ArrDave Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 The mold on the bullet I had been using appears to have changed and is now too short for me to be comfortable with it. Any recs on 124/125s that push out to 1.15 or so in a CZ? Sent from an iDevice. Please forgive any grammatical or spelling errors. If the post doesn't make sense or is not amusing then it is technology's fault and most certainly not operator error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonytheTiger Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Subscribed.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vixty Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Xtreme 124rn I believe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usmc90 Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I believe from the header , he's looking for coated lead.. I'm using some coated 125'so from SNS that seem to work well in my shadow and p09 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooterclay Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I'm using bayou coated bullets 124g with 4.9g power pistol, that is making power factor of 129.0 in my cz sp01 shadow and cz 85 combat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsa Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Try Black Bullets International, it appears to be a conical round nose profile (I haven't seen it anywhere else). It looks like you would be able to load to the length you want with that bullet. Before I started making my own I used BBI's; Chandler makes good stuff and provides excellent customer service, give him a call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArrDave Posted February 2, 2016 Author Share Posted February 2, 2016 I believe from the header , he's looking for coated lead.. I'm using some coated 125'so from SNS that seem to work well in my shadow and p09What oal can you load to?Sent from an iDevice. Please forgive any grammatical or spelling errors. If the post doesn't make sense or is not amusing then it is technology's fault and most certainly not operator error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vixty Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Yes black bullets 124s and also blue bullets 135 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooterclay Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Sp01 shadow OAL 1.16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beretta391 Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Ibejiheads in 124's may have a profile that works for you...I can load there 147 FP out to 1.15 and they chamber fine. And they are coated as well. www.Ibejiheads.com Good luck.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDescribe Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 Dave, here's what you can expect in 9mm CZ pistols from the various 124/125 RN coated. We know from our respective OALs on the ACME 124 that my CZ's throat is a little shorter than yours by around .02, so I've given these OALs in a range, where my OAL is the shorter OAL, and I suspect the upper end of the range is where you would be:ACME 1.06-1.08SNS 1.6 - 1.08 Blue 1.10-1.12 BBI 1.10-1.12 MBC -- I have not used, but I can look at and tell you it's going to be short, probably 1.06-1.08 Ibejihead -- I have not used, but I have found references from others to 1.125And the winner is:Bayou Bullets 124RN -- I have not used, but I can look at and tell it loads longer than the rest, and I have found more than one reference to this bullet loading out to 1.15 - 1.16.It looks like Bayou is your only option. Of course, all the others work just fine too at their appropriate OALs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircooled6racer Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 Hello: Throat the CZ and you will be able to load out to 1.160" OAL. I did that with a Shadow I had. Very accurate with different types of bullets after I throated it. Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 This has always been my favorite 124 gr 9mm bullet profile. I actually get mine from a local guy, but bayou still offers these bullets, as I'm sure do other places. The step is what allows you to load nearly as long as you want. I usually go 1.14 but you could go up to something like 1.165 if you wanted. I haven't bought into the whole no lube groove thing, I still love the profile of this bullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcs Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 The mold on the bullet I had been using appears to have changed and is now too short for me to be comfortable with it. Any recs on 124/125s that push out to 1.15 or so in a CZ? Sent from an iDevice. Please forgive any grammatical or spelling errors. If the post doesn't make sense or is not amusing then it is technology's fault and most certainly not operator error. Define "comfortable". Why is loading long for 9 minor desirable? Pressure or feeding is definitely not an issue in a Shadow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 The OP will have to speak for himself but loading a little longer, 1.14-5 instead of 1.10 allows you to use even faster powders that may not otherwise be safe for 9mm, resulting in lighter powder throws and felt recoil. It make me much more comfortable using powders like WST, Clays, Ramshot Competition, or S1000 in a cartridge loaded a little longer. I have loaded some WST loads, my current load, shorter when trying to finish up some bullets of a different profile, and the primers start getting pretty flat, with a hint of flow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcs Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 The OP will have to speak for himself but loading a little longer, 1.14-5 instead of 1.10 allows you to use even faster powders that may not otherwise be safe for 9mm, resulting in lighter powder throws and felt recoil. It make me much more comfortable using powders like WST, Clays, Ramshot Competition, or S1000 in a cartridge loaded a little longer. I have loaded some WST loads, my current load, shorter when trying to finish up some bullets of a different profile, and the primers start getting pretty flat, with a hint of flow... All of those reasons would apply to 40. 124s in 9 at "minor" do not have to be loaded long even with the 4 powders you mentioned. People forget the mag length comes into play. You load long and the bullets start dragging on the inside of the mag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 I would have to respectfully disagree. WST loads are not even published for 9mm for this reason. The little extra length makes it safer. I couldn't agree more with you that you do have to be careful about going to long for you mags! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArrDave Posted February 3, 2016 Author Share Posted February 3, 2016 (edited) Dave, here's what you can expect in 9mm CZ pistols from the various 124/125 RN coated. We know from our respective OALs on the ACME 124 that my CZ's throat is a little shorter than yours by around .02, so I've given these OALs in a range, where my OAL is the shorter OAL, and I suspect the upper end of the range is where you would be: ACME 1.06-1.08 SNS 1.6 - 1.08 Blue 1.10-1.12 BBI 1.10-1.12 MBC -- I have not used, but I can look at and tell you it's going to be short, probably 1.06-1.08 Ibejihead -- I have not used, but I have found references from others to 1.125 And the winner is: Bayou Bullets 124RN -- I have not used, but I can look at and tell it loads longer than the rest, and I have found more than one reference to this bullet loading out to 1.15 - 1.16. It looks like Bayou is your only option. Of course, all the others work just fine too at their appropriate OALs. And I gave you all that grief on that other forum! LOL Thanks man. I think I'm good on a 1.1 with the BBI's. Edited February 3, 2016 by ArrDave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vixty Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 (edited) I always thought faster powders were better for loading short. I use 3.7 TG and load my 124's at 1.040. Federal primers are flat but ive shot thousands like this with no issues. I've even shot thousands of the 165s loaded at 1.145 and 2.8TG. I just don't think a minor load can hurt anything. Now once you step up to major open loads then its time to worry about loading long. Edited February 4, 2016 by vixty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArrDave Posted February 3, 2016 Author Share Posted February 3, 2016 Define "comfortable". Why is loading long for 9 minor desirable? Pressure or feeding is definitely not an issue in a Shadow. I load on a Lee Turret with a PAD. With Titegroup I can dispense 3.5-6 3.7-8 and 4.0-4.1 before the adjustable charge bar starts working. I'll get a blue press this year I promise, but those are the charge weights I can hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDescribe Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 I just don't think a minor load can hurt anything. Now once you step up to major open loads then its time to worry about loading long. Bro, this is not correct. And if you're going to operate like this, please don't encourage others to think it's no big deal. Pick up a reloading manual or two and read them to understand what you're saying is wrong. Power factor is a measure of momentum, which is mass times velocity. Neither of those will blow up your gun. Pressure is what blows up your gun. Those super fast burn rate powders we use for minor PF loads to make them nice and soft recoiling -- those super fast powders produce very high peak pressures. They peak high, push the bullet very hard for a short period of time, then pressure falls off quickly. With slow burn rate powders, pressures don't peak as fast or as high given a particular mass of powder, so the gases can exert a high level of force of force for a longer period of time. By pushing for a longer period of time, they can get the bullets moving faster at lower peak pressures. You see slower powders used in defense loads where higher velocities are desired. Now, in actual 9mm major loads, they're using the slower burn rate powders, but they're using so much powder and creating so much pressure that, yes, they are in all likelihood exerting more stress on the system than your average minor PF guy, but if you're seeing flattened primers and saying "No problem. It's minor PF," then you're not the average minor PF guy. Your lack of concern can get you in trouble. Primers don't have a steady progression of deformation from normal pressure to high pressure with fast burn pistol powders and high pressure pistol loads. Reading primers is for rifle. With pistol, if you're primers start showing pressure signs in 9mm, you're not going over pressure. You went over pressure a long time ago. Your flattened primers could be in loads in excess of 40,000 PSI. You would have no way of knowing. If you're getting flattened primers in pistol, you should back off the charge weight for lower velocity, or you should go to a slightly slower burn rate powder so that you can achieve the velocity you want within standard pressures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vixty Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Xtreme FP 124s are very short fat bullets. Hornady recommends 1.050 for their 124 fp fmj so the fact that I reduced powder makes up for the little bit shorter of ocl. It doesn't matter if I load a rn to 1.140 or a fp to 1.040 the primers always seem to be flattened which is only a characteristic of federal primers, cci's never flattened. They already start our flat due to my 650 and how well I seat them. So if you want to tell me that the 15k rounds I shot last year were really bad and I should have been blown up then go ahead. I wouldn't be shooting something that seems to be suspect and on the verge of blowing my hand up. Reloading manuals are recommendations and starting points anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooterclay Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 I've never had a primer that wasn't flattened with my 9 major loads. Even at 175PF. Federals are soft. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vixty Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 My federals are pretty much flattened from seating with my 650. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaijin Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Hello: Throat the CZ and you will be able to load out to 1.160" OAL. I did that with a Shadow I had. Very accurate with different types of bullets after I throated it. Thanks, Eric ^^This. Throating the barrels on several of my 9 mm's of different manufacture (P-35's, CZ's, 1911's) eliminate the need for different COAL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now