Filling popple holes

[xjwalt666]

About a year and a half ago I got a new open gun built. The builder put his new popple hole design in the barrel. While the array of holes works very well with helping muzzle rise and recoil it sucks terribly for keeping the dot clean. I was thinking about either welding them up or re-drilling them to change the angel of the hole. My question is, how can I weld them up without the chance of the weld dripping into the rifling of the barrel? I can probably have a gunsmith friend tig weld it and make it so that it just covers the top of the hole and then put it in the surface grinder and clean it up and re-coat it. I wasn't sure if anyone had a technique to be able to avoid getting any weld into the bore. Unfortunately I can't reach out to the builder because he fell off the face of the earth, otherwise I would just have him do another barrel without the holes.

[shred]

Hammer a jacketed (not plated) bullet down the barrel to where the hole is as a backer.  Ideally swage it out a bit as well-- rod in one end, punch in the other, tap punch to expand it even more.

 

[xjwalt666]

2 hours ago, shred said:

Hammer a jacketed (not plated) bullet down the barrel to where the hole is as a backer.  Ideally swage it out a bit as well-- rod in one end, punch in the other, tap punch to expand it even more.

 

That’s a really good idea. Thanks I will definitely try that. 

[barry]

Welding on one side of   Barrel will deform bore to some extent. May affect accuracy.  New bbl is best solution.  May try to angle holes forward before welding. Can't hurt.

[Nathanb]

I run four popples on my barrel.  I just clean every match. Larger matches it’s once during the middle.  

[donnyglock]

22 hours ago, xjwalt666 said:

About a year and a half ago I got a new open gun built. The builder put his new popple hole design in the barrel. While the array of holes works very well with helping muzzle rise and recoil it sucks terribly for keeping the dot clean. I was thinking about either welding them up or re-drilling them to change the angel of the hole. My question is, how can I weld them up without the chance of the weld dripping into the rifling of the barrel? I can probably have a gunsmith friend tig weld it and make it so that it just covers the top of the hole and then put it in the surface grinder and clean it up and re-coat it. I wasn't sure if anyone had a technique to be able to avoid getting any weld into the bore. Unfortunately I can't reach out to the builder because he fell off the face of the earth, otherwise I would just have him do another barrel without the holes.

Is this one of those that has ports straight up in the front and then v holes right in front of the optic? 

[jwhittin]

What about micro welding the top of the port closed?   Minimal heat, very exact.   

[Toggleme]

drill/tap/epoxy/peen a set screw in there? Less heat than welding but some risk of it coming loose. 

[xjwalt666]

4 hours ago, donnyglock said:

Is this one of those that has ports straight up in the front and then v holes right in front of the optic? 

It has 4 holes staggered that are approx 15* outward and 10* toward the rear. It works awesome but the dot gets absolutely filthy after one stage. They are towards the front of the barrel however, right behind the comp. 

[xjwalt666]

9 hours ago, barry said:

Welding on one side of   Barrel will deform bore to some extent. May affect accuracy.  New bbl is best solution.  May try to angle holes forward before welding. Can't hurt.

That was my thought. They angle towards the rear so I was thinking if I can re-angle them somewhat straight up or forward that may solve it before welding. 

7 hours ago, Nathanb said:

I run four popples on my barrel.  I just clean every match. Larger matches it’s once during the middle.  

With the layout it has I can barely see the dot after one stage. The super comp barrel isn’t bad with 3n38 but I use the 9mm barrel more and load silhouette and it’s dirty. 

4 hours ago, jwhittin said:

What about micro welding the top of the port closed?   Minimal heat, very exact.   

This was my thought. Quick weld with a tig and be done with it. 

3 hours ago, Toggleme said:

drill/tap/epoxy/peen a set screw in there? Less heat than welding but some risk of it coming loose. 

I thought about this too and have seen it suggested in the past but I’m not sure how comfortable I am with this process. 

[xjwalt666]

This is the setup. The 38sc barrel is installed in this pic but the 9 is the same except only 4 holes. The rearward angle blows right into the front of the lens. 

[barry]

The ports are angled towards the glass??that would explain a lot. I would try reciting front of hole forward a bit and see if that helps.if not can welder replace. I would lean to replace.

[barry]

Are you using hollow poi ts or round nose bullets.

[xjwalt666]

3 minutes ago, barry said:

The ports are angled towards the glass??that would explain a lot. I would try reciting front of hole forward a bit and see if that helps.if not can welder replace. I would lean to replace.

Yes. The builder did some flow testing or something and found a design that worked really well. Or so he said. Don’t get me wrong, it shoots amazingly flat at major pf. But it’s not worth the trouble of losing being able to see thru the glass. 

Just now, barry said:

Are you using hollow poi ts or round nose bullets.

I use 124gr RMR match winners 

[barry]

Don't know if rmr match winners are hp or full metal jackets. Hp's have no exposed lead on base. fmj's have exposed lead that gets vaporized and could be what's fogging glass.

[barry]

Either way any fix short of a new bbl is a crude fix on an expensive gun.

[shred]

1 hour ago, barry said:

Don't know if rmr match winners are hp or full metal jackets. Hp's have no exposed lead on base. fmj's have exposed lead that gets vaporized and could be what's fogging glass.

I believe Match Winners are not enclosed-base, so yeah they're going to be throwing lead.

 

(aside: random holes in a barrel are not "popple holes", they are barrel ports.  Popple holes are a specific configuration of barrel ports developed by Adam Popplewell & Bob at Brazos Custom.  Old timers will remember 'TJ holes', 'V8 Ports' and a handful of other patterns).

 

[xjwalt666]

8 hours ago, shred said:

I believe Match Winners are not enclosed-base, so yeah they're going to be throwing lead.

 

(aside: random holes in a barrel are not "popple holes", they are barrel ports.  Popple holes are a specific configuration of barrel ports developed by Adam Popplewell & Bob at Brazos Custom.  Old timers will remember 'TJ holes', 'V8 Ports' and a handful of other patterns).

 

You are right about the exposed base on the rmr’s. And I wasn’t aware of the terminology.  Thanks for that. I had just assumed they were called popple holes. Maybe before I mess with the barrel at all I’ll try switching bullets and see if that makes a difference. 

[xjwalt666]

10 hours ago, barry said:

Don't know if rmr match winners are hp or full metal jackets. Hp's have no exposed lead on base. fmj's have exposed lead that gets vaporized and could be what's fogging glass.

RMR are fmj with exposed base. I’m going to try a different bullet and see if it’s any better. I think I have some MG 124 jhp in my bin I can try. 

9 hours ago, barry said:

Either way any fix short of a new bbl is a crude fix on an expensive gun.

I agree. I’m just trying to figure out the easiest way to go about this since the builder ghosted me along with many others. It’s a shame too because it’s a really nice build. I have no clue who to turn to to have another barrel fitted. 

[Endall]

  I saw a gun on GB with 4 ports. A factory ported gun. The barrel had metal distortion around the ports. I first thought it was a hillbilly rig port job. With a metal punch or something. 
  Looked like something mechanical was used to clean out the angled ports. Then OD was turned down to remove bumps. Left rings around the ports. Finish was eroded off front sight and around slide ports. 
  Guess that is why comps are popular.
  It was a couple hundred a week out. Sold for stupid money. I wanted it at a couple hundred.

[zzt]

I would have a gunsmith redrill to ports to vertical using a carbide ball-end end mill.  Change to JHPs and use a slower, cleaner powder.  Your ports will be larger than previously, so you will lose some PF.  AA7 powder is super clean in my 9 major guns.  It also makes lots of gas.

[xjwalt666]

3 hours ago, zzt said:

I would have a gunsmith redrill to ports to vertical using a carbide ball-end end mill.  Change to JHPs and use a slower, cleaner powder.  Your ports will be larger than previously, so you will lose some PF.  AA7 powder is super clean in my 9 major guns.  It also makes lots of gas.

This is what I'm thinking I'll do. I can just bring it to work and do it myself. Luckily I have the tooling and skill to do it. I have built a few 2011's myself and utilize the equipment at my shop to do so. I also don't do much USPSA anymore so I don't need to worry about power factor. And I have some AA7 to test with. 

[Can]

On 7/25/2024 at 1:28 PM, xjwalt666 said:

This is what I'm thinking I'll do. I can just bring it to work and do it myself. Luckily I have the tooling and skill to do it. I have built a few 2011's myself and utilize the equipment at my shop to do so. I also don't do much USPSA anymore so I don't need to worry about power factor. And I have some AA7 to test with. 

Any wielding on that barrel is going to distort it. especially since it's all on 1 side, it will give you a banana shape for sure.  I would machine interference fit plugs to fit in the holes, freeze them in liquid nitrogen, bake the barrel then hammer em in with something in your barrel as a stop so they cant go to deep.