Wow, that dot wiggles a lot!

[mscott]

It seemed to settle down after a few draws, but man that dot bounces all over the place! I would guess my iron sights move that much as well, but it is not as noticeable. Does that settle down after a few million dryfire sessions? I'm guessing that the dot shows every imperfection in my grip, draw, stance, etc.?

[JThompson]

It seemed to settle down after a few draws, but man that dot bounces all over the place! I would guess my iron sights move that much as well, but it is not as noticeable. Does that settle down after a few million dryfire sessions? I'm guessing that the dot shows every imperfection in my grip, draw, stance, etc.?

Depends on how steady you are and what size dot you use. The smaller dot looks like it moves more. In reality it's not, but... My two handed isn't bad, but I have a little genetic thing that give me a bit of a shake, so weak strong can be a bummer for me.

[Thomas Moore]

I noticed my dot settled down the more I worked out with weights.

[Flexmoney]

I think TMoore just called you a sissy.

I don't shoot the dot enough to really say much here. When I did, I always noticed that I seemed to still hit good, even though the dot was dancing around.

I wonder if making sure your visual focus is on the target helps? I know that, coming from iron sights, I always want to pull my visual focus back to the dot.

[38superman]

Yes the dot does move around alot and that takes some new open shooters by surprise.

Your iron sights do the same thing, its just not so blatently obvious.

You'll get used to it.

Hold the dot on target as best you can and shoot.

Despite the dot movement, you'll be surprised how well you can hit, especially on steel and distant targets.

Tls

[JThompson]

I think TMoore just called you a sissy.

I don't shoot the dot enough to really say much here. When I did, I always noticed that I seemed to still hit good, even though the dot was dancing around.

I wonder if making sure your visual focus is on the target helps? I know that, coming from iron sights, I always want to pull my visual focus back to the dot.

I think you're right... at first you get fixated on the dot and notice it more... after a while you just notice when it's in the A. That is, until you shoot Manny's Standards at 75 yds.

[HSMITH]

Get some more weak hand grip pressure in, relax a bit in the strong hand. Play with grip pressure, always a bit more in the weak hand but vary it up and down your scale of grip ability.

The dot is a really powerful learning tool, and you are well on your way. It told you something about your shooting that you would not have known at all if you hadn't started with a dot gun.

[mscott]

I think TMoore just called you a sissy.

That's the great thing about the guys on this forum ... they're more than happy to kick you when you're down . I have never had real steady hands, so that doesn't help. I haven't been to the range to shoot with the dot either. With any luck that will happen tomorrow. I think I'll try some of the timing drills and go from there.

[EZ Bagger]

If it's wiggling you spent too much time looking at it! Pull the trigger already

[Flexmoney]

You know we care when we knock you down first, so we can kick ya. Kinda like joining a gang.

(spook has all the hand signals down)

Timing drills sound perfect, btw.

[bountyhunter]

It seemed to settle down after a few draws, but man that dot bounces all over the place! I would guess my iron sights move that much as well, but it is not as noticeable. Does that settle down after a few million dryfire sessions? I'm guessing that the dot shows every imperfection in my grip, draw, stance, etc.?

Not to mention your trigger pull....

Some people get so hypnotized by the dot wiggle they completely forget how to shoot... the old "wait til the dot is right on the X and yank the trigger before it moves" syndrome.

I call it "dot dazzle"....

There is an optical illusion effect when the dot dances as the edge of the dot goes out of the black.... your mind tells you the shot is out, but it probably is not. The bullet is hitting the center of the dot, but your eye sees when the EDGE of the dot gets out of the center very easily. About 10,000 rounds of .22 bullseye at 25 yards finally convinced me your eyes lie as to how much the POI is moving when looking at a dot. They always exaggerate the movement.

Edited December 1, 2007 by bountyhunter

[Chris Keen]

If it's wiggling you spent too much time looking at it! Pull the trigger already

I think EZ B hit the nail on the head!

[XRe]

I would guess my iron sights move that much as well, but it is not as noticeable. Does that settle down after a few million dryfire sessions? I'm guessing that the dot shows every imperfection in my grip, draw, stance, etc.?

Yes, a few thousand, yes, in that order

Some good advice in this thread - but the dot movement on the draw shows everything that is inconsistent about how you're moving the gun from holster to target, including the tendency to punch the gun at the target and stop it hard at the end (should actually be stopping it smoothly and in a controlled fashion). Shooting Open will definitely improve your iron sight game - once you work all those details out, when you go back to an iron sight gun, the sights are always just there when you push the gun out Good stuff....

[Kingman]

time behind the dot, actually shooting, dry firing etc.

The movement is an effect of not being used to the dot. Get the idea of staring at the target not the dot. If you watch the dot specifically you will notice the movement. If you are watching the target you tend not to notice it as much. Also by watching the dot movement you will tend to gather some misses because you are not paying attention to where the target is.

[Jaxshooter]

There is a current thread dealing with tape over the C-More lens for dry fire practice. It will teach you to focus on the target and not to look AT the dot. I was fortunate coming from skeet and sporting clays I always look at the target.I also do that with iron sights and that is a real problem.

[mscott]

Thanks for the advice so far. Made it to the range today and found that a LOT more grip tension with my weak hand was needed. I also caught myself a few times focusing on the dot instead of the target. I just got myself broke in this year to focus on the front sight shooting irons. I found calling my shots much easier than iron sights, although far from perfect. There were a couple surprises. I also did notice better hits than expected considering the dot movement. I think grip and target focus probably need the most attention, but realize everything works together.

[SA Friday]

Wait for the "where the hell did my dot go" game. I love to watch that one Oh, and then there's the "my battery died while I was shooting" game. That ones interesting to watch too.

[HSMITH]

Glad to hear you made progress, it is the same as shooting irons, only different Dave already told you it will make you a better iron sight shooter, but some of the little things you have already noticed like weak hand grip tension have a bigger impact than anyone will believe until they see it in a dot. Things like weak hand grip tension can go completely unnoticed for years shooting iron sights, they just don't provide the 'slap you in the forehead' feedback that you get from a dot gun but the impact on your shooting is just as great when shooting iron sights.

[Chris iliff]

Dry fire and practice. The dot is deceptive in its simplicity. I hear guys all the time say how much easier the open gun must be, what with "just putting the little red dot on the target", but those same guys crash and burn when I hand them the gun to run a plate machine. Visually it's a better deal. Your focus doesn't need to jump as much as with iron sights, but it requires practice as all things. As mentioned before.... wait till it's not there during a classifier. Your visual references for correction are different and for me it takes longer to get the dot on a bad draw than it does with an iron sighted gun. Dry fire and practice.