Concealed Carry Laws

[kgunz11]

Georgia law states that you can carry a concealed weapon to a "public meeting". That has been defined as anything like a sporting event such as a football or basketball game.

I hate shopping malls during the holiday season and always feel a little edgy walking across the parking lots after dark. Can you legally carry a concealed weapon to a shopping mall or is that considered a "place of public meeting"?

In Georgia, we can now carry concealed on public transportation, thanks to all the thugs robbing people on MARTA in the Atlanta area. You still cannot carry in a Government building, Church, School, or anywhere alcohol might be the mainstay of a business (use to be anywhere alcohol is sold, you CAN carry in a restaurant now, just not in a bar)

What about other states?

[want2race]

One note on GA rules though, you must use a carrying devise designed to carry a pistol. No gangsta carry in the waistband! I just read that a month ago. If you carry in a pocket, you have to use a pocket holster.

KY is very good. If a mall is a public gathering place, so are movie theaters, restaurants, gas stations etc. I'm not a lawyer but I would carry in the mall unless there were signs posted preventing it and your state makes you abide by those signs. In KY a "NO CCW" is sign is merely a suggestion to be ignored unless it is a place on the list (court house, school, bar etc). For example, in Louisville, they banned CCW in some inner city parks. Nope, got overturned. No city, district, area etc can impose more stringent bans than the state has set forth.

KY also passed a law that forbids employers restricting guns in employees cars. They can't do it, can't search your car. Carry loaded gun in glove box, totally legal, no permit required, no employer can restrict that (EXCEPT federal land like Ft. Cambel).

[Bill Nesbitt]

Here's a good web site. http://www.handgunlaw.us/

[kgunz11]

One note on GA rules though, you must use a carrying devise designed to carry a pistol. No gangsta carry in the waistband! I just read that a month ago. If you carry in a pocket, you have to use a pocket holster.

KY is very good. If a mall is a public gathering place, so are movie theaters, restaurants, gas stations etc. I'm not a lawyer but I would carry in the mall unless there were signs posted preventing it and your state makes you abide by those signs. In KY a "NO CCW" is sign is merely a suggestion to be ignored unless it is a place on the list (court house, school, bar etc). For example, in Louisville, they banned CCW in some inner city parks. Nope, got overturned. No city, district, area etc can impose more stringent bans than the state has set forth.

KY also passed a law that forbids employers restricting guns in employees cars. They can't do it, can't search your car. Carry loaded gun in glove box, totally legal, no permit required, no employer can restrict that (EXCEPT federal land like Ft. Cambel).

If I remember correctly, you cannot carry in any State in a movie theater, I think that can be contributed to Abe/Booth. It's Federal law.

[JKSNIPER]

Talk to your local PD's pistol lic section and to a LAWYER FIRST before acting on any advice you get here.

I say talk to the PD first since they will be the ones responding to see you if they get called reference you carrying your weapon.

I say talk to a lawyer because while many of the people here are knowledgeable and well meaning they may be wrong.

AND ask to see the relavent section of the law in writing for your own peace of mind.

You would not get medical advice from a cab driver so don't take legal advice from guys and gals who may/may not be lawyers.

If I had a dollar for every time I have had someone try to give me their personal interpertation of the penal law.......

Good luck.

JK

[kgunz11]

Here's a good web site. http://www.handgunlaw.us/

That's interesting, GA, AL, and MS don't honor SC CCW permits, nor does SC reciprocate. I wonder what's going on there?

[kgunz11]

Talk to your local PD's pistol lic section and to a LAWYER FIRST before acting on any advice you get here.

I say talk to the PD first since they will be the ones responding to see you if they get called reference you carrying your weapon.

I say talk to a lawyer because while many of the people here are knowledgeable and well meaning they may be wrong.

AND ask to see the relavent section of the law in writing for your own peace of mind.

You would not get medical advice from a cab driver so don't take legal advice from guys and gals who may/may not be lawyers.

If I had a dollar for every time I have had someone try to give me their personal interpertation of the penal law.......

Good luck.

JK

I have found it more often than not that a large portion of local LE don't know the CCW laws. I've had to break out the paperwork and show them in writing more than once.

[want2race]

Hence the "I'm not a Lawyer" tag in my first post. Things I suggest are things I do, your results may vary.

If you can find a link to a federal law prohibiting movie theater carry, please post.

[kgunz11]

This is from the FAQ's page on GeorgiaCarry.org

Places Off Limits

For those with a GFL or vistiting Georgia with a reciprocal permit

Q: Can I carry to or at church?

A: No. In fact, you cannot even have a firearm in your glovebox in your car in the parking lot during services. Churches and “church functions” are specifically listed in the public gathering law, Code section 16-11-127, as places where it is illegal to carry a firearm “to or while at.” You will note that “to” is different from “while at,” so that it is illegal to carry a firearm “to” church. The courts have expanded the definition of public gathering to include the parking lot of a public gathering and leaving a firearm in a car off premises up to 200 yards away.

Q: What is a public gathering?

A: Good question! The short answer is, “Who knows?”

A less flippant answer is that the public gathering law, O.C.G.A. § 16-11-127, has a specific list of places that are off limits. Unfortunately for us, the definition of a public gathering “includes, but is not limited to” the list, so there are other places off limits. The list is:

athletic or sporting events

churches or church functions

political rallies or functions

publicly owned or operated buildings

establishments at which alcoholic beverages are sold for consumption on the premises and which derive less than 50 percent of their total annual gross food and beverage sales from the sale of prepared meals or food.

Beyond the five places listed, a public gathering is any place that the public “is gathered or may gather for a particular function.” State v. Burns. Some places that have been held to be a public gathering by courts include the parking lot of a public gathering, a crowd of bored teenagers in a parking lot, the parking lot of an auto auction. Hubbard v. State, Jordan v. State. The only place that has been held not to be a public gathering in a reported appellate case is McDonalds. State v. Burns.

There has been a great deal of debate over whether movie theaters are public gatherings. The lawyers in GCO tend to believe that movie theaters fit the case law definition of a public gathering, while some GCO members report openly carrying pistols in movie theaters in the presence of police officers without being arrested.

The truth is, nobody seems to know what is a public gathering, including police officers, prosecutors, and courts, so please exercise caution while carrying a firearm or other weapon near a crowd.

Please make sure to read the history of why Georgia has a public gathering law. It is not what you think.

[kgunz11]

This one is particularly interesting:

Q: Can I carry on a Greyhound bus?

A: No, they are off limits due to federal law. (18 U.S.C. 922 (e))

These and others can be found on:

http://www.georgiacarry.org/cms/georgias-c...sked-questions/

[bbbean]

One note on GA rules though, you must use a carrying devise designed to carry a pistol. No gangsta carry in the waistband! I just read that a month ago. If you carry in a pocket, you have to use a pocket holster.

That shouldn't be a matter of law, but of good common sense! Too many things can go wrong with a loose gun in a pocket, waistband, or purse/bag. Whatever you carry, a good holster is your friend!

[revchuck]

Talk to your local PD's pistol lic section and to a LAWYER FIRST before acting on any advice you get here.

I say talk to the PD first since they will be the ones responding to see you if they get called reference you carrying your weapon.

I say talk to a lawyer because while many of the people here are knowledgeable and well meaning they may be wrong.

AND ask to see the relavent section of the law in writing for your own peace of mind.

You would not get medical advice from a cab driver so don't take legal advice from guys and gals who may/may not be lawyers.

If I had a dollar for every time I have had someone try to give me their personal interpertation of the penal law.......

Good luck.

JK

I have found it more often than not that a large portion of local LE don't know the CCW laws. I've had to break out the paperwork and show them in writing more than once.

+1. I was stopped for speeding (68 in a 55 zone) by a local deputy, and informed him as I handed over my documents (with the CHL on top) that I was carrying, as LA law requires. He was utterly confused by that, and asked several times if I was LE. Fortunately, he didn't freak out, and was professional about it, but it was obviously the first time he had encountered that situation.

OTOH, the cops I shoot with are up to speed on such things.

[ima45dv8]

Georgia law states that you can carry a concealed weapon to a "public meeting". That has been defined as anything like a sporting event such as a football or basketball game.

Didn't you mean, "...cannot carry a concealed weapon to a public gathering"?

I hate shopping malls during the holiday season and always feel a little edgy walking across the parking lots after dark. Can you legally carry a concealed weapon to a shopping mall or is that considered a "place of public meeting"?

Yes, you certainly can. There's case law in GA that establishes shopping malls as a collection of individual businesses and not a public gathering (thankfully!).

In Georgia, we can now carry concealed on public transportation, thanks to all the thugs robbing people on MARTA in the Atlanta area. You still cannot carry in a Government building, Church, School, or anywhere alcohol might be the mainstay of a business (use to be anywhere alcohol is sold, you CAN carry in a restaurant now, just not in a bar)

Actually, it wasn't whether alcohol was sold, but if sold for the purpose of consumption on the premises. That meant you could carry in a liquor store or grocery store with a beer/wine section but not in a bar or restaurant that served booze.

There's even case law in GA that extends the definition of places that, "...serve alcohol for the purpose of consumption on the premises" to include private functions, like Sunday football parties and birthday celebrations in private residences, if alcohol is served. I'm curious to see how that will be affected by the recent change in GA carry restrictions. That wouldn't be a restaurant, so how they'll rule on that in the future is anyone's guess.

**And before anyone starts waving their arms in a panic, I'm not in favor of watching the Superbowl with a bunch of likkered-up folks. I'm just wondering aloud about the application of our newly revised statutes.

[High Lord Gomer]

South Carolina will only honor resident permits from states that have as strict, or stricter, requirements to get a CWP as SC does. GA doesn't require the 8 hour class nor the proficiency qualification so SC won't honor GA's. GA won't honor SC's because SC won't honor GA's. As a SC resident, though, I can get a NH non-resident permit which GA will honor. People visiting SC cannot do something similar, though, as SC only recognizes resident permits from reciprocal states, not non-resident ones.

For anyone who lives in SC, as well as anyone who wishes that they could travel to and carry in SC, please join: http://www.scfirearms.org/

They very actively fight for gun owners' rights in SC and also work toward making SC honor CWPs from other states. If you want them to be successful, they need your help.

[kgunz11]

Yes IMA45DV8, I meant you CAN NOT carry to a public meeting place.

Georgia will actually let you carry now to a place of business that sells alcohol as long as 50% or more of their sales comes from food. So yeah, you CAN carry in Hooters now

[High Lord Gomer]

**And before anyone starts waving their arms in a panic, I'm not in favor of watching the Superbowl with a bunch of likkered-up folks.

Oh well...disregard that PM asking for directions to your house, then.

[High Lord Gomer]

Yes IMA45DV8, I meant you CAN NOT carry to a public meeting place.

Georgia will actually let you carry now to a place of business that sells alcohol as long as 50% or more of their sales comes from food. So yeah, you CAN carry in Hooters now

As I understand it, you can carry but cannot drink while there, though...right?

[Rob Boudrie]

Here in MA the only off limit place is schools. No bar ban, public gathering ban, no binding signage bans, no public building bans (though courthouses and the statehouse have metal detectors, but generally offer a gun checking service). The downside is that the local chief of police has nearly unlimited discretion as to whom can carry (the courts have held that a chief can revoke all handgun ownership rights for a citizen because he exercised his right to remain silent when questioned by the police).

The trend is that states with recent non-discretionary laws have a longer list of banned places than states with either very old carry laws, or discretionary laws designed to allow only a privileged class of people carry. The older laws were not passed in a climate of opposition (since, way back when, any "carry permit law" was actually adding a restriction on what people could do, not lessening restrictions).

The GA airport case was interesting - the court refused to rule the airport was not a "public gathering" not because of what a public gathering is, but because of the conclusion that would validate the right to carry in the non-sterile section of the Atlanta airport.

[kgunz11]

Yes IMA45DV8, I meant you CAN NOT carry to a public meeting place.

Georgia will actually let you carry now to a place of business that sells alcohol as long as 50% or more of their sales comes from food. So yeah, you CAN carry in Hooters now

As I understand it, you can carry but cannot drink while there, though...right?

That is correct. If you are carrying you cannot drink. That info is on GeorgiaCarry.org

[davidwiz]

Here in NJ, you have to be JT-friendly with your local judge in order to get a CCW.

[gose]

I know my state's laws... I'm screwed.

[zhunter]

I prefer to be judged by 12, rather than carried by 6

Just stay away from state and federal building, schools, and sporting events.

YMMV

[MichiganShootist]

Michigan requires a 10 hour (NRA based) class to get a license. I have been teaching that class for 8 years.... so I'm very comfortable that I know my state laws inside and out.... but as has been indicated every state has it's own CPL/CCW laws and they are often very confusing and without logic.

For example in my state I can carry concealed or not any number of handguns that I want... but carrying a can of mace or a tazer will earn me a loss of my pistol license and jail time.... Go Figure.

Based on those years of teaching the class and hearing from LEOs, lawyers, prosecutors, and former students.... here are a few related thoughts.

1. A great many of LEOs I have talked with who are not command level officers are often very wrong in their understanding of "carry" laws... hell they have thousands of laws to keep up with. I have seen and hear hundreds of horror stories because of just this one fact.

2. In the past 10 years the vast majority of states in the U. S have made major changes to their laws... in some states 4 or 5 total re-writes in that time frame... so it's no wonder there is confusion.

3. You are better off if you are stopped by a big city police officer, or state trooper... because in my experience they are much better trained than a county or township deputy will be. (state laws vary on how or if you are to disclose to an LEO that you are "packin" and every agency has trained their people to deal with armed citizens in a different way)

4. I would suggest contacting a lawyer who is familier with your states gun laws (not all are) or a representative of your prosecuter's office, or the state attorney general's office if you have questions The Prosecuters office is the organization that is telling the LEOs how and what to enforce.

5. Recioprocity means a very different thing in each state. If you plan on crossing a state line make damn sure you know the laws where you are headed. Through the www site MCRGO.net you can reach the state attorney general's office in all 50 states.

6. Getting legal advice from guys at the gun counter or buddies at the gun club can get you in VERY BIG trouble.

Good luck and be safe.

[steel1212]

If I remember correctly, you cannot carry in any State in a movie theater, I think that can be contributed to Abe/Booth. It's Federal law.

From the KSP website. I can't find anywhere that says I can't carry in the movies. I personally don't like not packing in dark movie theatres.

A concealed firearm or other deadly weapon SHALL NOT be carried in the following places:

Police station or sheriff's office.

Detention facility, prison or jail.

Courthouse (Court of Justice, courtroom or court proceeding).

County, municipal, or special district governing body meetings.

Meeting of governing body of a county, municipality, or special district.

General Assembly session, including committee meetings.

Any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense beer or alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to that purpose.

Elementary or secondary school facilities (without the consent of school authorities).

Child-caring facilities, day care centers, or any certified family child care home.

Areas within an airport where restricted access is controlled by the inspection of persons or property.

Any place where federal law prohibits the carrying of a firearm.

In addition to the above restrictions, units of state and local governments and postsecondary education facilities (colleges, universities, technical schools and community colleges) have the authority to limit the carrying of concealed weapons on property owned or controlled by them (KRS 237.115). You should check with units of state and local government as well as postsecondary education facilities prior to carrying a concealed weapon on their property.

Also, KRS 527.070 prohibits unlawful possession (whether carried openly or concealed) of a weapon on school property, except for certain specified exceptions. KRS 244.125 prohibits loaded firearms (concealed or otherwise) in places where alcohol is sold by the drink, except for certain specified exceptions.

In addition, Kentucky law does not prohibit the owners of private premises from excluding persons carrying firearms. Failure to vacate private premises when asked to do so could result in a criminal trespass charge.

[MichiganShootist]

Getting legal advice from guys at the gun counter or buddies at the gun club can get you in VERY BIG trouble.

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