EricW Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I want to silver solder my front sight in place. Peening and red loctite seems to last about 7 to 10K rounds and shoot loose again. Any tips? What type of flux do I use? Where can I buy silver solder and flux? Brownells? Also, any issues with removing the sight after? Can I just heat up the sight with a torch and drive it out if I ever want to change? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 (edited) Here are some pages on Silver Soldering/Brazing. http://www.btinternet.com/~hognosesam/gcse/page29.html http://www.laymar-crafts.co.uk/tech6.htm When I used to build slot cars from scratch in the late 60's, I silver soldered all the chassis parts with a blow torch and a dedicated paste type flux and solder that was like 30-40% silver. It took lotsa' heat (like cherry red) and a stable cooling cycle to get a good joint, but it was a strong joint if done right. The parts need to be taken down to clean/bare metal first in the area the joint will be made. Taking something apart was just a simple matter of using the blow torch to make it cherry red again. The parts will now be silver coated after disassembly though ;-) Edited August 9, 2006 by George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I want to silver solder my front sight in place. Peening and red loctite seems to last about 7 to 10K rounds and shoot loose again. Any tips? What type of flux do I use? Where can I buy silver solder and flux? Brownells? Also, any issues with removing the sight after? Can I just heat up the sight with a torch and drive it out if I ever want to change? Thanks! Eric, Use a high temp silver solder, 1/32 diameter. You need the appropriate flux for it, normally a paste flux, not liquid. At least not in the 30+ years I've been doing it. For best results, the slide and sight should be bead blasted. Use an oxy/acetelyn torch, small tip. Apply the solder from the inside of the slide, and let it flow to the outside. It's much easier to clean that way. Boil the slide in clean water for about 15 to 20 minutes to disolve the flux. Then grind out the excess with a fine sanding drum on Mister Dremel. Then you'll need to reblue the slide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Sample Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I have never had a front sight I staked on come off in 20 years. Red Loc Tite is a screw retainer. I use a sleeve retainer and it is #640 Green Loc tite. I use an MMC Sight Staking tool that my wife gave me as an Xmas present a long time ago. The current group of "Smith's" do dovetail front sights becuase this is the hot ticket now. I do not like to apply heat to any part of a 1911, but I have no basis in fact for that. That is just me. Bill Wilson and I learned how to do it a long time ago. If you do it right, they never leave! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cking Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Have you bevel the inside of the tang so that it is larger. usually a ball cutter on a Dremel. Also use the loctite cleaner acclerator. Don't heat the slide it could twist on you. Get somebody to cut a dovetail. Dawson did mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 8, 2006 Author Share Posted August 8, 2006 The sight already *is* a dovetailed sight. Once I read the melting temp on the silver solder (1200F), I started to worry about overheating the slide. I'm sure somebody has the capability to do it competently w/o trashing the slide. Pretty sure that somebody isn't me. Maybe I'll just Mig a couple small pads on the bottom of the sight if/when it comes loose again. When I have a gun built, a pin or setscrew on the front sight is going to be part of the specification. This is driving me nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Watson Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 If it is a loose dovetail, I think one of the high strength Loctites would hold. If not, Brownell's Hi-Force 44 solder silver/tin melts at 475 deg and has 14,000 psi tensile strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Sample Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I guess I didn't understand Red Loc-Tite and Peening.............................. For a dovetailed front sight I would tap it out, make a few dimples in the slide UNDER the sight sight area and clean it up with acetone and then apply a liberal dab of 640 Green Loc-Tite Sleeve Retainer. Drift the sight back in and clean up the extra with a Q-Tip and let it set for about 24 hours. I have one here that is loose and I am going to do it like that after I get the Kart Barrel in it. It is the Only SS Commander size gun I have ever built and it has been an interesting build with a metal I hate. I love blue steel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 8, 2006 Author Share Posted August 8, 2006 I actually think I have a better peening system. I put the sight into a vice and used a chisel to peen the angled edge of the sight "dovetail". No damage to the slide and it's still reasonably easy to reinstall the sight. The problem is that any peen job gets beat down with round count. This will shoot loose just like the last two peen jobs did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scout454 Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Eric - why don't you pin the front sight? It's simple enough to do and it can easily be un-done if necessary. I have 5 1911's done that way and none have ever come loose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 What is it with Eric(k)'s and sights? Peening and green work well. A "trick" I was shown by an "old timer" was to add a shim (using a piece gap gauge) and lock tight under the sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radical Precision Designs Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 I want to silver solder my front sight in place. Peening and red loctite seems to last about 7 to 10K rounds and shoot loose again. Any tips? What type of flux do I use? Where can I buy silver solder and flux? Brownells? Also, any issues with removing the sight after? Can I just heat up the sight with a torch and drive it out if I ever want to change? Thanks! Eric- Reading this thread is giving me a headache. I was going to ignore it and move on, but if I did, it would keep me awake tonight. Look, the present sight is cut already too small, and to remedy the situation it would involve a much higher cost/price than it is worth. How about just getting a new same item replacement sight (which will come to you oversized anyway) and CORRECTLY fit it. No fuzzing over (costly) refinishing jobs, or gooey threadlocking stuff, etc. If it was minor, I would follow Dave Sample's advise on "prick-punching" the dovetail, and even doing the same to the bottom of the sight and them reassembling it with red loctite. If that didn't hold, I would just replace the darned thing with a new one and be done with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 But...but...Venry...I am now emotionally attached to this sight. Actually, I think it's the front dovetail that's oversize as this sight had no fitting done to it when I got it. What is it with Eric(k)'s and sights? It's a germanic Nordic/Teutonic thing. If you're not in the club, you'll never understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMS42 Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Eric, I would suggest that either Al Ewing or Shawn Carlock could solve your problem. There are probably other gunsmiths in the Spokane, CDA area, but they are the only two that I allow to work on my guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radical Precision Designs Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 (edited) But...but...Venry...I am now emotionally attached to this sight. Actually, I think it's the front dovetail that's oversize as this sight had no fitting done to it when I got it. What is it with Eric(k)'s and sights? It's a germanic Nordic/Teutonic thing. If you're not in the club, you'll never understand. Emotionally?? That doesn't say much for your love life!!! L.M.A.O. I'll tell you what... if you still insist on this "emotional thing" between you and that sight... send it over, and I will "TIG" weld it in place for free, to insure a truly lasting relationship. It will never come off again, ever!! Normally the dovetail is cut first close to the actual size of the finished front sight, cleaned up, and then a slight "adjustement" is done to the fit of the actual sight for a nice confortable tight fit. It's kind of a "sexual" thing... kind of. But sometimes there is an "undersized" front sight that gets through in the production line, and by now you know the end results. There is not much you can do about a big hole/dove"tail", other than fit it with a "bigger/normally" sized part. ( Did I just say that?) But my offer stands... Edited August 9, 2006 by Radical Precision Designs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazos Custom Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 The way that Venry suggests to cut a slide is the way I have seen a lot of top notch gunsmiths cut their slides. It can cause problems when the customer decides to change sights. Most sight manufacturers make their sights slightly oversized so that they will be tight in a variety of dovetails. For example we cut our nominal 0.330 width sights to 0.335. EGW cuts theirs to 0.339, Novaks usually run 0.335, etc. If you cut the slide to fit the sight your dovetail will then be oversized 0.335. Every time you put a sight in the slide (if it is a tight fit) you widen the dovetail just a little bit until you can't get a 0.335 sight to fit tightly. It is better to cut the slide to the nominal dimension 0.330 and then cut the sight dovetail to fit the slide. It takes a little longer but the sight will fit better and if it needs to be changed later you can still get a tight fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 Venry, Thank you for the kind offer, but I've got a stick welder and some farm rod stubs out in the shop. I'm emotionally attached to the sight because it's one of the last fine serrated, non-fiber front sights on the earth as near as I can tell. I might call Heinie here and see what I can come up with for a replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Sample Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 I surrender. I thought you were asking for some good advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 Dave, I just like to give Venry a hard time. Time to tweak my sear angle... Where *did* I leave my plasma arc cutter...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 If ya cut too much off da sear, just add some back on with some JB Weld. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Sample Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Finally, some real KEWL advice! I love that stuff.............................but I never use it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 It is the home tinkerer's equal of 200 mph duct tape....fix anything... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Nah.....for the sear, use Bisonite.....harder than woodpecker lips! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldchar Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 I have used "soft" silver solder very effectively. I have one gun smith that seems to like cutting dove tails to large. Use shims with loctite but wanted a no-worry fix. Go to the local Ace and they sell a soft silver solder kit- the solder wire is thin and readily heats up. Bends very easily which is a quick way of telling the soft silver solder from the hard stuff that only a soldering genius can do. Unfortunately the flux Ace provides with the kit is a liquid you do not want to use. Go to Home Depot and get the good plumbers paste flux for silver. Now a caution here. If your gun is hard chromed the paste flux can stain the chrome if not controlled. Does not really damage it , just not as pretty. If your gun is running in the white you should have no problem that 4 odd steel with some brasso won't polish back up. Won't swear what happens with other finishes and the flux- try it under the grips. Thoroughly clean the site and dove-tail. May be reblacking the site before you are done. Set the site in place and heat it up with a propane torch. Won't need acelene(sp?) Add a little flux, if it bubbles you are probably about right but the delay allows it to cool down so a little more torch. Touch the silver solder to the joint and if it is warm enough it will flow. Pull the torch away, let it cool and clean up the joint with steel wool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 (edited) This forum borders on "my right front tire is flat, please advise what type of vehicle I need to buy to replace it". Edited November 8, 2006 by Flatland Shooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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