jkushner1 Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 I have to do some loading for two upcoming matches, Anyway, I cant do a search right now but I'm looking for a std. length .40sw load using a 180 grain fmj bullet (probably Zero). It, obviously needs to make 165 PF, but dont want to go much above 170pf, want to avoid double charges, want something clean and lastly, accurate. The last two loads I used were: 1. 180gr bullet, 4.8 grains WST made about 169pf. 2. 200gr Zero, 4.9 grains WSF made 167pf on average, has to load these a little long and they did some nose dives in 1911 s/s mags and wouldnt fit into Tanfoglio mags (a 12 cap mags only held 7 rds, - yes they were properly orineted). Other powders I've used recently Bullseye, TiteGroup and Uni. Clays. Help guys ?? jkushner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schoonie Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 4.9 grains of Titegroup 180 grain JHP Montana Gold 1.205" OAL 5" standard STI barrel yielded about 167 PF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeFoley Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 4.6-4.8 grains of VV N320, 180 grain Zero JHP or TCFM, any primer, 1.145" OAL This recipe made between 166 and 169 power factor in both of my STI 5" guns, both of my S&W 4" revolvers, another STI and a Glock 35. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 G35 4.2g of TG Zero 180JHP OAL 1.135 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hostetter Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Depending on OAL, somewhere around 5 gr's of PB with a 180gr jacketed bullet. Clean and soft, fills the case nicely to about 80% capacity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkushner1 Posted March 22, 2005 Author Share Posted March 22, 2005 Flex is it the oal that gets this load to 165PF, At 1.200 oal, I get around 130PF with 4.2g of TG. Thanks jkushner1 G354.2g of TG Zero 180JHP OAL 1.135 <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 4.1 TG @ 1.19....6" S_I in .40 = 170PF. Oh Yea - 185 Precision Black Bullet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Yep. Flex is it the oal that gets this load to 165PF, At 1.200 oal, I get around 130PF with 4.2g of TG.Thanks jkushner1 G354.2g of TG Zero 180JHP OAL 1.135 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.Hayden Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Flex is it the oal that gets this load to 165PF, At 1.200 oal, I get around 130PF with 4.2g of TG.Thanks jkushner1 Even at the same OAL for me, my Glock seem to shoot noticeably faster, with the exact same bullet (powder, bullet, OAL). But shortening the OAL seems to really speed them up, in the same pistol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precision40 Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 4.9grns of Titegroup with 180grn MG at 1.190" (.418 crimp) gets 169pf out of a 5" STI Edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KimberA8 Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 4.9grns of Titegroup with 180grn MG at 1.190" (.418 crimp) gets 169pf out of a 5" STI Edge. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> My 2004 Hodgdon basic reloaders manual says 4.7 gr of titegroup w/ 180 grn bullet is max load. It also gives the Vel at 978 which would give a power factor of 167 or so. No guide on LOA but I think Lymans says 1.135. How did you determine that 4.9 grns of Titegroup was ok to load. I am looking for a L-10 load for my .40 Edge. I don't have access to a chrono and am shooting a major match in June so I need a load that is reliable and safe in my gun that keeps me close to, but safely above, the PF requirement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 KimberA8 I have a Edge, and I load 4.9 of titegroup to an AOL of 1.20", PF of 168 You should be good to go with that load, just don't load it too short as the pressure will be TOO high. Keep the length at 1.20" and you are fine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KimberA8 Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 4.9 grains of Titegroup180 grain JHP Montana Gold 1.205" OAL 5" standard STI barrel yielded about 167 PF <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I am looking for an IPSC load for a 5" STI Edge using 180 gr FMJ. I am somewhat new to reloading [ I just follow the book] so I am not sure how to interpret the effect of different bullet types and LOA's on the Vel and saftey of the load. I do not have access to a chrono so I have been loading 4.5 grs Titegroup w/ a 180 gr FMJ bullet at LOA of 1.135 [48th vol of Lymans reloading manual] and thinking I was getting a 168 powerfactor. Someday I am sure I will be conversant on chaning LOA and all that but for now I need a reliable load for a major event in June. Any guidance from anyone on a load that is close to but safely over the PF requirement for a 5" barrel in .40 with a 180 gn FMJ with Titegroup would be appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 In general - OAL makes a huge difference in pressure, and therefore velocity. Shorter means higher pressure which means less powder to get the same pressure and velocity. There's frequently not a really linear relationship - the rule of thumb is back off the load any time you change anything, and work back up. Your current load is already Major. Are you seeing any pressure signs with it? If not, bump it up a tenth or two, and chrono. If no pressure signs, but not yet enough margin for you, bump up another tenth or so, and repeat. This is what load development is all about - figuring out the combination of factors that work best in your gun. 170-175 PF is what most seem to run to give a comfortable margin for the chrono at the match. If, in the future, you want to go to a longer OAL, keep the powder charge the same, and work back up to the appropriate major load (don't go shorter without reducing the powder charge by 10% or so, though....) Keep in mind - "the book" uses a certain exact set of components, with exact tolerances, and those loads are only exact for the exact test barrel that was used to work them up. They're a starting point, not an absolute.... Do things carefully, and pay attention to your results, and you'll be fine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 Kimber, I just posted the load for your gun above! If you are trying to load 4.9 at 1.135, you are getting into some pretty high pressure! Load longer, i.e. 1.20" seems to be pretty normal for most shooting S_I guns! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KimberA8 Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 Kimber, I just posted the load for your gun above!If you are trying to load 4.9 at 1.135, you are getting into some pretty high pressure! Load longer, i.e. 1.20" seems to be pretty normal for most shooting S_I guns! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I saw your post but was not sure how to interpret the excess over the book guide of 4.7 grs. With the post from XRe I now understand the putting the length out to 1.20 makes it safe. Thanks for the help to both of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 If you are going to reload you must have a chronograph. Really. And a set of calipers. And a scale. Until you have these things buy ammo. When you are ready to reload buy the calipers, scale and chrono from Brian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KimberA8 Posted April 16, 2005 Share Posted April 16, 2005 If you are going to reload you must have a chronograph. Really. And a set of calipers. And a scale. Until you have these things buy ammo. When you are ready to reload buy the calipers, scale and chrono from Brian. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I of course have a scale and calipers so I can determine load and LOA data. I just don't have a chrono. I thought that was what the reloading manual data was for. I will work out what I need to do based on replies to the specific question I ask of people that use my type of gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted April 16, 2005 Share Posted April 16, 2005 Without a chrono you don't *really* know what your loads are doing - see my last paragraph above That won't matter a whole bunch until you get to a major match, where a chrono is part of the match. You might end up well under or over Major - you won't know until you check it out over a chrono. But - you most likely can find someone local who'll let you come out with them the next time they're chrono'ing, and you can put some over their chrono. I concur with Dale, though - this is definitely something you want to pick up. FWIW - when I started reloading, I didn't have a chrono, either, and mooched off of a buddy once or twice to get my loads dialed in That's not the perfect or recommended way to do it, but.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsonm1 Posted April 18, 2005 Share Posted April 18, 2005 Without a chrono you don't *really* know what your loads are doing - see my last paragraph above That won't matter a whole bunch until you get to a major match, where a chrono is part of the match. You might end up well under or over Major - you won't know until you check it out over a chrono. STI Edge...$1600 6 fitted 19 rd. mags... $600 Dillon 650...$700 Holster, mag pouches, belt...$300 Having your own $85 Shooting Chrony...PRICELESS! Best investment I ever made (actually I won it as a prize for first in class in my local club). Wouldn't even attempt to load match ammo with out it. Traded the one I won for a Beta model with memory. Reaaaly handy when you forget pencil and paper... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KimberA8 Posted April 18, 2005 Share Posted April 18, 2005 If you are going to reload you must have a chronograph. Really. And a set of calipers. And a scale. Until you have these things buy ammo. When you are ready to reload buy the calipers, scale and chrono from Brian. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I have had some futher thoughts about your comment about not re-loading unless I have a chrono [ I reviwed my comments and can't figure out why you think I do not have calipers and scale, I agree that you can't reload with out them]. But am I to understand from your comment that a person should just not ever re-load with out the ability to chrono his loads? If the majority of people support that then there is something seriously wrong with the re-loading industry guidance for beginners. I never saw anything that lead me to believe I had to have a chrono to start re-loading. What are the manuals for if not to provide guidance on safe loads for various purposes? Why is it that most of the people I talk to at matches don't have a chrono? [Common comment - why buy someting I would use once or twice a year?]. Most of they people I shoot with - including some A and Master class - feel that they can find the right load from research [same gun / same bullet / powder etc.] and then spend their time and money working on shooting skills. I have been shooting action pistol for about two years and shoot about 1200 rds a month and could not afford to shoot at all if I had to buy commercial loads. I would like to own a chrono but frankly I think I will get more out of a video camera to help me critique my technique than I will get out of a chrono. That is why I ask for advice on a load for my gun and my bullet choice. It would be interesting to hear if eveyone one thinks I am wrong in my approach. I do not dispute your right to your approach, but to say someone should not reload without a chrono seems a bit harsh. IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted April 19, 2005 Share Posted April 19, 2005 A8 It is always nicer to Know what you are doing than Think that you know... Your first trip to "minor" land with a 164 PF makes you wish you had spent the few $$. I guess if you have a bud who will check your loads you don't Need a Chrono but... There are to many variables in gun barrels and, etc., to take it for granted you are actually making major PF. I would think you should at least work up your load with a chrono till you get it just right and then not change anything. If you are shooting an Open gun I would say you should Not reload without a chrono - period. IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azone41 Posted April 19, 2005 Share Posted April 19, 2005 Nobody is telling you that you have to buy a chrono. If you want to make sure that your loads are going to make major at a big match you need to check your loads (all barrels are different). I have had a chrono for over 10 years and its true I don't use it very often. But when working up loads its impossible to know whats going on without it. The club I belong has a chrono and any club member can use it. Its pretty cheap if you can get 4 or 5 people to invest in one that all can use when needed. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azone41 Posted April 19, 2005 Share Posted April 19, 2005 Now open class is a different story. because you are pushing the ragged edge of safety with super and 9mm major. In this case I belive a chrono is a must......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KimberA8 Posted April 26, 2005 Share Posted April 26, 2005 Now open class is a different story. because you are pushing the ragged edge of safety with super and 9mm major. In this case I belive a chrono is a must......... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well - thanks to eveyone for the guidance. I am shooting Limited and L-10 so I think I found a load that is safe and safely makes PF. I also talked to my local bullet supplier and he is going to get a high end chrono and make it available for rent to shooters like me. I did use a chrono to test some loads but the SD was too high and we think it was because of poor siting re: sun and shadows on the ports or maybe too close to the gun, or maybe inconsistent powder measures, or maybe . . . Anyway, I do appreciate the trouble people took to share your wisdom and experience and I will find a way to take advantage of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now