photoracer

My opinion is that at local matches if I am shooting 2 guns, either one rimfire and one centerfire or 2 rimfires I generally don't ask to paint between guns to save time. Heck some don't even want paint before their only gun. And on that note I realize if the RO calls a miss I have to eat it. Had that happen this last weekend, in the midst of my best full 8 stages ever. I would have been in the 80's if not for the miss. Still beat my best time by a couple of seconds. In a tier 2/3 match that's different but I tend to shoot my best scores in bigger matches.

Me and one of my buds are considering going down for the AL match also.

I am hoping, considering the newer even stricter gun and mag laws that have been proposed in CA, that for 2017 the match is moved to a gun friendlier state than California, the state I was born in. When I was a young man and people asked me where the place I was born is located I used to tell them it was about 2 miles from San Quentin Prison.

I am using one of their barrels but opted to use the MVB 9mm collapsible stock and its custom buffer and dual spring combo on my project. I wanted a short stock and this seems to be the way to go.

I have both the 1-4 and the 1.5-6 each now on 2 separate 3-gun ARs. Still like the scope after 4 years. I never had an issue hitting steel out to 400 yards even using cheap WM 55g Fed .223. Reticle works good even at 15y as a red dot on those pesky clay pigeons at the York 3-man/3-gun.

I built a 100% working PCC-9 AR in about the week it took me to get parts in. PSA lightweight SOCOM profile barrel upper was DPMS low profile I bought for another project some time ago MVB collapsible 9mm dedicated stock w/ custom buffer and springs off GB forged Glock mag lower off GB also ramped 9mm bolt also off GB Timney Comp Trigger (taken off one of my other ARs) AP Custom CF handguard (in house parts) Shallow angle grip from PSA (Umbrella Corp) C-More Railway (semi annual sale on Midway) FTF fake suppressor and barrel shroud ( for looks) 2 Glock 31 rd. mags 2 clear CTS 30 rd. mags I also ordered 4 MP-5 MOLLE mag pouches for a vest I have and a JP Comp and a YHM Annihilator FH. Did find that while rapid double taps don't move the red dot off the target triple taps do so going to experiment with how little porting it will take to remove that little issue. Most expensive item was the MVB stock (looks like the Troy but has a better lock/unlock button) at around $400. Bolt was $170, lower was about $225, barrel was $99, C-More was $205. Forgot what I paid originally for the grip, upper, trigger, and handguard. Total would have been around $1400 or so.

Well the Magpul Fixed Carbine has a cross bolt that squeezes the area of the buffer tube together so it is locked solid. I use a couple of them and they work. Still prefer the lever locking of the Ergo F93 Pro on my 3-gun AR. But the Magpul is a lighter solution. Locks better than some lever lockers like the Safariland (Rogers) Super Stock.

Built an AR-9 from scratch in about 10 days. Some parts came from GB, PSA, Midway, some came direct and some I had around here. So far 100% flawless with everything from WM Fed 115 to 147 reloads. Have not tried NATO 9mm as yet. Don't really need the power factor.

Generally yes as that is the normal way to do it. However if the shooter wants to check it immediately, then safing the stage and going to check has to be done. The few times its happened to me I have just gone the other way and checked it afterwards. Mainly because I can see the edger the majority of the time.

Well those are regular Rimfire divisions. Carry optics is a new division for defensive pistols with mini red dots on them, centerfire only. Unlike CFO, the big Open division, no barrel mods or comps or big mags or race holsters. Rimfires don't draw from holsters like centerfire guns have to. Sent from my XT1064 using Tapatalk

Well my own PCC only needs the BCG and my collapsible stock to arrive to be complete. Was not going to do one till later when I happen to find the PSA had 9mm SOCOM profile barrels in stock for $99 so I snapped one up. Peacemaker still will not allow them in SC matches but will in the Super Steel events. Stock will be in tomorrow and will steal the C-More off my STI again. BCG won't be in till next week. Wonder if I can find a ramped 9mm bolt in my neighborhood.

Rimfire carry optics? Did they add a new class? Seriously when it comes to red dots there is the C-More and then everything else.

My current best in Outer Limits is with RFPO. I outshot my previous best in RFRO in one of last years bigger matches (inspite of the fact that I usually shoot the rifle 10 seconds per match faster than the pistol). I shoot the stage outside-in in visual order, 1, 2, then move and 4, 3, S. When I move I hold the gun at about a 50 degree angle to the right from the centerline. In the first box I stand at the very back right side of the box, with my feet pointed to the right, right foot on the frame (all rimfire). once I hit #2 my feet are pointed in my direction of travel and I am aiming to put myself in the front left corner of the center box. With the gun traveling at about 50 degrees inside of the 180 line, when I get to the center box all I have to do is sweep the gun from right to left to nail the last three targets. The first time I tried this out I dropped my stage time by almost 5 seconds per gun. And remember in my case this is because of my knee problems and I do it in exactly 3 steps (4 if you count the right foot trailing but I start shooting as soon as the right foot crosses behind my left while in the air and I feel stable enough to fire). Reason I am slower with the rifle right now is I have not figured out yet what angle to carry it at when moving. I tried doing what I did in 3-gun and that did not help. But I think I have a solution for it but need to try it out.

I have listened to a lot of great shooters, BJ and KC included, and soon Max next month. KC told me to break the stage down into a two target group and a three target group. If you shoot the 2 groups the best way you can then the transition won't make a great difference. So I tried to shoot each stage, if possible, by finishing with the 3 target group shot L to R, which is my preferred method. So the 2.0 runs I got with RFRO and the 2.2 runs I got with RFPO in S&H were both shot that way. Even though I pass over #2 to get to #1 so I can shoot the last three in 1, 2, S. I shoot the first 2 in the order 4 then 3 to reduce the transition from group 1 to group 2. I do the same with the rimfire pistol. I have tried shooting CFO that way but because I have the draw and don't have to aim at a cone I find its easier to shoot 1, 2 ,3 ,4, S because I can set my upper body to face that direction. I have recently tried to shoot rimfire that way and I find I can't get close to the times shooting the other way. And like a number of shooters I routinely shoot Showdown faster than S&H. Finding the best position in the box is a good key to Showdown. In either box I shoot the targets in the same VISUAL order but not the same plate order, all shot with the left most visual target first then L to R and back to the Stop plate. Back in 2010 I used to shoot it similar to S&H splitting it into 2 groups but in the last 2 years I have gone to the other method. Its possible I might end up shooting S&H this way also but currently its slower than my old way. While on this subject one thing I think is really important. When Robby Orent was teaching me to shoot steel he told me something that sounded off at the time and to others who were not in his league. And that was shoot practice at 100% and shoot matches at 80%. What he meant by that was go for broke in practice to push yourself but shoot within yourself at a match. And if you happen to shoot a good set of runs then go for broke on the last one. I find my biggest problem is being consistent. If I shoot the first run within myself I generally will get a couple of tenths faster each run. If I happen to burn a really good one I usually end up with a makeup shot somewhere in at least one of the remaining runs. And thinking too much will cause you problems for sure.

True. One reason I set that up as my first stage in the back yard. Right now my rimfire scores are in the mid to high 2's but my CFO best is a high 3. Most of that can be the draw since this is one stage where getting that first plate tends to slow you down slightly compared to some of the other stages. Have not actually timed my first shots in practice but I am betting they are around 1.5s in CFO.

After getting the plastic lipped mags with my original CMMG conversion I went with steel lip BDM mags since then because they don't wear down from use and jams like the gray plastic lip mags do.

I would agree that most should be able to shoot the PCC in a similar speed range to RFRO so classifying a PCC as being the same as CFO should be incorrect.

If you spend too much time getting the grip right you need to break the draw down to its parts. Depending on where you like the holster position at on your belt you need to find what surrender position gives you the best angle or drop to put your hand on the grip as perfect as possible and rep it till you arm falls off. For me that was a position that only requires me to snap my forearm down while not having to move my upper arm. When I get to the line Robby got me to keep my left hand up and drop my right to the gun as many times as it takes to feel comfortable at that moment. Then when I do I hold both up and stay there so the RO knows to start the commands. Sometimes after that run I may only do one or two before the next run. I do it different depending on the gun type. For a 1911 I put my hand down with the thumb raised slightly so I can drop it and lever the safety off once the off hand it on the gun also. Don't have to do that with the Glock. But everyone is a little different. So break it down to part one getting your hand down onto the grip perfectly, part two clearing the holster and bringing it up to about chest high, part three putting your off hand in position and part four getting your sight picture and firing. Work on each part then put it together. Whatever happens you have to get your hand onto the gun's grip perfect 99% of the time.

Scott I assume when say you point shoot the first plate in S&H you mean because this discussion is first shot time. Its a rare run when I don't point shoot all 5 so I assume that is what you do also. I think my draw time to first shot is around 1 second. I worked closely with Robby Orent to get to that point around 2010 but then did not get to shoot SC for a few years. I know with rimfire its something like .6s or so. When I was doing that in 2010 in rimfire my 100% first hit speed was about .8s and .6s got me a hit rate of about 65%. With more SC matches to shoot around here the last few years its honed many of my skills from before. One thing I have added to my physical skills exercises is to stand next to a table and put say a 5# dumbbell on the table and practice drawing it off the table and putting my off hand around it as it comes up just like when doing the draw. I think it is a more pointed exercise than say just doing curls. I also do a rimfire pistol version by sitting in a chair and starting with the weight down low in both hands and pulling it up to the shooting position and holding it steady for enough seconds to simulate a run. I try to increase the reps weekly. At my age I am never sure how many I will get to do. 3# or 5# weighs are close enough to simulate the gun weight with extra weight in for muscle work. If you use the rubber covered grip type weights they don't feel that far from the gun. I once went as hi as 15# on the rimfire drill but have since decided that was too much. Even 10# seemed a little much.

I practice in my backyard range using subpar size targets at the normal distances, especially when shooting rimfire. One reason I bought a bunch of extra 8 and 10 inch targets so I could shoot 8 instead of 10 and 10 instead of 12. Helps sharpen up your accuracy so that when you get to a real match the targets seem big.

I noticed Scott at VQ is offering a carbon fiber barrel for the Victory, very similar to the barrels he makes for some of the Rugers. Hey Scott if you think the S&W 22A is heavy, my first rimfire pistol was the S&W 22S. Worked well with that steel frame for bullseye. I even cut away part of the top rail so I could mount a VQ V-Comp on the end for early steel matches I shot. Then I got wise and took my wife's Buckmark out of the safe and never looked back.

Some of the clubs I shoot at have a no pickup rule for any match but mainly for matches where you are doing reloads on the clock. Yes the various sport rules generally do not, except for NSSF Rimfire which I think does not allow it. Still anyone who attempts a reload on the clock in SC is asking for it (except maybe revolver)( or if you forgot to switch mags between runs). Some places will allow the RSO to pick up the mag for you once you safe the firearm.

OK I can understand your definition of real. Yeah if they ever get around to it. Right now my times for centerfire are smack in the middle of B class. My RFPO scores are about 40s less and my RFRO times are about 50s less. Hopefully when they finally decide on a scale that would put me in at least A class in rimfire.

OK. I have shot Ruger Rimfire since 2010 and Steel Challenge since 2009 and the rifle as soon as they allowed it. The key to fast times is generally a lightweight gun so the transitions can be faster. If you want to build the lightest rifle then here is what you want based on weight. Stock: Knoxx Axiom, by far the lightest thing you can put under an action. Most of the top rimfire rifle shooters showed up at the 2015 NSSF worlds using this stock. But you might not like the short trigger pull length Very good for a junior for precisely that reason. Also the Axiom has a very low cheek weld. While I have an Axiom stock I still prefer my Magnum Research thumbhole. Barrel: Regardless of what's printed most of the top lightweight barrels weigh about 15-16 ounces. That includes the Taccom, TacSol, and VQ Ultralight CF. The Kidd ULW weighs about 20 ounces as does the regular VQ CF barrel. Every barrel is plenty accurate enough for SCSA/NSSF targets at 40 yards and under so accuracy has little importance unless you happen to plan on using it for something else outside these matches. A comp, as mentioned does nothing for recoil or muzzle flip as they don't exist for a rifle. But it does help with the timer hearing the shot go off. Trigger: Get what you happen to like. If you like a Kidd, Timney, or VQ get one. You want a trigger with a pull weight in the 2-3 lb. range. Anything too much less invites the possibility of an AD. Sights: For irons I like the William Firesights which have smaller light tubes than TruGlo or HiViz. In fact they are about the size of the tubes in the Dawson sights on my Limited G34. For red dots I still recommend the C-More with a 12-16 MOA dot. I have used others but I like the larger window of the C-More since it will be a lot closer to your face than your pistol optics. BJ who used to run nothing but Aimpoint Micros on his open rimfire guns showed up last year using C-Mores. I recommend the Allchin mount on a 10/22. I used an S&W 15-22 from 2011 to 2014. It has everything I could do to lighten it up except for shortening or turning the barrel down. Super reliable however and fast shooting with a Geissele S3G trigger. But in late 2014 I built a 10/22 from scratch after winning a VQ Ultralight CF barrel at an NSSF Regional. I have used that since because it is over a pound lighter. You can actually build a sub 3 pound AR-22, using a Taccom barrel, magnesium lower and a lot of the Taccom carbon fiber furniture.

What do you mean by "real"? It's Steel Challenge which means movement on only 1 stage. It was designed to improve your skills for USPSA/IPSC although it has a life of its own. The design is to give shooters everywhere a chance to see how they stack up against the best so you know you are improving or not.There are several places in the US that have run and gun tactical rimfire matches although there are none in my area if that is what you are looking for..