2" holster and mah holder off the belt question

[teros135]

He probably wasn't paying attention to "is the shooter ready"...

[GrumpyOne]

I think everybody knows what Sarge meant.

And if you want to get really fussy about language, Sarge was right, he didn't use the 170 to "shoot a stage".

Chrono is a stage, so he did use the 170 to shoot a stage.

Equipment gets checked at chrono.

I don't think he did. Unless he was the chrono guy. He handed his gun, mag, and ammo to the chrono guy and HE shot the stage.

[Bkreutz]

I think everybody knows what Sarge meant.

And if you want to get really fussy about language, Sarge was right, he didn't use the 170 to "shoot a stage".

Chrono is a stage, so he did use the 170 to shoot a stage.

Equipment gets checked at chrono.

I don't think he did. Unless he was the chrono guy. He handed his gun, mag, and ammo to the chrono guy and HE shot the stage.

Don't muddy up the argument with a silly thing like facts.

[Nik Habicht]

I think everybody knows what Sarge meant.

And if you want to get really fussy about language, Sarge was right, he didn't use the 170 to "shoot a stage".

Chrono is a stage, so he did use the 170 to shoot a stage.

Equipment gets checked at chrono.

I don't think he did. Unless he was the chrono guy. He handed his gun, mag, and ammo to the chrono guy and HE shot the stage.

Well, if we're going to accept that argument, then the competitor in Production who fires 9 rounds and drops a mag containing 3 more rounds also shouldn't be moved to open -- but that's not how the rules work......

...and it might be why the equipment decisions stop with the RM.....

[Sarge]

I think everybody knows what Sarge meant.

And if you want to get really fussy about language, Sarge was right, he didn't use the 170 to "shoot a stage".

Chrono is a stage, so he did use the 170 to shoot a stage.

Equipment gets checked at chrono.

I don't think he did. Unless he was the chrono guy. He handed his gun, mag, and ammo to the chrono guy and HE shot the stage.

Well, if we're going to accept that argument, then the competitor in Production who fires 9 rounds and drops a mag containing 3 more rounds also shouldn't be moved to open -- but that's not how the rules work......

...and it might be why the equipment decisions stop with the RM.....

Huh? In your scenario the shooter clearly used that magazine!

I have so many mags in my shooting bag I could easily hand the chrono monkey one I haven't used in months. Quite a difference

[teros135]

I didn't get that, either.

The Production scenario above has nothing to do with Chrono. That's an apples and oranges argument. The competitor is actively shooting a CoF when he drops his overloaded mag, but at Chrono he isn't shooting at all (it's not a CoF).

Anyway, this conversation didn't start out with "equipment decisions", it was about whether a competitor is "shooting a stage" when he hands the chrono guy/gal the gun and mag.

("Chrono monkey" - LOL!)

[Round_Gun_Shooter]

The magazine was used at Chrono. It was checked at chrono.

Chrono is a stage.

BUT, most majors equipment checks take place at Chrono not by rule but by policy and practice. Equipment checks can take place at any stage of a match. A RO at each stage should be taking note of equipment and if he/she thinks there is a problem, they should do a full inspection. Because of time constraints, this is rarely done.

To be Devil's advocate, any equipment submitted at chrono for testing (like an oversize mag) is equipment being used in a match. Why would someone submit equipment NOT being used? That makes no sense.

(Example would be a shooter that shoots limited and open at different matches grabbing a 170MM legal open mag when they are shooting Limited at chrono. Why would they do that? Mag isn't being used in the match.)

Equipment checks for holster position and distance should be completed at random intervals throughout a match. People move things. Accidentally or on purposely, things get moved.

[Nik Habicht]

I think everybody knows what Sarge meant.

And if you want to get really fussy about language, Sarge was right, he didn't use the 170 to "shoot a stage".

Chrono is a stage, so he did use the 170 to shoot a stage.

Equipment gets checked at chrono.

I don't think he did. Unless he was the chrono guy. He handed his gun, mag, and ammo to the chrono guy and HE shot the stage.

Well, if we're going to accept that argument, then the competitor in Production who fires 9 rounds and drops a mag containing 3 more rounds also shouldn't be moved to open -- but that's not how the rules work......

...and it might be why the equipment decisions stop with the RM.....

Huh? In your scenario the shooter clearly used that magazine!

I have so many mags in my shooting bag I could easily hand the chrono monkey one I haven't used in months. Quite a difference

OK fine -- then the mag with 11 rounds in it in the fifth position, that you never use -- that I pull eight rounds from to chrono -- that one shouldn't get you moved to open. Bottom line -- if it's on your belt, it's fair game to be checked. If the chrono RO says to you: please bring me all your mags, so I can gauge them -- that's a reasonable request, no?

[Sarge]

I think everybody knows what Sarge meant.

And if you want to get really fussy about language, Sarge was right, he didn't use the 170 to "shoot a stage".

Chrono is a stage, so he did use the 170 to shoot a stage.

Equipment gets checked at chrono.

I don't think he did. Unless he was the chrono guy. He handed his gun, mag, and ammo to the chrono guy and HE shot the stage.

Well, if we're going to accept that argument, then the competitor in Production who fires 9 rounds and drops a mag containing 3 more rounds also shouldn't be moved to open -- but that's not how the rules work......

...and it might be why the equipment decisions stop with the RM.....

Huh? In your scenario the shooter clearly used that magazine!

I have so many mags in my shooting bag I could easily hand the chrono monkey one I haven't used in months. Quite a difference

OK fine -- then the mag with 11 rounds in it in the fifth position, that you never use -- that I pull eight rounds from to chrono -- that one shouldn't get you moved to open. Bottom line -- if it's on your belt, it's fair game to be checked. If the chrono RO says to you: please bring me all your mags, so I can gauge them -- that's a reasonable request, no?

Sure, i guess.

[Sarge]

The magazine was used at Chrono. It was checked at chrono.

Chrono is a stage.

BUT, most majors equipment checks take place at Chrono not by rule but by policy and practice. Equipment checks can take place at any stage of a match. A RO at each stage should be taking note of equipment and if he/she thinks there is a problem, they should do a full inspection. Because of time constraints, this is rarely done.

To be Devil's advocate, any equipment submitted at chrono for testing (like an oversize mag) is equipment being used in a match. Why would someone submit equipment NOT being used? That makes no sense.

(Example would be a shooter that shoots limited and open at different matches grabbing a 170MM legal open mag when they are shooting Limited at chrono. Why would they do that? Mag isn't being used in the match.)

Equipment checks for holster position and distance should be completed at random intervals throughout a match. People move things. Accidentally or on purposely, things get moved.

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Of course the RM can say it's in use and I take the hit. But maybe he won't.

My guess is somebody would notice you shooting 32 rounds without reloading or something like that. Or having a big stick with a huge base pad on it. This would raise suspicions.

[Gooldylocks]

The magazine was used at Chrono. It was checked at chrono.

Chrono is a stage.

BUT, most majors equipment checks take place at Chrono not by rule but by policy and practice. Equipment checks can take place at any stage of a match. A RO at each stage should be taking note of equipment and if he/she thinks there is a problem, they should do a full inspection. Because of time constraints, this is rarely done.

To be Devil's advocate, any equipment submitted at chrono for testing (like an oversize mag) is equipment being used in a match. Why would someone submit equipment NOT being used? That makes no sense.

(Example would be a shooter that shoots limited and open at different matches grabbing a 170MM legal open mag when they are shooting Limited at chrono. Why would they do that? Mag isn't being used in the match.)

Equipment checks for holster position and distance should be completed at random intervals throughout a match. People move things. Accidentally or on purposely, things get moved.

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Of course the RM can say it's in use and I take the hit. But maybe he won't.

My guess is somebody would notice you shooting 32 rounds without reloading or something like that. Or having a big stick with a huge base pad on it. This would raise suspicions.

It's conversations like this that make me so suspicious of people. If I work the chrono at either of the majors I'm working this year, I am going to check the big stick of all the open shooters. Regardless of what they hand me.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[GrumpyOne]

The magazine was used at Chrono. It was checked at chrono.

Chrono is a stage.

BUT, most majors equipment checks take place at Chrono not by rule but by policy and practice. Equipment checks can take place at any stage of a match. A RO at each stage should be taking note of equipment and if he/she thinks there is a problem, they should do a full inspection. Because of time constraints, this is rarely done.

To be Devil's advocate, any equipment submitted at chrono for testing (like an oversize mag) is equipment being used in a match. Why would someone submit equipment NOT being used? That makes no sense.

(Example would be a shooter that shoots limited and open at different matches grabbing a 170MM legal open mag when they are shooting Limited at chrono. Why would they do that? Mag isn't being used in the match.)

Equipment checks for holster position and distance should be completed at random intervals throughout a match. People move things. Accidentally or on purposely, things get moved.

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Of course the RM can say it's in use and I take the hit. But maybe he won't.

My guess is somebody would notice you shooting 32 rounds without reloading or something like that. Or having a big stick with a huge base pad on it. This would raise suspicions.

It's conversations like this that make me so suspicious of people. If I work the chrono at either of the majors I'm working this year, I am going to check the big stick of all the open shooters. Regardless of what they hand me.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Which majors will those be? LOL!

[Gooldylocks]

The magazine was used at Chrono. It was checked at chrono.

Chrono is a stage.

BUT, most majors equipment checks take place at Chrono not by rule but by policy and practice. Equipment checks can take place at any stage of a match. A RO at each stage should be taking note of equipment and if he/she thinks there is a problem, they should do a full inspection. Because of time constraints, this is rarely done.

To be Devil's advocate, any equipment submitted at chrono for testing (like an oversize mag) is equipment being used in a match. Why would someone submit equipment NOT being used? That makes no sense.

(Example would be a shooter that shoots limited and open at different matches grabbing a 170MM legal open mag when they are shooting Limited at chrono. Why would they do that? Mag isn't being used in the match.)

Equipment checks for holster position and distance should be completed at random intervals throughout a match. People move things. Accidentally or on purposely, things get moved.

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Of course the RM can say it's in use and I take the hit. But maybe he won't.

My guess is somebody would notice you shooting 32 rounds without reloading or something like that. Or having a big stick with a huge base pad on it. This would raise suspicions.

It's conversations like this that make me so suspicious of people. If I work the chrono at either of the majors I'm working this year, I am going to check the big stick of all the open shooters. Regardless of what they hand me.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Which majors will those be? LOL!

Wouldn't you like to know!

But seriously, is it so hard to measure your big stick ahead of time, and not cheat? It almost seems to me that giving a 140mm mag to the chrono guy if you know your 170 won't pass is grounds for a DQ per 10.6.1, if they found out about it later. Not even just shoot for no score, but pack your things you are done for the day.

[GrumpyOne]

The magazine was used at Chrono. It was checked at chrono.

Chrono is a stage.

BUT, most majors equipment checks take place at Chrono not by rule but by policy and practice. Equipment checks can take place at any stage of a match. A RO at each stage should be taking note of equipment and if he/she thinks there is a problem, they should do a full inspection. Because of time constraints, this is rarely done.

To be Devil's advocate, any equipment submitted at chrono for testing (like an oversize mag) is equipment being used in a match. Why would someone submit equipment NOT being used? That makes no sense.

(Example would be a shooter that shoots limited and open at different matches grabbing a 170MM legal open mag when they are shooting Limited at chrono. Why would they do that? Mag isn't being used in the match.)

Equipment checks for holster position and distance should be completed at random intervals throughout a match. People move things. Accidentally or on purposely, things get moved.

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Of course the RM can say it's in use and I take the hit. But maybe he won't.

My guess is somebody would notice you shooting 32 rounds without reloading or something like that. Or having a big stick with a huge base pad on it. This would raise suspicions.

It's conversations like this that make me so suspicious of people. If I work the chrono at either of the majors I'm working this year, I am going to check the big stick of all the open shooters. Regardless of what they hand me.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Which majors will those be? LOL!

Wouldn't you like to know!

But seriously, is it so hard to measure your big stick ahead of time, and not cheat? It almost seems to me that giving a 140mm mag to the chrono guy if you know your 170 won't pass is grounds for a DQ per 10.6.1, if they found out about it later. Not even just shoot for no score, but pack your things you are done for the day.

I agree. That is knowingly cheating. Same as giving the chrono guy special "chrono" ammo.

[Southpaw]

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Why would it be dumb to use a big stick at chrono? Do yours not gauge?

[Gooldylocks]

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Why would it be dumb to use a big stick at chrono? Do yours not gauge?

I think that is what he is saying, yes. Looking through the rulebook in Appendices C2, and E1, there is nothing that says I can't ask to measure all of your magazines. So if you have multiple big sticks, maybe the RO will just check up on you to see if they fit. I wonder how many people are being shady and trying to slip through with their extra long magazines..

[Round_Gun_Shooter]

As a former chrono guy, when open shooters came to the stage, I had no interest in their 140MM mags. I asked for all big stick mags to be gauged. One guy said I only use one. I asked, how many do you have with you. Answer was three. I said bring them all in case you have a malfunction and need to put another into the mix you know you will be all set.

MOST shooters have no problem with that. If someone does, it really sends up a red flag.

Edited April 18, 2016 by Round_Gun_Shooter

[Sarge]

I carry 3 big sticks in my bag but only load one during a given match. IF I were dumb enough to hand him a big stick, I wouldn't unload the one I'm using. I would give him one that's empty that I am not using in the match.

Why would it be dumb to use a big stick at chrono? Do yours not gauge?

Yes mine all gauge. I don't cheat, I'm not shady. But willingly offering up something for inspection is not wise. If you want to look at my stuff, ask me, otherwise ......

[Sarge]

As a former chrono guy, when open shooters came to the stage, I had no interest in their 140MM mags. I asked for all big stick mags to be gauged. One guy said I only use one. I asked, how many do you have with you. Answer was three. I said bring them all in case you have a malfunction and need to put another into the mix you know you will be all set.

MOST shooters have no problem with that. If someone does, it really sends up a red flag.

I've only been at this game less than 10 years but I have actually never seen a mag get checked period, let alone a big stick. I guess the majors I have shot decided not to.

Any official of any match is more than welcome to check my gear.

[cnote]

My big stick is exactly 2" off the belt in my mah holder ?