CocoBolo

I recently acquired a "Dawson Built Competitor" 38 Super Comp that was sent to Dawson and repaired, just minor stuff. I have the receipt for the Dawson Repair and I also hear that he only works on guns he built. That probably means nothing. I paid $1650, the gun runs fine. (Blued not chromed). The competitor in the Picture and the one I have I will call heavy weights, being heavy and designed for the 175pf. I have a very light Open Gun and find the Cometitor enjoyable to shoot, it runs 100% is accurate. I did have to change loads and go with powder that works the comp as it should. I am using Accurate #7 10.2 gr at about 175pf shoots flat. From my reasearch these older guns run best with powder that takes 10+gr to make major as they produce enough gas. As a C class open the gun is much better and capable than I am, and one day I let a guy that never shot open in his life run a stage and he beat my time by 5 or 6 seconds. Not doing that again. I recall making an offer on the gun in the picture, if its the same one it only had a couple hundred rounds thru it and probalby being hard chromed it would be worth up to $1800. I didn't go there as I have two good open guns I don't shoot, after selling 3. I have gone back to the light Limited and I am having lots of fun shooting it. Maybe back to open next year. I put the money in a second reloading press XL650.

Since you have a little time on your hands and you have a caliper to measure the OAL, take a measurement on factory ammo, I think you will find it is about 1.150. I'm working on recall here and I think that I loaded my 9 mm JHP's at 1.140 not a big difference but it could possibly reduce pressure and might just be a little more accurate, and feed better. JHP's in general are loaded just a little shorter than FMJ RN. The FN are pretty short so they work in the gun. Make a few dummy rounds and try them in the gun and cycle them both fast and slow to make sure they fit feed and eject. 1.10 is in the load book for the XTP very similar to the MTG, but I consider that a minimum length. If you are not loading hot it is not that critical. The Shilloutte is on the slow end of the burn chart for a non compensated gun. Lots of Open gunners use it. You might want to try something a little faster once you run out of it. Good choices being WST, N320, TiteGroup, Solo 1000, RAM Shot Competiton, and American Select. These are faster powders and will cut recoil and flip at the same velocity. Shilloutte is about the same as IMR7625 another popular open gun powder. Always drop check the first few rounds to make sure they fit, (use sammi guage). The 9 mm requires a good crimp about -.002. When you start to drop check them you will find out if you have enough crimp or not. Its hard to mess up a jacketed bullet with too much crimp but it can be done. Refer to the rule: If brute force isn't working you are just not using enough. In reloading don't use brute force it will break something. In reloading it is all about feel, if it don't feel right you are about to break something on your reloader. Learn the feel of the machine while loading, if its too hard going down something has gone wrong don't ever force it. Same goes for ram up seating primers if you lifting the front of the bench you are way over the top, and something it going to snap. Happy reloading. At todays prices I am saving $240 ever 1000 rounds loading 40 S&W and I loaded 20,000 of them last year or $4800 more than enough to pay for my Dillon 650 and the Hornady LNL plus all the dies, scales, caliper, media seperator, shell sorter.

I'm shooting a Dawson High Performance Edge. It came with a Recoil Master, it lasted one match and sold it, put a regular guide rod and spring in it. The trigger was good but after 500 rounds I had my smith make it great, the gun rocks. Dawson has them on sale now. I have seen some pretty impressive shooting with the Brazos Pro limited gun, its lighter slide makes it cycle fast, I would definately trade my HP Edge on one of them. Have not seen a Bedell in action but he has an excellent reputation, and a light slide just differenct cuts. I would think that in Bowling Pin shooting you need the best accuracy you can get and a custom as a general rule is more accurate. I have only shot pins with a rifle, and it was a blast.

Checked my load book. This is interesting. 9 mm 124gr Montana gold = 4.7 gr WST 130pg OAL 1.150 40 S&W 185Gr Precision = 4.7 gr WST 170 pf OAL 1.180 45 ACP 200gr Precision = 4.7 gr of WST 170 pf. OAL 1.240 It just does not get any better than that load all 3 without changing the powder measure.

I would'n lose any sleep over those two easy classifiers, I'd be practicing a little strong hand weak hand getting ready for the Bad Bill Stage, it looks like its going to cause a lot of crying, especially those super go fast hot dogs that don't know how to slow down and have trouble finding their dot weak hand. On classifiers, points is the name of the game shoot only as fast as you can make good hits. On every thing else I shoot faster than I know I can. maybe that is the problem, heck I'm having fun. I'm getting faster all the time just by the smallest fraction of a second 1/1,000,000,000. Good Luck

WST works well with lead in 9, 40, and 45, never tried in it 38 Super as I only shoot major with JHP's. Tite group is also good in 9 and 40, it will smoke like an old freight train but it works well. WST is very similar to 231. Solo 1000 works well in 40 and 45, have not tired it in 9 or 38 Super. N320 very nice in the 40 and 45. IMR 7625 is a slower powder than the others listed here and is most often used in compensated guns, but I have shot some in 40 as well as 38 Super, 9 mm in std guns under very light bullets like 135gr 40. Powder preferences are more about the feel of the impluse in competition shooting so we tend to shoot what feels good even if it smokes a bit. It gets more complicated when you factor in bullet weight, some powders work great with a heavy bullet versus a lite bullet. Some powders are a little dirty but most will go to the end of a 400 round match without clogging the works except for wheel guns they need super clean powder. Hodgdon has their reloading data online http://data.hodgdon.com/main_menu.asp so you can look for loads in the bullet weight for each caliber and see what works. They don't have that many lead loads but some. Powder is plentiful these days and a pound will load from 700 to 1500 rounds depending on charge. One pound = 7000 grains, I wouldn't commit to an 8 lb keg till I know it works for me.

+ one with HSMITH on the LB Premier II. I just sent my entry in to American Handgunner for the one they are giving away. Its featured in the Sep/Oct Issue. It will need a TecWell and a Daswon Fiber Optic front sight before it goes out to compete in a SS USPSA meet. But then I wouldn't pay $50,000 for an Esclade just to get dead animal seat covers when the Tahoe gets there just as fast for $20,000 less. My SS is one of the cheapest guns I own. I won it at the Gator Last year. Built by Bruce Warren at BC Armory, Caspian frame and slide, it rocks.

I don't shoot IDPA much but on the draw I did notice a lot of shoulder movment, but this may be due to the hip movment I didn't catch mentioned in the prior post. If you can bring the holster a little more forward this might help to cut down that shoulder movment. But I think IDPA say it has to be .0000001 behind the hip bone. Most of what I know about drawing and reloading I got from the Matt Burkett videos.

The answer to this one is easy. You alwasy zero at a distance that will prevent mid range misses. Ok 8" plate out to 300 yards. The ideal thing would be to find a zero that would allow you to aim at the center of a plate at any distance and still make a hit. Holding over at distance is what I call guessing, getting a hit with this method I call an accident. First we would need to pick the right ammo. Here is a link to a ballistic chart for .223. While not stated it looks like everyone here is guessing an AR not an AK or Fal or M1A1. http://www.shootingtimes.com/ballistics/223_remington.html Once we have picked the correct ammo for the job its just a matter of a little math and then we don't have to do all that guessing. Its always good to test to make sure that you gun performs with the ammo as it is listed in the ballistics, and you did your math correctly.

Curt I have a little bit of HS6 if you want to give that one a ride as well as some N350. N350 shoots about same as TruBlue but less pressure, cleaner and cost twice as much. Zero's are easier to push so you could drop a 10th or two on the powder. If you are not going to use the 7625 put it in my trash can, it works great in 38 Super Major loads. So did they send the steel master by mistake I thougt you were getting a Trojan in 40?

I think that you will find the the Precion Moly bullet is about $2 per thousand more than the lead lubed. I tried the lead lubed but had feed issues so I went with what I knew worked and have not looked back. The bullets are very popular with local shooters and I got started with them in my limited gun as a GM friend uses them exclusively, in just about everything. They won't work in an open gun they tend to tumble. I ruined a CZ Barrel trying to dye its hair blonde with proxide and vinegar it got pitted. Maybe it was only rated for 14 minutes soaking instead of 15. Now I just use chore boy and elbow grease. I save a little money by buying 3 to 5 cases at a time. The mail man doesn't even attempt to put them in the box they never leave the postoffice till I go get them.

I use the Precision Molly bullets in 200 gr over 4.2gr of clays. I think the OAL is 1.240 or so, on SWC's it is 1.260. This load gives the gun a pulse very similar to my limited gun. My perception is that it is soft, seems pretty clean and accuracy is very good. The more I shoot the gun the less build up I have. I just put a couple patches over a brush wrap a little chore boy on it run it in and out a few times then follow up with some JB Bore Paste and it looks like a mirror. I run a 12lb variable recoil spring in it and it just seems to be very soft shooting and cycles very quckly. You spend more time reloading with single stack, get some Wilson Combat 47DE mags they have some room in them with 8 and make reloads easy, as does the TecWare TechWell, and a good extend mag release is essential. Single Stack ShootOut http://www.rivercityshooters.com 4th Sunday of September, its a blast.

BigH - I have 2 STI Edge's. One has an untold number of rounds thru it, it was built when STI was still in Austin, some STI Historian will tell us how old that is, bought it last year with 4 140 mags for $1500. The newer one I bought recently had 20 rounds down range Hard Chromed Dawson Super Tuned bought it for $1650 with 4 140 mags, so they are out there. Just watch the Classifieds here and on USPSA and also Gun Broker. It is better to by one Edge than 3 guns you don't like because they are cheaper. If you buy a new one get it from Brazos or Dawson and pay for the enhancment package its worth twice the money, because it will run when you get it, the trigger will be good, not excellent I had my Smith work it over after a 1000 rounds and its awesome now cost $50. With the money you save buying a used gun get a Dillon 650 with Case feeder and start loading. Good Luck

+1 Dq. And would be DQ at Safe Table as well.

12 stages counting the chrono. Extra rounds for make up shots and some just in case you have a re-shoot or two 325 is probably sufficient. I shipped 1000 up for two of us so we are good.

Alan - I did a round count on the stages and came up with 257, is that accurate? The stages are numbered 1 to 10 with two stage 3's making 11 stages, did I miss something?

Nick - That stage 5 looked like a killer to me, I don't think I would not go for the long shot option. When my friend Tom has a downer match I just tell him to give me a price on his gun and his dillion loader, go home and start unbolting the loader I'll go to the ATM. He can spend his Saturday's at the mall shopping with the wife. I recently Tanked the TX State Open with my open gun. Went home put it away got out my Limited gun forgot how much fun it is to shoot Limited. A couple weeks ago Tom and I were chrono'ing ammo, I could not even hit the paper behind the chrono with my open gun, the C-more adjustment screws were loose and it was hitting 6 inches high and 4 inches to the right. Why couldn't I figure that out in the heat of the match? Thats what the big matches do rattle your brain. Youv'e been thrown by the Bull, time to get back up in the saddle or go to the mall shopping for shoes and handbags.

After swearing by Hornady LNL I have recently gone Blue with a Dillon XL650 with case feeder. I just set the Dillon up the other night and the first thing that annoyed me was that darn low primer buzzer goes off about every 6 minutes. I got to get more primer tubes.

It is possble you are not seating the primers all the way. On the ones that didn'g go boom did you compare the firing pin dent to those that did go boom? If they are the same then the primers being seated is not the problem. On the first hit the firing pin seats the primer on the second hit it goes off. 4.6gr of TiteGroup is about right on a 115gr bullet I use 4.2gr on a 125gr bullet. 1.150 is factory length for a round nose bullet, flat nose bullets need to be shorter by a lot. I'm not a Glock person but in a CZ or 1911 a 13lb spring will only ignite Federal Primers reliably, have not used Rem primers. Always drop check your ammo either in the barrel or in a SAMMI gauge aka plunk checker.

I'm going to differ on this one. I have bought two used Edge's cheapest one was $1500. I have also bought and sold 5 open guns in the last year most expensive was $1650. Today on USPSA I saw a good starter open gun with mags for $1250. I'm a compulsive gun shopper and have watched the market everyday for the last year. Where is the expense, well in 38 SC its the brass, I solved that problem being an RO, got lots of it, just cost a lot of blood sweat and tears if you follow. 9 mm jacketed bullets are as cheap as 40 moly bullets. You use a little more powder but I use Accurate 7 about the same cost as WST just use 10gr instead of 4.7gr. Accurate 7 happens to work with older open guns that were built when the PF was 175 and those guns will shoot plenty fast for anything less than a Master. My cheapest open is a Briley El Presidente and it is modern with light weight slide, std barrel and EGW cone comp, lets just say it cost less than the good deal I saw today on USPSA. When you first pickup an open gun you will love how it lets you make hits, but once you start trying to go fast you will quickly learn it isn't that easy. Then you go to a match and people start asking you questions like you know something because your packing an open gun, too funny. If you can get a Limited gun I think they are just more fun to shoot.

If money is no object I will just get one of each. I started Limited with a CZ75 TS started Open with a Tanfo Gold Team, but I am on the STI/SV band wagon. I would get a custom Brazos Limited Gun in 40 and a custom Brazos Open gun in 38 Super Comp.

What brand is your dies? Are there a big difference between Hornady, LEE or Redding? I'm asking because of your experience with L-N-L, need advice on dies purchase (brand and models) for 9x19, please. Also I've heard that smaller pistol metering insert is sufficient for exact powder loads, is that true? Appreciate your valued reply. Best regards. I started out with Lee Dies then I tried a set of Dillon dies. I have replaced them all with Hornady Dies. Their expander is not a powder thru die and works much better than the powder thru die which was breaking some of my 38 Super Brass. The Hornady bullet seater has a sleve that aligns the bullet this just makes better ammo. The best is the Hornady sizing die it is just a lot smoother than the others, but be sure to buy extra decapping pins as you will break a few, this happens when a case falls over on the way in. I load 9, 38 Super, 40, 357, and 45's plus 223. I use all 5 stations with pistol as I use the non powder thru expander and the hornady taper crimp in stage 5, since my LNL is the wire ejector. (has case feeder). On the Dillon 650 I use Hornady dies but the Dillon expander in the powder die which I have to say is excellent.

You guys are not shooting mutch, I shoot 8 matches a month at $20.00 each and 6 major matches this year so just match fees alone are $2500 not including hotel or travel. I have $700 in air fare and 20 days hotel at say $75 average. 15,000 rounds of ammo a year at .15 per shot $2250 for ammo. So lets just rough it at $6000 or $500 per month, and let the small stuff slide. I started 1 1/2 years ago, with a milspec springfield, spent tons of money on guns and reloading equipment. Thats the don't ask don't tell. I just say I traded for it and that seems to work. Or I say I won it. I have won a few already, gotta love those random drawings.

The vast majory shoot an 8. A few 6's and at the extreme a 4. I have one gun with an 8 and one with a 6, both work well. At 50 yards the 6 might give a slight advantage but at 15 yards the 8 just seems quicker. I don't think its worth the cost of a dot module to change either one. I tend to shoot the 8 the most. I always crank it up all the way except in night shoots.

I have dummies and fill the mags to capacity. It is imperative with the Single Stack to do this. I do standing and running reloads. Yes, most of my reloads are moving so I practice them on the run in the back yard where I have my dummy dry fire stage set up. I start by running a few times to perfect the method then I get the timer out and work with it trying to go faster setting a repeating par time. With my open gun I practice getting back on dot and target after the reload, with the limited it just comes natural.