bret Posted August 20, 2015 Author Share Posted August 20, 2015 Never seen it advertised but when you market your ammo to USPSA shooters and ship it to the club where the match is held, a reasonable person would expect it to pass chrono. How hard is it to get a 124 grain 9mm projectile to make 125 power factor out of a CZ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatJones Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 All guns are individuals. It is not uncommon for otherwise identical firearms to vary wildly over the chronograph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmt Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 What manufactured ammo has any text on their packaging claiming to make major or minor PF for USPSA? I didn't know that. If the shooter used Atlanta Arms test Glock, he may have a case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrydoc Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 (edited) When you buy ammo from a manufacturer that doesn't pass chrono, what is their responsibility if any? In what regards do you mean responsibility? If it doesn't make factor I want a refund? Or doesn't make factor I want my scores to count at the match anyway? Was the ammo from a commercial reloader or a guy selling reloads? Edited August 20, 2015 by terrydoc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted August 20, 2015 Author Share Posted August 20, 2015 When you buy ammo from a manufacturer that doesn't pass chrono, what is their responsibility if any? In what regards do you mean responsibility? If it doesn't make factor I want a refund? Or doesn't make factor I want my scores to count at the match anyway? Was the ammo from a commercial reloader or a guy selling reloads? Commercial reloader. On their website they say their 9mm conformably makes minor. Not sure if they will do anything, a,refund doesn't help much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultimo-Hombre Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 When you buy ammo from a manufacturer that doesn't pass chrono, what is their responsibility if any? In what regards do you mean responsibility? If it doesn't make factor I want a refund? Or doesn't make factor I want my scores to count at the match anyway? Was the ammo from a commercial reloader or a guy selling reloads? Commercial reloader. On their website they say their 9mm conformably makes minor. Not sure if they will do anything, a,refund doesn't help much. What else could they do besides a refund? Match scores sure cant be changed. It seems reasonable to talk to them and explain what happened to help them/ the next guy out. As much as guys want you to call out the manufacturer on here, I wouldn't do it without at least giving them a call first. Good luck Amigo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 Why would you go to a major match without running your ammo thru a chrono before hand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted August 20, 2015 Author Share Posted August 20, 2015 Why would you go to a major match without running your ammo thru a chrono before hand? Match was in Illinois, guy lives in Florida, had ammo shipped there. How is he going to chrono ammo? Take a chrono tof the hotel and test it there? Once he does chrono it and it fails, what is next, hope he can find done ammo in one of the most anti gun states in the country? In the future I am sure he will chrono his own ammo and ship it or try to take it with him on the airplane in his checked luggage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 Yes, its tough when you are out of state, etc. But plan ahead. Order some ammo in time to get it and test it before you leave. Then either ship ammo yourself or order another batch (and hope nothing changed) and send it to the match ahead of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted August 20, 2015 Author Share Posted August 20, 2015 125 is a low power factor that should easily be met with ammo you buy at wally world. The problem with trying to buy ammo at the match is, a lot of other shooters may be trying to buy ammo there too, and Illinois has some messed up gun laws, they used to require a FOID card for everyone, now it is only for residents. Try explaining to the guy behind the counter you don't need an FOID card. I will take my own ammo with me or ship it, two separate shipments with enough to do the match in each shipment just in case something happens to one of the shipments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teros135 Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 I will take my own ammo with me or ship it, two separate shipments with enough to do the match in each shipment just in case something happens to one of the shipments. Now that's proactive thinking! Don't leave anything to chance, check everything yourself, and then check again. (And don't lose focus and forget to bring the gun and mags. Ask me how I know...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EkuJustice Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 What do you expect done his expenses for the entire match reimbursed? sorry not gonna happen. They really owe him nothing. If your just having your ammo shipped there take your chances and maybe get burned like he did or ship it yourself and chrono it before you ship it or reload it yourself. If shipped directy from manufacturer to the match sounds like it was done to try and be smart and save a few $$ and let them ship it to the match vs paying to get it and then pay to ship it or take it yourself. He gambled and lost and learned an expensive lesson. Alot of the "Competition Ammo" is loaded pretty close to PF so depending on the gun it may or may not make PF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnote Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 And u have to remember , not all chrono tells the same story Some faster some slower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 bret, real simple, you don't wake up the weekend before a major match and decide to go. I plan my shooting 6 months out. So order a couple of boxes several months before, run it across your chrono, and set the floor to at least 135, done. A $ 100 chrono is nothing compared to flight, hotel, meals, rental car, match fees. Did your friend also only bring one gun with him? Everybody knows you have at least 2 guns, and spare parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimitz Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 I've also never seen any of these companies "guarentee" that their ammo makes a certain PF .... the responsibility is on the shooter ... for everything they do .... painful lesson but those usually are the best teachers ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrydoc Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 I've also never seen any of these companies "guarentee" that their ammo makes a certain PF .... the responsibility is on the shooter ... for everything they do .... painful lesson but those usually are the best teachers ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walküre Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 125 is a low power factor that should easily be met with ammo you buy at wally world. Actually, not quite. Not all factory 9mm is created equal. For example, Remington UMC "green box" is notoriously on the low end of the power scale; it will quite often go sub-minor if you are shooting a shorter barreled pistol (like a Glock 19 or similar), and can cut it pretty close even with a full size. To just buy some off-the-shelf ammo and expect it to make PF out of anything is not particularly wise. Now, if this were ammo of a make and type that previously made PF but didn't on this occasion, then I understand the frustration. I don't chrono every lot of ammo I reload, and wouldn't expect to need to chrono every lot of commercial ammo either. Once I've got a good average, I only periodically recheck, if it all. (But I also don't skirt too close to the edge, either.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted August 21, 2015 Author Share Posted August 21, 2015 On their website they advertise that their ammo makes power factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doellemite Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 An advertisement and a guarantee are two very different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted August 21, 2015 Author Share Posted August 21, 2015 I never said they guarantee it to make power factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnote Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 I never said they guarantee it to make power factor.You asked what there responsibility was, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted August 21, 2015 Author Share Posted August 21, 2015 I never said they guarantee it to make power factor.You asked what there responsibility was, Must be nice to make a product that on your website says it will make power factor yet when it doesn't , it is the guy's fault that bought it that it didn't chrono, because he didn't test their product before he shot an out of state match. I know I will never buy their ammo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultimo-Hombre Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 Well all this stuff aside, shooting for no score would really suck, sorry it happened amigo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted August 21, 2015 Author Share Posted August 21, 2015 Well all this stuff aside, shooting for no score would really suck, sorry it happened amigo. Thanks but it wasn't me. I know what I will do to avoid a problem like this if I travel out of state for a match and can't take ammo with me. If a match calls for 500 rounds I will load 1,000 and chrono it, make sure it passes, and load another 1,000 make sure it passes, both batches will be shipped separately. That way if one shipment gets lost or delayed, I will have another one. I don't know if you can take a chrono with you to a match to test it once you are there. The guy I know that failed chrono learned a lot, he bought an XL 650 and a chrono. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codycoyote Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 125 is a low power factor that should easily be met with ammo you buy at wally world. The problem with trying to buy ammo at the match is, a lot of other shooters may be trying to buy ammo there too, and Illinois has some messed up gun laws, they used to require a FOID card for everyone, now it is only for residents. Try explaining to the guy behind the counter you don't need an FOID card. I will take my own ammo with me or ship it, two separate shipments with enough to do the match in each shipment just in case something happens to one of the shipments. He should have planned to drive 5 more minutes west, in to Missouri and bought factory ammo that may or may not have made PF. The manufacturer didn't GUARANTEE it would make power factor, they said it does make power factor. When they tested it in THEIR gun, it did. Your buddy still got to shoot nationals, can check his scores against everyone that shot for score and figure out where he would have finished. He got to shoot a good match, lots of rounds, and learned a very valuable and expensive lesson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts