steel1212 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) I've shot a lot of single stack and to me it was just second nature, but not evidentially for everybody especially the newer shooters. I see this happen quite often. Somebody shooting SS or even production sometimes, will have a miss and it screws up their plan completely, not allowing them to get to their next reload point. Here is my advice and take it as you will. We have to much to think about to try to come up with a new plan on the fly. If you have have a 8 round array and end up needing 10 shots to finish is in SS before you next reload point, do your reload as planned and continue on with your plan. Don't do a reload to finish the array then go on as all your other reload points are now messed up and your counting rounds. Another example, you have a texas star and you don't clean it in 9 rounds needing a reload in the middle of it. Your plan was to reload after the star, so do it and get back on plan. There is a reason we carry so many mags on our belt, USE THEM. Just a tip from your fellow single stack advisor lol Edited June 11, 2009 by steel1212 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshF Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Don't forget to add if you are needing to go to that extra mag to SLOW DOWN. I've seen a ton of shooters do that extra reload only to continue like that the rest or the stage. If you aren't hitting anything.... something is wrong that going 110% and adding a reload won't fix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airedale Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I've shot a lot of single stack and to me it was just second nature, but not evidentially for everybody especially the newer shooters. I see this happen quite often. Somebody shooting SS or even production sometimes, will have a miss and it screws up their plan completely, not allowing them to get to their next reload point. Here is my advice and take it as you will. We have to much to think about to try to come up with a new plan on the fly. If you have have a 8 round array and end up needing 10 shots to finish is in SS before you next reload point, do your reload as planned and continue on with your plan. Don't do a reload to finish the array then go on as all your other reload points are now messed up and your counting rounds. Another example, you have a texas star and you don't clean it in 9 rounds needing a reload in the middle of it. Your plan was to reload after the star, so do it and get back on plan. There is a reason we carry so many mags on our belt, USE THEM. Just a tip from your fellow single stack advisor lol Good advice-when I read the thread title, I thought you meant lower mental capacity. Revolver will teach the same lesson. Get back to the plan. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMoore Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) I just want to reword it so that I make sure I know what you're saying... If you take extra rounds in an array, and end up having to reload and shoot 1 or 2 (or 4) more rounds before leaving the array, reload after leaving the array even if the mag has 5-6 rounds left in it, because that gets you back on your plan. Is that right? Edited June 11, 2009 by RobMoore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nwb01 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I learned that little trick a few years ago. It works very well and doesn't really change anything with your plan AFTER the extra reload. Things happen during a CoF and reloading as planned is a good way to keep your head in it. Thanks for re enforcing something it is already learned but never should be forgotten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeFoley Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I've shot a lot of single stack and to me it was just second nature, but not evidentially for everybody especially the newer shooters. I see this happen quite often. Somebody shooting SS or even production sometimes, will have a miss and it screws up their plan completely, not allowing them to get to their next reload point. Here is my advice and take it as you will. We have to much to think about to try to come up with a new plan on the fly. If you have have a 8 round array and end up needing 10 shots to finish is in SS before you next reload point, do your reload as planned and continue on with your plan. Don't do a reload to finish the array then go on as all your other reload points are now messed up and your counting rounds. Another example, you have a texas star and you don't clean it in 9 rounds needing a reload in the middle of it. Your plan was to reload after the star, so do it and get back on plan. There is a reason we carry so many mags on our belt, USE THEM. Just a tip from your fellow single stack advisor lol Good advice-when I read the thread title, I thought you meant lower mental capacity. Revolver will teach the same lesson. Get back to the plan. Dave Revolver is lower mental capacity, for guys who can only count to six. You are always out of ammo IMO. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshF Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Revolver is lower mental capacity, for guys who can only count to six. You are always out of ammo IMO. LOL Careful.... Same could be said of certain Singlestack shooters by the Production crowd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeFoley Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Revolver is lower mental capacity, for guys who can only count to six. You are always out of ammo IMO. LOL Careful.... Same could be said of certain Singlestack shooters by the Production crowd That's it, I'm going to Open, you know, the blind man's division, haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkrispies Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Revolver is lower mental capacity, for guys who can only count to six. You are always out of ammo IMO. LOL Actually, I'll favor a reload at 6 rather than 8 if the stage design will allow it. That way I'll still have the ammo even if I need to take an insurance shot or miss a popper. Regarding the reload before moving on if you need extra shots-- if I'm making a big movement, I'm reloading anyway. Like you said, I've got four on the belt, one in the gun, and probably another three tucked in various pockets. It's not like I'm short of mags!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Getting back on plan is very useful skill, and not just with the reloads. Being able to quickly do whatever you need to do to get back to what you were doing before things went pear shaped for whatever reason is a critical skill, I think. One of my buddies is nowdays a better shooter then I am, but for the longest time he had the hardest time getting back on plan once something went wrong. Once he had improved on that, he started kicking my ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I just want to reword it so that I make sure I know what you're saying...If you take extra rounds in an array, and end up having to reload and shoot 1 or 2 (or 4) more rounds before leaving the array, reload after leaving the array even if the mag has 5-6 rounds left in it, because that gets you back on your plan. Is that right? YES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztecdriver Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I've shot a lot of single stack and to me it was just second nature, but not evidentially for everybody especially the newer shooters. I see this happen quite often. Somebody shooting SS or even production sometimes, will have a miss and it screws up their plan completely, not allowing them to get to their next reload point. Here is my advice and take it as you will. We have to much to think about to try to come up with a new plan on the fly. If you have have a 8 round array and end up needing 10 shots to finish is in SS before you next reload point, do your reload as planned and continue on with your plan. Don't do a reload to finish the array then go on as all your other reload points are now messed up and your counting rounds. Another example, you have a texas star and you don't clean it in 9 rounds needing a reload in the middle of it. Your plan was to reload after the star, so do it and get back on plan. There is a reason we carry so many mags on our belt, USE THEM. Just a tip from your fellow single stack advisor lol Just a note to confirm this, from a fairly new shooter - I did just this two weeks ago at SC Sectionals, and it was on a stage with a star. It was more of a bad plan - or over confidence at my part, but I was running a clean match for a C level guy. I had one M through 3 stages (and that one was 1/2 inch inside hard cover I thought I made up), and for some reason - I made my plan to go one for one on the star, which started off that stage, then take two targets coming off the star before my first reload. The star did what it was supposed to and I ended up thowing three extra shots at it. Reloaded early in the plan, took the next two - but then continued on without reloading again as planned. I got caught with a flatfooted reload in the middle of an array of 4 subsequent targets and remembered thinking to myself "I should have been at slidelock but wasnt'" --- mag in and continued - and ran past a target- my first FTE ever. Then, because I was shaken at how badly things had gotten I proceeded to throw another M and 3 deltas (up until that point I had 4 deltas for 3 stages). Definition of trashed, all because the plan went bad - then wasn't corrected. Don't forget to add if you are needing to go to that extra mag to SLOW DOWN. I've seen a ton of shooters do that extra reload only to continue like that the rest or the stage. If you aren't hitting anything.... something is wrong that going 110% and adding a reload won't fix Yep, same stage, the only mag bungle I had the whole match was trying to catch up - pulled the mag out of the pouch without the right grip and tried to put it in the gun on a 45 degree angle front to back. I looked like a dweeb i'm sure - thankfully no one video'd that mess. Make a good plan, with contingencies Stick with the plan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve J Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Make sure you can finish those nasty 32-round stages if you're gong to leave a nearly full magazine behind in order to get back on plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted June 11, 2009 Author Share Posted June 11, 2009 I just want to reword it so that I make sure I know what you're saying...If you take extra rounds in an array, and end up having to reload and shoot 1 or 2 (or 4) more rounds before leaving the array, reload after leaving the array even if the mag has 5-6 rounds left in it, because that gets you back on your plan. Is that right? YES What he said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMoore Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Make sure you can finish those nasty 32-round stages if you're gong to leave a nearly full magazine behind in order to get back on plan. Might have to bust out a RWR for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Smith Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 The fellow who I relied upon for advise last year when I was first shooting production advised me to come to the line with 5 mags and to try and plan stages to change mags after 8 shots. Doesn't work out all the time, but it helps. We won't talk about the stages the 3 open shooters set up at one match - can you say "no natural mag change points"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMoore Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Was that 5 total, or 5 on the belt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 In many years of shooting IPSC, this never occurred to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xcelr8hard Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 Oddly enough, it never occured to me either. I need to get some more mag pouches. Butch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 I go to the line with 6 mags on my belt, and one in my pocket. I use the pocket mag to chamber a round, then take the mag furthest to the rear to load in the gun, I take the mag that is down 1, which I chambered a round from, and put it in the furthest rear position. This is how I start EVERY stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighVelocity Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 (edited) When shooting SS, I've got 4 on my belt and have used them all on a stage. At the DTC I wore 5. I don't recall which stage it was but I didn't get the mag seated on a reload while running to another shooting position so I just kept running and grabbed the next one off my belt. It worked out fine. That 5th mag was mighty useful. Now it's always 5 on the belt. Edited June 12, 2009 by HighVelocity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_SC Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 If you take extra rounds in an array, and end up having to reload and shoot 1 or 2 (or 4) more rounds before leaving the array, reload after leaving the array even if the mag has 5-6 rounds left in it, because that gets you back on your plan. I don't know that this applies to me, once the buzzer goes off I don't remember the plan anyway. Just a note to confirm this, from a fairly new shooter - I did just this two weeks ago at SC Sectionals, and it was on a stage with a star. It was more of a bad plan - or over confidence at my part, but I was running a clean match for a C level guy. I had one M through 3 stages (and that one was 1/2 inch inside hard cover I thought I made up), and for some reason - I made my plan to go one for one on the star, which started off that stage, then take two targets coming off the star before my first reload. The star did what it was supposed to and I ended up thowing three extra shots at it. Reloaded early in the plan, took the next two - but then continued on without reloading again as planned. I got caught with a flatfooted reload in the middle of an array of 4 subsequent targets and remembered thinking to myself "I should have been at slidelock but wasnt'" --- mag in and continued - and ran past a target- my first FTE ever. Then, because I was shaken at how badly things had gotten I proceeded to throw another M and 3 deltas (up until that point I had 4 deltas for 3 stages). Definition of trashed, all because the plan went bad - then wasn't corrected. That stage was my first one for the match. I ran the star like a pro, cleaning it very quickly and with 5 rounds. I spun around and took off for the next target like a hero, reloading as I ran. I managed to get the feed lip outside the edge of the grip and hung up, and stood there for about half an hour (it seemed like) trying to get the magazine to go into the gun. Unfortunately, it WAS on video, but I haven't gotten my hands on it yet. It was a sign of things to come, I had problems with my reloads all day. I don't have a magwell or bumpers on my single stack, both would have helped greatly. Or, not fumbling to start with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueridge Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 (edited) It took me shooting awhile to come to this decision, but I simply engage the targets as they come. I don't plan on reloads at a certain point, but rather as I need them. This way if something like a texas star causes a problem it does not mess up my plan. I do plan on a pattern of how I intend to engage arrays, but that is seperate from reloading for me. Now I understand that it may be more efficient to plan more like what has been mentioned earlier in the thread, but for now what I do works for me. I shoot revolver division and have 7 speedloaders on my belt and two in my pocket. One of those in my pocket is used to make ready, and the other if things go REALLY bad. Even on 32 round courses I don't think that I have used more than 42 rounds. Edited June 12, 2009 by Blueridge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted June 13, 2009 Author Share Posted June 13, 2009 Guys always have more ammo on your belt than you think you'll ever need! Look at a lot of limited shooters. I know when I shoot limited, I start with the gun loaded to 20-21, have a 19-20 round reload mag and a 19 round back up. That gives me almost 60 rounds to finish the biggest 32 round stage. I see a lot of SS shooters go to the line with one in the gun and 4 mags. That is barely enough rounds to finish a 32 round stage. I take 6 on my belt and one in the gun. Doesn't matter if I'm shooting a 10 round stage or a 32 round stage its always the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Guys always have more ammo on your belt than you think you'll ever need! Look at a lot of limited shooters. I know when I shoot limited, I start with the gun loaded to 20-21, have a 19-20 round reload mag and a 19 round back up. That gives me almost 60 rounds to finish the biggest 32 round stage. I see a lot of SS shooters go to the line with one in the gun and 4 mags. That is barely enough rounds to finish a 32 round stage. I take 6 on my belt and one in the gun. Doesn't matter if I'm shooting a 10 round stage or a 32 round stage its always the same. What he said. 6 +1 for me too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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