Ron Ankeny Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 I got busted for a failure to right today and the 20 second penalty cost me the match. The match director had cover set up on most of the stages and we had several new shooters. It got comical listening to the SO's shouting "cover" and the good natured ribbing was priceless with the joking about "at least make and effort". It was a great match with good stages and everyone was having fun. To top it off, the weather was just beautiful. Well we get to about the fifth stage and there is a 55 gallon drum laying horizontal on the ground with a target stick on each side to keep it from rolling. There are five targets to be engaged in tactical order and I was shooting CDP so I would need to do a slide lock reload behind cover. The guys were really struggling to stay low enough to keep behind the drum. I walked up to the match director and asked him, "How do you expect me to hide my big ass behind that thing? Roll over prone?" To which he replies, "Just do what you have to do." I called him "evil" and a "range Nazi." Well it's my turn to shoot and the buzzer goes off. I reached down, grabbed the drum, set it on end and commenced to blaze away. After unloading and showing clear I turn around to find the gallery laughing their butts off and a couple of them even had tears in their eyes. The SO and score keeper were dumb founded. The match director marches forward with an evil grin on his face and says, "Nice try, that will be 20 seconds for failure to do right and a procedural for not getting enough of your big ass behind the barrel after you set it up." Gosh, I always thought creativity was supposed to be rewarded, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratochief Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 I think what this guy has forgotten is that it is ONLY a game. Lets be real here, if someone is physically too big or medically unable, they shouldn't be forced to go prone when everyone else can take a knee. I have a very bad back and refuse to go prone for anyone, my MD has no problem with that and as long as I make an effort to do my best without hurting myself, nothing is ever said about it. I honestly would have told him what he could have done with a FTDR if he tried to stick it on me. Glad you had a good match though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted July 7, 2003 Author Share Posted July 7, 2003 Stratochief: Actually, it was all in good fun. I could have gotten down behind the drum and won high overall without a problem. I just pulled my little stunt for giggles and laughs. Had you been at the match the MD (he is a good guy) would have let you shoot from a knee and as long as you made an effort nothing would be said. Now ya gotta admit, taking a horizontal barrel and setting it up in the vertical position has to be worthy of the FTDR. If not, all of my efforts were in vain, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 We, the Smarta**es among you, Salute you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 They should've GIVEN you 20 sec's for cleverness!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 Ron, Way to go, Dude. I second what Rhino said. Guys just wanna have fun. Bill Nesbitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 Ron The jungle durms have told me that Bill Wilson is even now breaking out in Hives, for your transgression and insubordination. Way to Go!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 I'll remember my comrades when my habit of wearing kneepads (while wearing shorts) results in my own FTDR penalty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDean Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 Ya, IDPA.... I love to shoot competitively but IDPA matches always tests my resolve. The last match I shot, I was issued a procedural because the slide locked back on the last round and I dumped the mag. I looked down at the gun...saw the slide locked to the rear...dropped the mag on the ground and loaded another one. I wasn't counting rds, I just thought I was out of ammo! There was still a round in the mag on the ground, hence the "leaving ammo behind" crap. The real kicker was the reasoning the (IDPA ONLY) shooter/SO used. "You're an IPSC guy,..how do I know those aren't trick mags or something?.." I suppose the correct-survival-minded-street-smart IDPA thinking would be to take 2-3 seconds in an attempt to make that one (1) last round in that magazine fire? Then I suppose I should reload, right? So that's 2+ seconds to somehow make the gun fire that last round, 2 seconds to relocate the target and shoot and then 3 seconds for the reload before the next shot. That's 7 seconds with ONE shot fired! Ladies and gentlemen welcome to the real world, you have just been raped by the bad guy. Ah hell,..IDPA 's still fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h4444 Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 Mental note,,,,, Next IDPA match,,,,,pick up barrel,,,,weak handed,,,,,,,,carry it covering torso,,,,,,,run'n gun IPSC style....... I'm a big boy too,,,,, Just kidding,,,,would be funny,,,,but unsafe with all the weight.... Mental image is funny though...... Ron, you've inspired the smarta$$ in me. I generally always abide strictly by the rules since most of the local IDPAers know my forte is USPSA, I take enough BS from them anyway. I like kickin' their butts at their own game. I like IDPA,,,,most of the locals are awesome to shoot with, but we've got a couple trolls locally. H4444 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratochief Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 I agree, most of our guys shoot both IDPA and IPSC and are just great folks, but I suspect every range has a few trolls, were no different. Our IDPA MD is pretty cool, but he can get to really nit-picking people and sometimes is not consistent in enforcement of the rules ie....nit-pick a guys stage because there is not enough cover, yet he sets an all-steel (illegal) stage. I could care less because I come to shoot and will hammer away at whatever is set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonG Posted July 17, 2003 Share Posted July 17, 2003 There was still a round in the mag on the ground, hence the "leaving ammo behind" crap. Hey, Tom VD. My first post here, and I'm honored to be responding to one of your posts. RickB just gave us SO's a pop quiz on this very subject, and, if I remember correctly, you can leave ammo behind when clearing a malfunction (Comp. rule #17 LGRB). So, in your situation (premature slide lock), we polite SOs here at NWPPA have been told to give the benefit of the doubt to the shooter and not issue the procedural. So, in short, you got reamed. Who was the SO? Me? (Nahhh, I never shoot with the Super Squad.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDean Posted July 17, 2003 Share Posted July 17, 2003 Hey, Tom VD. JonG, Oh ya..I remember you. You were the one who followed us around wanting to load our mags, right? I appreciated that, except next time try to remember that the bullet end goes foward in the mag...foward...ya that's it..foward...you'll get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveZ Posted July 17, 2003 Share Posted July 17, 2003 Who was the SO? Me? (Nahhh, I never shoot with the Super Squad.) I know who the SO was....he works at the same place I do....that should be enough of a hint! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted July 17, 2003 Share Posted July 17, 2003 The "FTDR" is one rule that makes me want to really rush right out and shoot some IDPA. Or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDean Posted July 17, 2003 Share Posted July 17, 2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h4444 Posted July 18, 2003 Share Posted July 18, 2003 Brian, I agree,,,,I'll go a step further. Around here the IDPA is just above the carnival match.... It isn't the same every match,,,,,but the creative element is just sucked right out of the shooting challenge. Every stage description around here is,,,,after the buzzer,,,,do this,,,,then this,,,,then this,,,,then this......argh,,,,might as well be a bullseye match. H4444 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted July 18, 2003 Share Posted July 18, 2003 The FTDR penalty, plus the knee pads issue, the kneeling thing, and holster position combined to make me not want to shoot IDPA when it first started. Since then, I've relented. But . . . here's the acid test. I'll be shooting in my first big (IDPA) match in the fall (Indiana Regional). I will be wearing shorts and I will wear knee pads. Now, the guys who run the same club have been very cool about it (since I obviously need the pads) at club matches, so I have no complaints there. On the other hand, I'm expecting some range lawyer to show up from some other club and throw a hissy fit. I could ask the match director for an official dispensation due to a disability/handicap/gravitational enhancement . . . Or I could take my chances and see what happens . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted July 18, 2003 Share Posted July 18, 2003 I could ask the match director for an official dispensation due to a disability/handicap/gravitational enhancement . . .Or I could take my chances and see what happens . . . I'd go for what's behind Door Number One. I mean, really, why take a chance on putting yourself through that much aggravation at a match? It certainly won't help your shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted July 18, 2003 Share Posted July 18, 2003 The real kicker was the reasoning the (IDPA ONLY) shooter/SO used. "You're an IPSC guy,..how do I know those aren't trick mags or something?.." Well, since I was standing right there, I can tell you that my perception was the SO was joking on that "You're an IPSC guy" stuff. He's an old IPSC guy himself, and was going for a joke/sense of camaderie/we're all brothers under the skin approach. I know it's all ancient history now, but just for future consideration, you really should have talked to the MD about that procedural instead of just taking it. I saw your point of view and didn't think you deserved the penalty. When I talked to RickB, the club president, about it later, he saw your point and didn't think you deserved the penalty. When the SO argued, "If you'd only made an effort to clear the malfunction...." if memory serves me correctly I said at the time, and I certainly said to RickB later, "Yeah well, when he popped the magazine in the gun out, stuck another one in the gun and dropped the slide, that sure as hell cleared out that malfunction, didn't it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted July 18, 2003 Share Posted July 18, 2003 I'd go for what's behind Door Number One. I mean, really, why take a chance on putting yourself through that much aggravation at a match? It certainly won't help your shooting. Good point. Plus, it's a lot more polite and essentially The Right Thing to Do. It's fun joking about yanking some chains, but inappropriate to actually do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted July 18, 2003 Share Posted July 18, 2003 Okay . . . I ran it past the match director and he said . . . As long as I don't win anything, it's no problem. If I place in the top three of my class, they will put me in the "shot for no score" limbo. What do you guys think of that? I'm thinking of counteroffering that if I place (highly unlikely), then he can give me a FTDR for each stage where I used them. Or maybe a procedural. What do you folks think is fair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted July 18, 2003 Share Posted July 18, 2003 That is total and complete bs. It is either a dispensation for a special need or it isn't. There should not be any haggling over how well you are allowed to shoot. I don't know what, if any, policy there is for going over the directors head but you should persue that avenue. -ld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonG Posted July 22, 2003 Share Posted July 22, 2003 I appreciated that, except next time try to remember that the bullet end goes foward in the mag...foward...ya that's it..foward...you'll get it. Thanks, Tom. Think I got it now. Those double-wide mags with pink base pads always throw me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted July 22, 2003 Share Posted July 22, 2003 Rhino The MD is being a hard ass and stupid to boot. get intouch with the Area Coordinator and explain it to him and see what he says/does. If no help there, call IDPA HQ and explain to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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