2" holster and mah holder off the belt question

[BrocDowns]

Do they measure from inside of inner or outer belt, the rule ready 2"s measured from insde the belt. Reason i ask is because my holster hanger is right at the limit from inside my outer belt, if i measure from my waist is a tad too far by maybe a 1/4 inch

[Sarge]

5.2.5 Where a Division specifies a maximum distance that a competitor’s

handgun and equipment may extend away from a competitor’s belt, the

measurement shall be taken in the following manner:

— Perpendicular to the belt at the point of attachment to the belt

— from the inner most surface of the belt equipment (against the

pants/body) to the closest point of the grip of the handgun and/or any

reloading device.

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

[MilkMyDuds]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

[BrocDowns]

maybe i should ditch my current offset and go with an invictus from what i hear they are legal, but at the same time my old offset was a bladetech and it was a tad too far as well

[Sarge]

maybe i should ditch my current offset and go with an invictus from what i hear they are legal, but at the same time my old offset was a bladetech and it was a tad too far as well

Everybody shims BT DOH's with little washers under bottom screws

[Sarge]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

I would imagine if the rig fails the shooter can ask to remove it and have it remeasured.

[Nik Habicht]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

I would imagine if the rig fails the shooter can ask to remove it and have it remeasured.

Probably falls under RM discretion. Best bet -- set your rig up to be compliant; it beats arguing with officials at a match....

[bret]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

I would imagine if the rig fails the shooter can ask to remove it and have it remeasured.

If it fails after you shot a stage, you get bumped into open.

[Sarge]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

I would imagine if the rig fails the shooter can ask to remove it and have it remeasured.

If it fails after you shot a stage, you get bumped into open.

Unless it passes after remeasure

[bret]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

I would imagine if the rig fails the shooter can ask to remove it and have it remeasured.

If it fails after you shot a stage, you get bumped into open.

Unless it passes after remeasure

If the rig failed the measurement after a stage has been shot, corrective action such as removing the drop offset or shimming the holster does not change the fact it was used on a stage not in compliance.

It is up to the shooter to make sure his gear is proper for the division they are shooting in.

R.O.'s should catch it, but they don't always catch it and some shooters get uppity when checked, but it's the shooters responsibility.

[terrydoc]

5.2.5 Where a Division specifies a maximum distance that a competitor’s

handgun and equipment may extend away from a competitor’s belt, the

measurement shall be taken in the following manner:

— Perpendicular to the belt at the point of attachment to the belt

— from the inner most surface of the belt equipment (against the

pants/body) to the closest point of the grip of the handgun and/or any

reloading device.

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

I find it intriguing as to how you would measure the distance to the body if the competitor isn't wearing the gear?

I shoot IPSC and am an IROA RO and we alway's check the gear whilst the competitor is wearing it, most if not all of our L# and above matches have semi official gun/ equipment checks at registration ( which is good for the competitor as if it doesn't comply he has time to fix it) and they do the Official check at chrono and during the match.

Edited April 9, 2016 by terrydoc

[Bkreutz]

5.2.5 Where a Division specifies a maximum distance that a competitor’s

handgun and equipment may extend away from a competitor’s belt, the

measurement shall be taken in the following manner:

— Perpendicular to the belt at the point of attachment to the belt

— from the inner most surface of the belt equipment (against the

pants/body) to the closest point of the grip of the handgun and/or any

reloading device.

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

I find it intriguing as to how you would measure the distance to the body if the competitor isn't wearing the gear?

I shoot IPSC and am an IROA RO and we alway's check the gear whilst the competitor is wearing it, most if not all of our L# and above matches have semi official gun/ equipment checks at registration ( which is good for the competitor as if it doesn't comply he has time to fix it) and they do the Official check at chrono and during the match.

Hook a tape measure on the inside of the inner belt and measure to the gun. This is kind of a moot argument since there is "change in the wind" about this. It's just waiting for the time to pass between equipment changes. (the distance is getting larger...eventually) we have more pressing things to worry about than how far someone wants their pistol hanging out. Doesn't provide any advantage no matter how much it resembles "Johnny Ringo's" rig

[bret]

5.2.5 Where a Division specifies a maximum distance that a competitors

handgun and equipment may extend away from a competitors belt, the

measurement shall be taken in the following manner:

Perpendicular to the belt at the point of attachment to the belt

from the inner most surface of the belt equipment (against the

pants/body) to the closest point of the grip of the handgun and/or any

reloading device.

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

I find it intriguing as to how you would measure the distance to the body if the competitor isn't wearing the gear?

I shoot IPSC and am an IROA RO and we alway's check the gear whilst the competitor is wearing it, most if not all of our L# and above matches have semi official gun/ equipment checks at registration ( which is good for the competitor as if it doesn't comply he has time to fix it) and they do the Official check at chrono and during the match.

Hook a tape measure on the inside of the inner belt and measure to the gun. This is kind of a moot argument since there is "change in the wind" about this. It's just waiting for the time to pass between equipment changes. (the distance is getting larger...eventually) we have more pressing things to worry about than how far someone wants their pistol hanging out. Doesn't provide any advantage no matter how much it resembles "Johnny Ringo's" rig

The change will go from 2" to 2 1/8" to all divisions except Limited and Open, production and single stack still have to be within 2 1/8" after the rule goes into effect.

Until then it's not a moot point.

[terrydoc]

It could be a different measurement depending on the size of the competitor. Fat guy's (I'm one) have an advantage as the extra tire lessens the gap that the skinny guy doesn't have. So if your a skinny guy you would get it measured while not wearing your rig. And that will carry over to your new measurements will it not?

Edited April 10, 2016 by terrydoc

[Bkreutz]

5.2.5 Where a Division specifies a maximum distance that a competitors

handgun and equipment may extend away from a competitors belt, the

measurement shall be taken in the following manner:

Perpendicular to the belt at the point of attachment to the belt

from the inner most surface of the belt equipment (against the

pants/body) to the closest point of the grip of the handgun and/or any

reloading device.

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

I find it intriguing as to how you would measure the distance to the body if the competitor isn't wearing the gear?

I shoot IPSC and am an IROA RO and we alway's check the gear whilst the competitor is wearing it, most if not all of our L# and above matches have semi official gun/ equipment checks at registration ( which is good for the competitor as if it doesn't comply he has time to fix it) and they do the Official check at chrono and during the match.

Hook a tape measure on the inside of the inner belt and measure to the gun. This is kind of a moot argument since there is "change in the wind" about this. It's just waiting for the time to pass between equipment changes. (the distance is getting larger...eventually) we have more pressing things to worry about than how far someone wants their pistol hanging out. Doesn't provide any advantage no matter how much it resembles "Johnny Ringo's" rig

The change will go from 2" to 2 1/8" to all divisions except Limited and Open, production and single stack still have to be within 2 1/8" after the rule goes into effect.

Until then it's not a moot point.

I said it's kind of a moot point because in all honesty having the holster 1/8" (or 1/4 or 1/2) is not going to affect most USPSA shooters, they're just not that good (me included). I have to laugh at all the discussions/arguments about equipment because it makes no difference in the performance of most shooters. It might make a difference in the GM world, but I don't live in that area.

[bret]

5.2.5 Where a Division specifies a maximum distance that a competitors

handgun and equipment may extend away from a competitors belt, the

measurement shall be taken in the following manner:

Perpendicular to the belt at the point of attachment to the belt

from the inner most surface of the belt equipment (against the

pants/body) to the closest point of the grip of the handgun and/or any

reloading device.

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

I find it intriguing as to how you would measure the distance to the body if the competitor isn't wearing the gear?

I shoot IPSC and am an IROA RO and we alway's check the gear whilst the competitor is wearing it, most if not all of our L# and above matches have semi official gun/ equipment checks at registration ( which is good for the competitor as if it doesn't comply he has time to fix it) and they do the Official check at chrono and during the match.

Hook a tape measure on the inside of the inner belt and measure to the gun. This is kind of a moot argument since there is "change in the wind" about this. It's just waiting for the time to pass between equipment changes. (the distance is getting larger...eventually) we have more pressing things to worry about than how far someone wants their pistol hanging out. Doesn't provide any advantage no matter how much it resembles "Johnny Ringo's" rig

The change will go from 2" to 2 1/8" to all divisions except Limited and Open, production and single stack still have to be within 2 1/8" after the rule goes into effect.

Until then it's not a moot point.

I said it's kind of a moot point because in all honesty having the holster 1/8" (or 1/4 or 1/2) is not going to affect most USPSA shooters, they're just not that good (me included). I have to laugh at all the discussions/arguments about equipment because it makes no difference in the performance of most shooters. It might make a difference in the GM world, but I don't live in that area.

An overlay is 2 1/8" wide, that is commonly what is used to measure, that is why an 1/8" was added.

[Round_Gun_Shooter]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

I would imagine if the rig fails the shooter can ask to remove it and have it remeasured.

If it fails after you shot a stage, you get bumped into open.

Actually, Open has the same requirement. I believe is is a zero for the stage rather than a bump since it was shot with non compliant gear for all divisions.

I say "I believe" because I really don't recall on this one but I am sure it is not a bump.

[Sarge]

Geez, a lot of this just keeps going over people's heads..... It's really not hard

[teros135]

Especially the part about "this rule is on hold and is not in effect at this time".

[pmt]

Eliminating rules of this nature would go a long way in reducing the size of the rule book.

[teros135]

Like Sarge said, it's not really that hard.

[bret]

5.2.5.1 These measurements may be taken with the equipment as worn

or removed (see App. E2).

It's interesting because many metal guns with a loaded mag will be so heavy that they actually won't be vertical while in holster. As a result, the measurements between worn and removed would differ pretty significantly.

Is it the shooter who decides how he/she wants to measure this distance, or the SO/MD?

I would imagine if the rig fails the shooter can ask to remove it and have it remeasured.

If it fails after you shot a stage, you get bumped into open.

Actually, Open has the same requirement. I believe is is a zero for the stage rather than a bump since it was shot with non compliant gear for all divisions.

I say "I believe" because I really don't recall on this one but I am sure it is not a bump.

Please post the rule.

[Sarge]

If you break a rule in open you can't get bumped. The rule in question pertains to open as well so you would be shooting for no score

[bret]

If you break a rule in open you can't get bumped. The rule in question pertains to open as well so you would be shooting for no score

Thanks, it makes sense.

[JAFO]

Especially the part about "this rule is on hold and is not in effect at this time".

I just checked the Rulings page, and it's listed as Released, Effective 12/08/15. It would be nice if they updated this page to show "On Hold".

http://www.uspsa.org/uspsa-NROI-ruling-details.php?indx=75