Attacking a course

[beltjones]

I think the next evolution of my practice focus will be on moving through stages athletically. I'm trying to brainstorm how to develop a training program for this.

I've broken it down into two categories of improvement:

-General quickness and athleticism

-Stage-specific athleticism

I plan to get better at the first the old fashioned way: Wind sprints, agility drills, jump roping, etc.

The second part is probably more impactful, but harder to prepare a training program for. Does anyone have ideas? I'm thinking of setting up a stage and running through it with a stop watch, and trying to figure out how to be fast without shooting. Then I'll incorporate what I learn into negotiating the stage while shooting, always trying to find ways to shave time. Then I'll add in reloading, and again try to find ways to shave time.

But that's all I can think of. Are there any other good drills for improving quickness and athleticism while negotiating a stage?

[carlosa]

Great question I would like to know the answer to this one too

[pjb45]

Great Plan Strategy!

Explosive movement is noticeable when watching the GMs, especially Voight and Sevingy.

Ability to shoot in a squat position - legs really bent so the center of gravity is low - Tilly

In stead of working a stage, perhaps breaking it down and working on the components might be better in the beginning. Intermix the components into a training session, changing the sequence of components each training session.

Almost all stages of over 17 rounds require movement. So set up two box or two windows/ports about 10 yards apart and move from one to another; laterally, front to back, and dianglally (can not spell). The COF is not supposed to be a foot race, so most shooting areas are less than 10 yards apart, just several in a row.

Your agility drills will work great for turning corners during a COF.

I think 3 or 4 stages at Nationals last year required shooting from a squat position.

Stop watch is good for non-firearm training. Just do not get married to the individual times-look at averages and trends. I would recommend when you do your drills, keep your gun hand up in front of your face. It is a good habit to get into.

Get a 22 conversion when you transition to doing the same thing with a firearm. That way you have some feedback like shooting but at a reduced cost.

Even at my advanced age, here are a couple of things that have helped me improve; during a long run I will incorporate a few short sprints-fartleks, when at home watching TV- I will squat and jump to touch the ceiling, or doing numerous squats to a chair.

While on the range, I set up to boxes one at 20 yards another at 40+. Draw and shoot three targets at 40 and run like as fast as I can to the 20 box and shoot the same three targets. I used 20 yards as this really encouraged me to accelerate more and maintain it.

I have watched Matt B videos of him actually shooting a stage, I noticed he is actually out of breath at the end of the stage. So I started practicing shooting while out of breath. It has helped me.

[Dan Burwell]

Not that you cannot do it at home by yourself, but there experts out there for just type of thing....Physical Trainers. I found a couple guys local that run a competitve sports training program and have worked with PRO atheltes. I sent them some videos of what we do and they have been great at working with me and improving my stage movement.

I am sure you can improve by yourself, but just like improving your shooting it really helps to have someone that really knows their stuff watching over you. Not to mention that having a scheduled time to do the activity helps keep you showing up.

Train Hard,

Dan

[Jake Di Vita]

Olympic lifting is the best thing out there for generating explosive power.

Most "professional" physical trainers have about the same expertise in their field as gun store commandos do in practical shooting.

The single greatest advantage an athlete has over a non-athlete is vision.

[Jman]

1. Don't be fat or even significantly over weight.

a.) loose the gut and do at least 50 sit ups a day.

Abdominal strength is dam near EVERYTHING.

2. Hamstrings. Hamstrings. Hamstrings.

a.) tight ones kill ALL speed AND quickness.

Stretch them 30 minutes a day. Everyday.

Just keeping these two areas in great shape separates you from about 90% of us.

Get to the shooting.

[G-ManBart]

Have you already worked on entries and exits? The time saved seems to come from making those two really good, not so much moving fast. I was working on an exit/entry drill the other day and I could run slower, but enter smoother (and more efficiently) and get the same outcome on the timer. Then it becomes a matter of moving faster and still entering efficiently. R,

[JeffWard]

Olympic lifting is the best thing out there for generating explosive power.

Most "professional" physical trainers have about the same expertise in their field as gun store commandos do in practical shooting.

The single greatest advantage an athlete has over a non-athlete is vision.

I would agree with 90% of what just said... Especially Point #2... And I'm a Trainer! Most of them suck at anything outside bodybuilding.

"Olympic Lifting" is the great grandfather of many of the explosive advanced power techniques no do in the pro sthlete environment, but it IS the foundation. Now, it's done unilaterally (one hand), and destabilized (on wobble boards, balls, BOSUs, planks, etc.

Vision??? I'd agree with "Advanced Proprioceptive Training", involving spatial perception, orientation, and muscle control. Which allows an athlete to make corrections while moving, or in an awkward position, to stabilize as if still... Shooting on the move is the perfect example. This takes training. Vision is only one small part.

JeffWard

[euxx]

Work on improving general fitness. CrossFit or PBX90 training programs are great. Just don't over do it and stay away from the injuries.

[beltjones]

Have you already worked on entries and exits? The time saved seems to come from making those two really good, not so much moving fast. I was working on an exit/entry drill the other day and I could run slower, but enter smoother (and more efficiently) and get the same outcome on the timer. Then it becomes a matter of moving faster and still entering efficiently. R,

A little, but I'd love to get more information on these skills.

[Rob D]

I stay in decent shape and spend a lot of time trying to strengthen my legs, but the main thing that has really helped my stage movement is actually setting up practice stages and running them over and over. A lot of people practice shooting all the time, but their practice involves mostly standing and shooting. Since movement is just as crucial to our sport as actually shooting the gun, you should practice it just as much.

[Jake Di Vita]

"Olympic Lifting" is the great grandfather of many of the explosive advanced power techniques no do in the pro sthlete environment, but it IS the foundation. Now, it's done unilaterally (one hand), and destabilized (on wobble boards, balls, BOSUs, planks, etc.

I can't think of any even remotely good reasons to do power movements with hundreds of pounds while destabilized.

Vision??? I'd agree with "Advanced Proprioceptive Training", involving spatial perception, orientation, and muscle control. Which allows an athlete to make corrections while moving, or in an awkward position, to stabilize as if still... Shooting on the move is the perfect example. This takes training. Vision is only one small part.

Absolutely vision, although proprioception is irreplaceable as well. People who have never played a sport are not nearly as aware of their surroundings as athletes are. Let me change my statement a bit. Athletes see more than non-athletes. This obviously has far reaching benefits to the world of practical shooting.

[beltjones]

"Olympic Lifting" is the great grandfather of many of the explosive advanced power techniques no do in the pro sthlete environment, but it IS the foundation. Now, it's done unilaterally (one hand), and destabilized (on wobble boards, balls, BOSUs, planks, etc.

I can't think of any even remotely good reasons to do power movements with hundreds of pounds while destabilized.

Vision??? I'd agree with "Advanced Proprioceptive Training", involving spatial perception, orientation, and muscle control. Which allows an athlete to make corrections while moving, or in an awkward position, to stabilize as if still... Shooting on the move is the perfect example. This takes training. Vision is only one small part.

Absolutely vision, although proprioception is irreplaceable as well. People who have never played a sport are not nearly as aware of their surroundings as athletes are. Let me change my statement a bit. Athletes see more than non-athletes. This obviously has far reaching benefits to the world of practical shooting.

Do you have any suggestions for how to incorporate any of this into training routines? I'd hate for this thread to turn into "Olympic lifts vs. stability ball" and "which is more important - vision or ..."

[Corey]

I'm personally working on the physical side of my game, by trying to lose a little weight and better my conditioning. im playing deck hockey with some friends (roller hockey minus the roller ) and after a few weeks of games/practices i can tell im able to run a little longer and a little harder without getting winded. The first game of the year, i was dead by halftime. Now im able to get through the game and only be a little winded.

In our game, i dont think speed is an issue as much as quickness is. we dont have to run 100 yards very often, but we have to move 10-20 feet a lot! getting "quicker" with movements and training to be more explosive in short movements seems like the winning idea to me.

[benos]

I'm thinking of setting up a stage and running through it with a stop watch, and trying to figure out how to be fast without shooting.

Although that sounds like it might be a good idea, I doubt there would be much benefit from it. As you leave a position, what you see as you are firing your last shot(s) controls the speed at which you leave. And as you enter a position, what you see as you are setting up on the first target controls your body position and the speed at which you enter. So movement and shooting are not separate.

be

[Sandro]

I'm thinking of setting up a stage and running through it with a stop watch, and trying to figure out how to be fast without shooting.

Although that sounds like it might be a good idea, I doubt there would be much benefit from it. As you leave a position, what you see as you are firing your last shot(s) controls the speed at which you leave. And as you enter a position, what you see as you are setting up on the first target controls your body position and the speed at which you enter. So movement and shooting are not separate.

be

I have been thinking about this for some time now... I have found the best way to attack a stage is by focus on the task and nothing else. Everytime I am relax and there is no mind involved I shoot faster cause I am not looking to acquire the target, it is already there. It is very difficult to do it on demand specially if you have ADD. LOL... But when you taste it it is magical...

DVC,

Sandro

Edited September 8, 2010 by Sandro

[CHA-LEE]

I think that most people lack the ability to vary their aggressiveness in movement during stage runs. Most shooters will default to a single speed of movement through the whole stage run which is usually dictated by the shooting difficulty of the stage. Work on mixing up your movement speed through the stage to set the movement threshold right at the efficiency limit of the shot difficulty. Being able to vary your movement speed throughout a stage run is usually a big aspect of what separates the top shooters from the rest of us.

The same could be said for being able to shoot effectively while you accelerate or decelerate while shooting on the move. A lot of people are pretty decent at shooting as they decelerate and move into a shooting position. Not too many people are good at shooting as they are accelerating out of a position. The top flight GM's can effectively engage targets in both conditions. The average shooter can only engage targets as they are decelerating and settling into a shooting position.

I think that the key isn't to be super "Athletic" in your movement but instead to be able to move aggressively WHILE being smooth. The top USPSA/IPSC shooters in the world use every step taken in a stage to their advantage. Every step taken gets them closer to the end of the COF as soon and as smooth as possible. Check out the below links to stage runs of Henning Wallgren shooting at the 2007 Double Tap Championship. His body movement and foot work through these stages is flawless and thus it looks effortless. He has no tension in his shooting, no wasted movement, and more often then not his gun is running the whole stage run. He is attacking these stages not with aggressiveness but instead with efficiency of movement.

http://www.henningshootsguns.com/movies/2007/2007Dtc/2006dtc_st7_wallgren.wmv

http://www.henningshootsguns.com/movies/2007/2007Dtc/2006dtc_st8_wallgren.wmv

http://www.henningshootsguns.com/movies/2007/2007Dtc/2006dtc_st12_wallgren.wmv

Edited September 8, 2010 by CHA-LEE

[Jake Di Vita]

Do you have any suggestions for how to incorporate any of this into training routines?

Absolutely. Step one is learn the lifts (either on your own or with the help of a coach). Step two is do the lifts consistently with reasonable nutrition so you make progress.

In terms of programs, there are plenty of them out there. Catalyst Athletics puts out a daily Oly lifting oriented workout. Crossfit has fantastic GPP stuff that often has an explosive element. Google, read read read, train. I can point you towards some information to start if you'd like.

Although that sounds like it might be a good idea, I doubt there would be much benefit from it. As you leave a position, what you see as you are firing your last shot(s) controls the speed at which you leave. And as you enter a position, what you see as you are setting up on the first target controls your body position and the speed at which you enter. So movement and shooting are not separate.

I completely agree. Take care of the speed and power stuff in the gym. If you do it properly, it will translate to better range performance automatically.

[beltjones]

I'm thinking of setting up a stage and running through it with a stop watch, and trying to figure out how to be fast without shooting.

Although that sounds like it might be a good idea, I doubt there would be much benefit from it. As you leave a position, what you see as you are firing your last shot(s) controls the speed at which you leave. And as you enter a position, what you see as you are setting up on the first target controls your body position and the speed at which you enter. So movement and shooting are not separate.

be

I understand that vision is the limiting factor, but I'm quite confident that I can see faster than I can move. I'm also quite confident that I'm not moving into and out of positions as fast as my vision will let me. I'm hoping to speed up my habitual physical speed around a course, and naturally if I find that I'm moving so fast that it's affecting my vision I can always back off as required.

Hopefully that makes my intentions a little more clear.

[Aglifter]

+1 for not doing O lifts on "wobble balls". The slightest surface imperfection can make lifts and exercises very difficult. If you really want to do something along these lines, I'd suggest finding the smoothest parking lot, or grass field you can find, and start w. farmer's walk. Carrying weight while trying to properly place your feet on a less than perfect surface, is one of the challenges of strongman - not sure how relevant it is to shooting - maybe trail running?

[G-ManBart]

Have you already worked on entries and exits? The time saved seems to come from making those two really good, not so much moving fast. I was working on an exit/entry drill the other day and I could run slower, but enter smoother (and more efficiently) and get the same outcome on the timer. Then it becomes a matter of moving faster and still entering efficiently. R,

A little, but I'd love to get more information on these skills.

If you can take a class with one of really good guys, they're probably going to spend a fair amount of time on entries and exits...great stuff. If that's not in the cards right now, the Double Alpha Academy DVD 3 GM's does a nice section on this with the slightly different techniques of the three guys, all of which are worth exploring (and quite similar in most ways). R,

[flack jacket]

I think that most people lack the ability to vary their aggressiveness in movement during stage runs. Most shooters will default to a single speed of movement through the whole stage run which is usually dictated by the shooting difficulty of the stage. Work on mixing up your movement speed through the stage to set the movement threshold right at the efficiency limit of the shot difficulty. Being able to vary your movement speed throughout a stage run is usually a big aspect of what separates the top shooters from the rest of us.

The same could be said for being able to shoot effectively while you accelerate or decelerate while shooting on the move. A lot of people are pretty decent at shooting as they decelerate and move into a shooting position. Not too many people are good at shooting as they are accelerating out of a position. The top flight GM's can effectively engage targets in both conditions. The average shooter can only engage targets as they are decelerating and settling into a shooting position.

I think that the key isn't to be super "Athletic" in your movement but instead to be able to move aggressively WHILE being smooth. The top USPSA/IPSC shooters in the world use every step taken in a stage to their advantage. Every step taken gets them closer to the end of the COF as soon and as smooth as possible. Check out the below links to stage runs of Henning Wallgren shooting at the 2007 Double Tap Championship. His body movement and foot work through these stages is flawless and thus it looks effortless. He has no tension in his shooting, no wasted movement, and more often then not his gun is running the whole stage run. He is attacking these stages not with aggressiveness but instead with efficiency of movement.

http://www.henningshootsguns.com/movies/2007/2007Dtc/2006dtc_st7_wallgren.wmv

http://www.henningshootsguns.com/movies/2007/2007Dtc/2006dtc_st8_wallgren.wmv

http://www.henningshootsguns.com/movies/2007/2007Dtc/2006dtc_st12_wallgren.wmv

BINGO!

Efficency is key although optimum fitness always a good idea. My local club GM Jojo V. is another good example of efficient shooting. vids: http://nrg.jvdynamics.com/nrg/

Sprints work provided one controls your entry speed. Cha-lee you may remember at GBC in July Stage 7.. Depending how stage was attacked, after the first shooting position, shooter can sprint 20 yards or so to 2nd position and make up time there. I tried it but was out of breath and affected my shooting.. LOL.. hence again general fitness good idea!

[XRe]

Being able to sprint 20 yards, and still be in control is a huge benefit. A solid level of GPP is a good start, for certain. I agree with Jake in terms of how to best get there (ie, CrossFit for GPP, including big improvements in explosive power).

In addition to GPP (remember, "G" stands for "General"), some sport specific work is beneficial. Increases in explosive strength will definitely help your sprints - but you learn how to sprint by.... sprinting! Sprint intervals of various lengths help a bunch. An agility ladder is a huge thing for our sport. Grab a medicine ball and work various throws, spins, etc. Look into football agility drills w/ cones, etc - things that involve short sprints that require control (stopping, or turning quickly), direction changes, etc. Work those some days in addition to or in lieu of GPP. Sometimes, just for giggles, do them w/ a 5# dumbell in one of your hands.

Finally, realize that unless you have good technique for position exit and entry, aggressive attitude toward employing those skills, etc, you can be super fast in between positions, but you'll lose the time you're gaining in foot speed by being inefficient on the front and back end of the movement. There's a reason why guys who are arguably very physically unfit can win USPSA matches - fitness and GPP are a huge benefit to your game, but they frequently get trumped by superior technique and execution. I'm not at all discouraging improvement in fitness - instead pointing out that you need to work the full spectrum of required skills to see the best benefit from them in your game.

[benos]

Good stuff on the Henning vids CHA-LEE. Yes, he's a beauty to watch. I've known him well for many years. And an interesting thing - Temperament wise, he's an INTP, so he has no "built in" body skills whatsoever. Which means he's neither fine nor gross motor skilled. He's trained himself to move and shoot like that. Which may be inspirational for other's who are not ST's (fine motor skilled, eg. Todd Jarret) or SF's (gross motor skilled, the TGO).

be

[Flexmoney]

Can't ya just buy new shoes and a cool shirt ? I hear red is a fast color!