spring that can be used with Federal primers. Given we can get real light triggers with the stock striker spring, that isn't huge either for pull weight. Good thoughts though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIIID Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 As soon as I can find my notes on the pull reduction with the Canyon Creek spring kit I'll post it along with all of the parts I have that will work with the XDm models. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGO Posted July 8, 2011 Author Share Posted July 8, 2011 Just home from the range. It's hot here! Sighted in my 5.25 today after changing front sight to the .100 Dawson FO I'm used to. At 25 yards was able to keep all but 4 out of about 40 shots in the 4" black x ring of the NRA Bianchi cup target. Most of that was fired standing. My best groups were with the same 147 Montana gold bullet that shoots best out of all my factory XD and XDm barrels. Loaded with N320 at a 130 power factor for USPSA by Atlanta Arms, I then ran the target out to 50 yards and with the butt of the gun (magazine base pad) resting on the bench fired the last 5 rounds of that ammo I had left. The group measures right at 3.5 inches! To say I am surprised is an understatement! Normally to get that kind of accuracy you are gonna need a custom barrel, or at the very least the stock one refitted. I imagine after I have the barrel refit it will shoot as well or better. Aye Caramba! I'm liking this 5.25 more every time I shoot it. If I can get Kippi to help me I'll have some photos on this forum. I'm still kinda slow to this whole "interweb" thing. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) Sweet, I'm head to the range as soon as the wife is done working out since I got a special delivery today. I won't have my .100 front sights until Tuesday though. I have a long match XDM barrel I'll fit on to see how the stock one stacks up. The stock one seems to be a pretty good fit though. Edited July 8, 2011 by Loves2Shoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWFAN Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 Awesome, thanks for the update. 3.5 out of a Montana Gold ? Wow. I wonder what a Zero or XTP would do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JThompson Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 Sweet, I'm head to the range as soon as the wife is done working out since I got a special delivery today. I won't have my .100 front sights until Tuesday though. I have a long match XDM barrel I'll fit on to see how the stock one stacks up. The stock one seems to be a pretty good fit though. When you get done playing with it I'll take it Scott. JT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) OK, now I know for certain, Rob isn't yanking anyone's chain. If they all shoot like the one I have, this IS a game changer. I won't post my results until I can back it up with the video we shot, but to say was a little skeptical before I shot it, not now, not one bit. I did use our trigger job and stippling, but this gun flat out shoots, even with the fat front sight. Here you go I'll let the video do the rest of the talking. Edited July 8, 2011 by Loves2Shoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGO Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 Starting to sound like a lot of gun for the money!!! I am glad we brought it out at a price that makes it a deal for any one wanting a high performance pistol. I just came from the range, where I am currently practicing bullseye. BTW, I am terrible at it but after finishing with my highly tuned accuracy guns, ran through 3-5 shot strings of rapid fire with the 5.25. That is 5 shots in ten seconds, starting aimed at the target, ready to go. I scored 7-x's, 6-10's and 2-9's. I did this two handed, which aint legal for bullseye. Nonetheless I think that's a pretty good score! Especially for me. The gun was not zeroed for a six o'clock hold, which I used, (I don't know why either, that's just how I shoot bullseye), 2 rounds are 1/4 inch above targets dead center and all the rest are low. Whole group is just under 3 inches and would easily be all tens if centered. OK I gotta say it, at the risk of sounding like a company man, this gun is awesome. I never expected or intended it to shoot this well? Not complaining, just been around for a long time and don't get this excited about a gun very often. Just received and installed a 4.2 ounce guide rod from Canyon Creek Custom and can't wait to get it out for a little IPSC practice. Rich sent me a whole pile of cool stuff, springs to lighten the pull and a 140 mm mag base pad. I'm going to try and get another gun from Springfield and try the springs on an otherwise unmodified gun to see what the results are. Maybe Springfield oughta think about a .40 for limited! Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reshoot Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Starting to sound like a lot of gun for the money!!! I am glad we brought it out at a price that makes it a deal for any one wanting a high performance pistol. I just came from the range, where I am currently practicing bullseye. BTW, I am terrible at it but after finishing with my highly tuned accuracy guns, ran through 3-5 shot strings of rapid fire with the 5.25. That is 5 shots in ten seconds, starting aimed at the target, ready to go. I scored 7-x's, 6-10's and 2-9's. I did this two handed, which aint legal for bullseye. Nonetheless I think that's a pretty good score! Especially for me. The gun was not zeroed for a six o'clock hold, which I used, (I don't know why either, that's just how I shoot bullseye), 2 rounds are 1/4 inch above targets dead center and all the rest are low. Whole group is just under 3 inches and would easily be all tens if centered. OK I gotta say it, at the risk of sounding like a company man, this gun is awesome. I never expected or intended it to shoot this well? Not complaining, just been around for a long time and don't get this excited about a gun very often. Just received and installed a 4.2 ounce guide rod from Canyon Creek Custom and can't wait to get it out for a little IPSC practice. Rich sent me a whole pile of cool stuff, springs to lighten the pull and a 140 mm mag base pad. I'm going to try and get another gun from Springfield and try the springs on an otherwise unmodified gun to see what the results are. Maybe Springfield oughta think about a .40 for limited! Rob That's what I'm waiting for, a 40 S&W !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIIID Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 As soon as I get a spare one to play with I'm going to convert it into a .40 Limited gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anachronism Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Darn it. I shall never be happy with my std XD tactical again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGO Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 Rich, not sure it's legal to produce a limited gun in a caliber not produced by the manufacturer but I do agree it will be cool. I need to figure out how the Production weights are determined for uspsa. They list 4.5 9 XDm at 32 ozs. Mine with a small diameter tungsten guide rod weighs 30! Thats with empty mag. They show .40 XDm 4.5 as 30.4 ozs. Mine with small diameter tungsten guide rod weighs 32.4. I think they have mixed up the 9 and 40 in the 4.5's! Oh well, that helps anyone shooting 4.5 9mm!!!! My scale may not be right but the 40 does have the higher weight of the two. BTW, your guide rod fits perfect, as usual. I'm going to have to change it with a lighter one though for USPSA if they go by our claimed 29 ozs. on the spec sheet online. Thanks for all the stuff. I'll get to test it all on the weekend. Which striker spring should I use with ww primers? Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carter300 Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 Darn it. I shall never be happy with my std XD tactical again! +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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