RadarTech

So let me make sure I understand this... The shooter took no extra shots and there is no way a shot hit the no shoot and a scoring target. The no shoot also could not have been as a shoot thru from any other target. So what you have is an unaccounted for hole, that this shooter could not have made. So in this instance, are you saying you can’t accurately determine the score for this shooter? In that case, rule 9.1.4 comes into play.. Unrestored Targets – If, following completion of a course of fire by a previous competitor, one or more targets have not been properly patched or taped or if previously applied pasters have fallen off the target for the competitor being scored, the Range Officer must judge whether or not an accurate score can be determined. If there are extra scoring hits or questionable penalty hits thereon, and it is not obvious which hits were made by the competitor being scored, the affected competitor must be ordered to reshoot the course of fire. Reviewing previous score sheets is prohibited; targets must be scored as is, using the actual target as the basis for the scoring call.

Read as shorter and rounder....

Options— A shorter competitor can’t keep up with a taller competitor, making options may give a shorter competitor a chance to beat a different more athletic competitor. It is not and should not be a triathlon. It should be shooting skill.. So if a shorter guy can shoot that 40 yard swinger and avoid a position, and do it fast— that may equal the athletic guy shooting it at 15 with the extra movement.. Or mag change locations.. In the end it should always be a puzzle that the skills and abilities of the competitor determine what way works for them. We can all set a stage up with only 1 way to shoot it.. but what fun is that?

Remember a couple things when looking at 3.3. 1. The USPSA President CAN authorize a local rule.. but last time I asked there were none. 2. Local laws take precedence.. if a law says you can’t do something— then that takes effect.. ie mags, as in 3.3.1.. the most common local rule I've heard off is no reloading with the muzzle over the berm... that usually ends matches... the other “local” rule I’ve seen people not happy with—- is no PCC on the range... but that is permissible as a club does not have to have that as a division... I can name at least one club that does that...

Check this rule... Last sentence. 5.2.5.3 Unless specified in the written stage briefing, or unless required by a Range Officer, the position of holsters and allied equipment on the belt must not be moved or changed by a competitor during a match. If a retaining strap is permanently attached to a holster or magazine pouch, it must be applied or closed prior to issuance of the “Standby” command. A bungee used to secure the gun before and after the course of fire is likely NOT permanent....

IIRC at my last count 33 certified RMs but I think there are some that don’t RM Majors anymore. Plus 10 RMIs. While I can’t say I’ve always been so adamant about the visible beyond the 180... I am now... And I have shot majors as a competitor where I wasn’t on staff and there was the same discussion points had here. RE it is on the competitor. I don’t agree with that.

I can say for sure that major match stage reviews as submitted to NROI are highly discussed for 2.1.4... On one match I specifically said on paper I see a 180 issue on stage 2.. targets 3-6. I will add extra barriers to fix when we put them on the ground. And it was a major discussion point in the RM course. Just my quarter worth..

M There are some interesting issues here... 1. WHAT does the WSB require? The phrasing is important.. . ie if it says reload AFTER array 1–then if you shoot array 1 and then reload but then re-engage array 1 you have then re-engaged array 1 and need to reload again... but if you shoot array 1 reload shoot array 2 then send a makeup on array 1 — it gets really squirrelly... you could do a reload to comply with the WSB, but it won’t affect your time.... cause you won’t be firing shots... but an astute RO might assign procesurals for failure to comply with the WSB... 10.2.2 or if it says engage array 1 and then reload before engaging array 2.. this is a real gamer statement... you could fire 1 shot at ARRAY 1, reload and then engage the rest of 1 and 2... In the end... the WSB is very important.....

I dropped a note to Troy... Let’s see what he says... maybe we will get a rule edit...

The first sentence clearly says OUTSIDE the shooting area then says wholly beyond the shooting area... so does being inside the shooting area meet that??

Ok... I would simply say— RO— read the entire rule.. Now please call the RM... The read the entire rule was told to me time and time again in the past... This rule is based off the first sentence... The rest is supporting arguments...

The rule ONLY addresses standing on a wall support that is OUTSIDE the shooting area... If it is INSIDE the shooting area this rule for a penalty would not apply... But— if you see 10.3.7 So WSB May now contain- climbing on or standing on support structures is NOT permitted. There is your punitive rule...

If it is non-existent then you are touching whatever is underneath the non-existent element. AKA the ground... And since you fire a shot. It is one penalty per shot fired up to the maximum scoring hits in that area per 10.2.3 That is what I would tell a competitor at a match I RM... I think you are reading too much into it.

Correct there is no procedural... there is no FTDR in USPSA.. Only said 8.3.1.1 for the moving away from start position...

Check 8.3.1.1 It does restrict moving without RO approval

Let me make sure I understand this... You are standing in the start position within reach of a port that is just and open/close port. The port does not activate anything. And the RO said if you open or close it during the make ready it is a procedural?

CZ is right... and I’ll add... rule 5.2.1.4 says if found without an RO will take you to a safe area and take appropriate corrective action...

Well it’s kinda required to keep up with stuff like this as an RM... ;-) Ken Nelson posted a method on how to handle this on the PractiScore blog.. I don’t have that link handy.... but if you want I’ll find it shortly.

https://uspsa.org/documents/minutes/20170228.pdf Check this...

This was in a BOD minutes post... It was in 2017 IIRC... let me look around....

Majors have been shot in up to hurricane conditions, via headlights, and heavy winds. Lightning is where the line is drawn for many.... For a major — if it was a total shutdown... next day or toss a stage are likely outcomes. The MD and RM will discuss and make a call...

I think there will have to be some kind of periodic changes document. People will print it out and need to have that document to keep track... Not sure what kind of doc you put out... but I’d be interested in seeing what you did compared to mine above...

There was a discussion and I can’t remember it if was Troy or another RMI... But it was mentioned that loaded or unloaded should be the same for all divisions. Facing direction is rule directed for PCC... where as start facing up dang loaded and holstered is ok for pistol... Also for pistol side... I would recommend all the same.. consider a production shooter with a problem. He/she goes to open... or single stack or limited.. so keeping all pistol the same would be an equitable idea... Regardless.. IMHO singling out a division for different start positions falls under the Troy rule -don’t be a dick... And the golden rule— just because you can doesn’t mean you should.

Currently here is my doc... https://www.dropbox.com/s/cue6bcw9idya206/Rulings-appendices-addendums%20V7.pdf?dl=0 It will go away in January.

There isn’t currently. I have a self done single file that has them all in.... once the new rule book comes out I’ll publish something somewhere as things are edited.