BitchinCamaro

For the money, the Howa's are hard to beat. I started with a 20" fluted heavy barreled action in .308 and it's been a solid shooter. If you're in Germany, you have something of a Howa specialty geek shop (relatively) nearby. Rodale Precision does custom work and even has a sub-chassis to fit the ACIS style stocks and magazines. US customers have had some issues getting product, but if you're on the same continent, then it's probably worth a phonecall or roadtrip to Osnabruck. http://wp.roedale.de/ Apparently, that is a 1500 short action in there.

I agree, but ultimately I don't trust anyone else's firearms handling when it comes to my personal safety at a match.

BCMB here. My genetics prof was OK but the exams were killer. It was the lowest grade I earned in undergrad. My old lab instructor sounds a lot like your prof- random quizzes, insane difficulty. The best students still scored 50s and 60s out of 100. Some of us and banded together and went to the head of the Bio department. It didn't do us any good that semester, but a year later we spotted her working the register at the Kmart 10 miles from campus. I studied for the final by treating genetics like a goddamn second language. I could do restriction maps in my head and had most of the codons categorized by acid in my head. I still got my ass kicked and scraped by. The curve saved me. It's clear that you're not dragging your heels through this class. Hopefully you'll pull through with some skills to crush next semester.

Tried to get my shooting buddy's guns functional and reliable 4 weeks ahead of the state match. A little foresight now means I might not have to deal with his busted guns on gameday. Also, I'm doing the Insanity workouts.

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Lots of good info here! MarkCO, it didn't seem like slug-splash was a concern at 40 yards. The stage designers are usually very safety conscious and I believe MGM (maybe action target) had a rep at the match shooting all the stages. I'll ask at the next match. Thanks Oskino and The Donald (and everyone else) for the real world data. It's not a case of intimidation, it's just a target setup that I can't imitate in practice. Without seeing it happen I can't imagine what it's supposed to do, if you don't mind me getting all zen on you guys. Oskino, did you have an elbow down in that barrel, or was it all offhand? I think next time I'll go prone and tag it with a full 1oz Remington Slugger.

Well done, dude! I once broke my femur and gained 20ish lbs during recovery. It's damn amazing what dropping weight does for efficiency of movement.

Any input from my previous post, Logiztix? Don't go breakin' my heart!

UUUuuuuunnnngggghhhh... want to try/fondle so badly.... When were these released to market? I've gone through the Guys-lee SD3G, and now the CMC drop in, but that ELF laser engraving just speaks to me.

I had Rose Action Sports thread a Mossberg 500 barrel for me about 3 years ago. It was definitely under $100 including shipping both ways. Quality was top notch. I put together a set (Skeet, IC, MOD, Full) of chokes from Ebay for about $30 total. Mossberg/Weatherby/Invector (not invector plus), sets are all the same thread and can be found really cheaply. For the OP, the disadvantage you might have with that 28" barrel probably isn't your pattern, but the actual mass of the barrel. You may have been swinging through your targets and hitting the lagging edge. Wit the mag restrictions for Factory Division I no longer have a comically long mag tube, and I found that not having and extra 8 oz of mass at the end of my gun has really helped control the muzzle for fast up close stuff.

Hi Logiztix, I'm liking my multi use MST, but I missed out on the plunger pre-sale. Is the plunger clear anodized or is it raw aluminum? Are there any concerns with galling against the steel recoil spring tube? I also just had some technical questions- more hypothetical than anything. You've made it clear on ore3gun.com that there is a "delicate balance between load weight and reliable cycling", which I'm sure everyone who plays this game understands. I'm just wondering what issues are encountered when too heavy a load is ran through a system optimized for skeet farts. In an extreme example, let's take a broken-in 930 JM Pro with a competition MST, Plunger, clipped recoil spring, lightened bolt, titanium bolt handle, etc... If a 3" 1500 fps Prairie Storm or a 1-3/8 oz Brenneke slug is cycled through it, other than beating on the receiver , what issues are introduced? Of course, I don't intend to complete a stage with magnum turkey loads, but I don't know how cycling issues manifest themselves when I've overloaded that "delicate balance". I was just hoping you could share your experience so I can keep at least one step ahead of any potential issues. Thanks!

A match earlier in the year had a stage starting with a spinner out at 40 yards- a 60 second bonus if you spun it with slugs (from the start box)- 60 second penalty if you failed to spin it with birdshot up close. I think 2 or 3 shooters out of 80ish got the bonus. None of them were squadded with me so I don't know how long it took them to get it over. I was using a borrowed shotgun for that stage and I didn't know where the POI for slugs was, so I ran up on it and got it spinning in 4 rounds of federal 1 1/8 oz. target loads. The matches at this club have been particularly shotgun heavy this year, and I suspect that spinners are going to be integrated into at least one stage for the rest of 2015. I'm just wondering if y'all think that this setup is an "easy" bonus if one knew where their slugs landed, or is it a time trap? I'm shooting the bulk box Fiocchi 7/8oz 1100 fps slugs and even if I knew my hold that day, I still wonder if that load had enough momentum behind it to get the spinner moving at 40 yards. Another thing to consider was that there were another 12 KO steel/poppers/clays after the start box, so round count and loadout had to be considered. Is it reasonable to expect that 2 solid hits on the bottom plate at 40 yards would get a full rotation? 3 hits? 4? I just don't know. Would taking the time to drop prone be worth it? An extra 30-40 seconds of bonus would have bumped me up a dozen places. I just thought I would throw it out there and see how everyone else would shoot it. (because photoshop)

Damnit. I wish I hadn't have seen that. I have a Seekins lower and now I want the curtains to match the drapes. For OP, I use the Noveske/Magpul 60 degree throw. It's cheap and works great.

RIP prismatic. I still love mine, but a few horizontal stadia would have been killer. Are you still using CMC triggers?

Prismatic user here. Circle dot circle is amazing. Optical clarity is hands down better than any dot. Outside of 3gun, they could have sold 100x more units if the illumination module didn't absolutely suck ass. 1/3N batteries are expensive and don't last that long. The first two of my units failed constantly and ate batteries even when the module was off. If they just made a slightly fatter unit with CR123 batteries and a reasonable illumination time, then every tactical-Timmey with a closet full of multi-cam and surefire batteries would have at least given it a second thought. Even sticking a 2032 battery under the dials like some of their other scopes would have been a reasonable option. Given the lack of official technical data like reticle subtensions , or even a manual that is specific to the optic, I always felt that the prismatic was overhyped and undersupported- like it's genius creator was fired shortly after it hit the market or something. I still love mine!

So now it's a year later and my spelling has improved since that last post . 2 matches in for 2015 and I still have the JP spring pack sitting on the shelf. My current reload in .223 is somewhere in the 24.6 to 24.8 grains of Tac with Wolf primers under a 55 grain Xtreme FMJ. It's chronoing in the low 2900s. 18" barrel, 1:9 twist, rifle length gas system. There aren't any reciprocating issues with this load, but I sense that the gun worked slighter better with commercial XM193 when shooting sub .2 splits into a 3gun nation target. When everything aligned correctly I felt like the rifle would sort of "spit out" 2 rounds in controlled accurate fire, putting 2 holes within 2 inches of each other at 25 yards with multiple targets to transition between- It was smooth and effortless. Shooting splits like that with softer load feels less automatic, and requires a bit more attention like a true "eyes on sight" doubletap from a pistol. It may be the lack of gas blasting through the (miculeck) comp, and I'm sure a bit of user input is in there too. I'll be dinking around with the load for accuracy, then work with the gas and spring pack over the next few weeks to see what happens. If anyone has any experience messing with the alternate spring packs please post here with your experiences. Thanks!

In addition to a lot of what GnG posted I started counting out loud after the beep, especially with shotgun stages. Everyone with electronic muffs laughs when I shoot!

Googled it. Now that I know it can happen, I bet that it's gonna happen to me . http://jerkingthetrigger.com/2012/09/10/complex-ar-15-malfunction/

I know you already ordered the JP, but I was going to suggest researching the SLR (I think that's correct) block. I have the Syrac Gen 1, which I believe is the same as the JP. It gets gunked up pretty good during a match, and after everything gets cemented while it sits in the safe, it becomes a real chore to change settings if you choose to dink around with new loads. The gen 2 still has a detent system that can get fairly sticky. The SLR uses a big leaf spring which I imagine is more user friendly, and has to be easier to disassemble for cleaning than my current setup. I do love the function of the JP/Syrac, but if you're not committed to it yet, maybe have a look-see at the other offerings because there is a downfall to the tiny detent system.

If you're asking the internet, then you're probably the kind of person that is gonna regret not going fluted, even if just for the reason that you think it looks cool. FWIW, all my barrels are fluted. No, it doesn't make a difference at this level/style of shooting. No, I wouldn't go back to non-fluted if I could do it over again. Yes, I am a very special snowflake.

Even if the root cause is WWB and an overpowered recoil spring, why is the doublefeed only manifesting in matches?

I invited a friend and his son to an ICORE style match last weekend. This was the kid's first time shooting a match and it was a good time all around showing him how to be safe and focus on the fundamentals. I was having an OK day with a few top 5 stage times and a few hiccup stages, but I was just trying to have clean runs. I happened to have a KCI 33rd glock stick mag in my range bag, and after spotting it the kid kept insisting that I should shoot with it. There was a pretty straightforward stage coming up, 5 big steel plates engaged once each from 5 different shoot boxes a few yards apart. 25 rounds. Easy peasy. I was shooting a production Glock 17, and the shoot boxes were far enough apart that reloads weren't really a time factor - figured I would entertain the kid and throw in the stick mag and just mow this stage down. AWWWWWWWW YEEEEAAAAHHHHH... After the beep, my squad, and the squad watching behind us, started to wonder if I had a stroke as I was just looking into my sights perfectly aimed at a ginormous steel plate 10 yards away. In actuality, I was trying frantically to fire as second after second passed without a bang. I thought I had a sort of dead trigger, as I could pull the trigger back but the striker wouldn't release. After a tap-n'-rack, the gun sounded like it doubled with a crazy fast split as my finger bump-fired on accident as it caught the recoil. I finished the first string, moved to the second box, and I had to press the trigger twice HARD to get the Glock to fire. Just monging down on the trigger pulled my shots super low, and people began wondering aloud at WTF I was shooting at. 3 boxes in I probably had 2 makeups for each plate, with a few seconds between shots as I choked the trigger into compliance. I was tempted to stop half-way and call it a mulligan, but I had already bought my ticked to suck-town and the train had left the station. Somewhere towards the end, I eventually ran the giant mag dry. I hit the mag release and nothing happened. The fat KCI stick fit so tightly that I had to really wrench it out of the grip using my knees as bracing (respecting trigger finger and 180 all the while, of course). That alone took about 7 seconds. The pain of shooting poorly, in front of multiple squads to witness, was multiplied 10x by the fact that I had a giant turdy-three round albatross of a magazine hanging out of the bottom of my Glock like truck-nutz. To boot, the kid wasn't that impressed. Anyway, I hate to blame gear, but I dropped from some top ~10 times to about 64th on that stage. I had a new Zev V4 connector, fresh striker and recoil springs, and a new Zev striker installed. 130 PF minor loads ran beautifully with stock glock mags. The KCI magazine fit is so tight that I think the frame bowed out to the point that the connector wasn't engaging the cruciform correctly and wasn't allowing the striker to release without a death squeeze . This is probably the third or fourth screwup based on a "casual" switchup of parts and not taking an easy stage as seirously as any other stage I shot that day. I'm posting here so I can start taking lessons like these to heart and not waste time and money on gameday.

:roflol: :roflol: