New Trojan Problem

[Radical Precision Designs]

Well, this morning I had a little time. So, I read the initial complaint and the other similar assertions, all through the "factory" corrections.

Very interesting thread.

I have corrected similar problems in some Trojans and other 1911, especially compact "unramped" models, and to some extent in some ramped models, especially those in 10mm.

The problem is obvious when you see the "crescent" shaped "cuts" (not really blunt/skip indentations) in the bullets. This occurs usually when the barrel's boottom "sharp" edge protudes outwards into the upwards travel path of the bullet en-route to the chamber, catching it and stopping the cartridge insertion.

It is possible that the factory did cut too much of the frame ramp off to cause this problem, and did not match their barrels feeding "mouths" properly to mate/match. Of course, adding material to the frame to position the entry further back, would definetely correct this short-coming. The idea is to "deflect" the cartridges path upwards as early as possible to facilitate entry into the chamber. You will notice that in ramped barrels sometimes the barrel's ramp sometimes touches and sometimes even protudes into the magazine for this reason. This also allows more material at the bootom of the chamber to support the base of the case better.

Unfortunately, not always will the manufacturer will be willing to re-do the frame by adding material to the ramp to correct the match/mating of the barrel.

A far more common practice by both manufacturers and gunsmiths is to re-do the barrel's bottom by recutting/matching the barrell to the frame and remove the excess material causing that crescent shaped cuts in the bullets. Sometimes when matching the barrels they will actually create a small "jump/step" from the frame into the chamber. When this is done properly (without removing too much of the bottom chamber support) you will be able to feed al shapes of bullets, including empty cases with no trouble.

If, on the other hand your cartridge is jamming/stopping in a nosedive into the frame without moving and stopping up into the bootom of the barrel, then your problem will very likely be magazine (springs or lips) oriented, or the ramp needing some polishing.

Please, don't go into modifying the breech-face or extractor untill you address those "crescent" shaped cuts. One problem at a time, please!!!!!!!!

[TheQuietMan2]

I had the same problem with a new-to-me STI T40. I sent it to Virgil and now it runs. He rebuilt the feed ramp. STI really should fix the problem at the factory.

[sandman_sy]

Oh crap, ordered my STI Trojan 40 last week. Hope the local smiths here are as good as Virgil

[blue edge]

Is STI still having these problems (40 S&W) ?

[XRe]

AFAIK, no.... still, best bet is to order through Dawson or Brazos, and have them check it over... its cheap insurance that you'll get a solid firearm...

[blue edge]

SO what is AFAIK ?

[Singlestack]

SO what is AFAIK ?

As Far As I Know

[traxman]

SO what is AFAIK ?

As Far As I Know.

[blue edge]

Thanks

[mace85]

I just bought one of these guns in 9mm. And other than some occasional mag related nose dives it has been flawless. The trigger needs work, and the thumb safety needs some work. But it runs 100% with any kind of ammo. This made my buddy want to order one. His .40 model came in and he also ordered 5 new 10 round Tripp mags, in .40 (because he does not always have access to a reloader to load long ammo). Hs gun will not fire more than 2 rounds in a row. It will not work with the Tripp mags, nor the Mec-Gar it came with. However the malfunction is different than whats described. The top of the bullet gets wedged against the top of the chamber. Basically the round is facing upwards at about a 45 degree forward angle. Sometimes if you give the slide a little push with your thumb it will go into battery. Sometimes it is harder to clear.

It sounds like he is having the exact opposite problem then was previously experienced. Anybody have any ideas to fix this? He is quite discouraged that he spent over a grand and got a single shot pistol.

[bountyhunter]

I just bought one of these guns in 9mm. And other than some occasional mag related nose dives it has been flawless. The trigger needs work, and the thumb safety needs some work. But it runs 100% with any kind of ammo. This made my buddy want to order one. His .40 model came in and he also ordered 5 new 10 round Tripp mags, in .40 (because he does not always have access to a reloader to load long ammo). Hs gun will not fire more than 2 rounds in a row. It will not work with the Tripp mags, nor the Mec-Gar it came with. However the malfunction is different than whats described. The top of the bullet gets wedged against the top of the chamber. Basically the round is facing upwards at about a 45 degree forward angle. Sometimes if you give the slide a little push with your thumb it will go into battery. Sometimes it is harder to clear.

It sounds like he is having the exact opposite problem then was previously experienced. Anybody have any ideas to fix this? He is quite discouraged that he spent over a grand and got a single shot pistol.

I have trojan that is both 9mm and .40 (different top ends). One thing on mine:

The MecGar mags in .40 ride too high in the frame and I had to file the lock notch to lower them or the gun would jam a lot. I have heard the Trojan frames hold the mags a bit too hig. YMMV

The top of the bullet gets wedged against the top of the chamber. Basically the round is facing upwards at about a 45 degree forward angle. Sometimes if you give the slide a little push with your thumb it will go into battery.

I believe I know what causes this, I have seen it on a few 40s. The round hangs where the nose is dug into the roof of the throat, the rim is caught in the mag feed lips, and the center of the brass is caught on the top of the feed ramp. The fix that worked is a combination of:

1) Round the inner front edges of the feed lips on the mag to get it to release smoother.

2) polish the inside throat until mirror smooth, ESPECIALLY the top inside surfce where the nose of the round slides across.

3) polish the feed ramp especially where it rounds over the top and enters the throat. On some I have had to remove a little material at the top of the ramp to get clearance to feed, but this will reduce the amount of "coverage" that the barrel supports the brass so that should be done as a last resort.

[Merlin Orr]

I just bought one of these guns in 9mm. And other than some occasional mag related nose dives it has been flawless. The trigger needs work, and the thumb safety needs some work. But it runs 100% with any kind of ammo. This made my buddy want to order one. His .40 model came in and he also ordered 5 new 10 round Tripp mags, in .40 (because he does not always have access to a reloader to load long ammo). Hs gun will not fire more than 2 rounds in a row. It will not work with the Tripp mags, nor the Mec-Gar it came with. However the malfunction is different than whats described. The top of the bullet gets wedged against the top of the chamber. Basically the round is facing upwards at about a 45 degree forward angle. Sometimes if you give the slide a little push with your thumb it will go into battery. Sometimes it is harder to clear.

It sounds like he is having the exact opposite problem then was previously experienced. Anybody have any ideas to fix this? He is quite discouraged that he spent over a grand and got a single shot pistol.

Extractor is too tight.

[Beretta Lover]

I have a broken in trojan that lived on a diet of 8 rd magazines. WIth 8 rds generally my 40 was very reliable.

When I ran 9 rds I always got a first round nose dive stuck into the ramp.

Since this will be a USPSA SS gun and an IDPA ESP gun running 40 "very light" I decided I had to have the 9+1 capacity.

After screwing around with various bullet profiles, I decided to send it to Virgil Tripp.

I should get mine back in a week. Hopefully mine will run as well all the other ones he has done

[Beretta Lover]

I have been out of town for work, when I got home my trojan 40 had returned from Virgil Tripp.

I shot it yesterday and it is great. It feeds hollowpoints, truncated flat points and my lead ammo perfectly.

He has made it reliable with my 9 round Tripp mags, GI .45 military (crap) mags, and my wilson 47Ds in .45.

My 40 feeds 9 rounds from any 45 1911 mag as well as the correct .40 mags

[oddjob]

I thought Tripp stopped wrenching on guns?? When did he start back up??

[Beretta Lover]

I thought Tripp stopped wrenching on guns?? When did he start back up??

I do not know when he initially stopped working on guns (or that he ever did).

Therefore, it would be impossible of me to know when he stopped, or when he re started!!!!

Seriously though, I think he may be winding down (or done) accepting guns for finishing services.

He currently does Trojan ramp jobs, and his work is first rate.

I think the website still has him doing other gun work though...

[TRK]

Hi Everyone I have been reading the news about the Trojan 40. Just received mine from Dawson. A little reluctant at first. I have owned a Kimber Stainless II and could not get it to feed. Tried different OALs to no avail. All nose dived into the ramp. I was using Metalform 40 mags and everything else I could beg or borrow in 40. Even tried my Wilson 45 mags. None solved the problem. Sold it shortly therafter.

I wanted it for the SS Div. in USPSA. Very disappointing. Waited a while and read all the threads. The cash was burning a hole in my pocket so I ordered the Trojan from Dawson.

I have been shooting it now for about 300 rounds. Using Winchester Red Box 180's and my Metalform mags. Not one problem! It functions flawlessly. Everyone at my club kind of looked down at it until they tried it. No complaints. I think the new ones have all the bugs worked out. I'll try my reloads later. All my reloads from brass shot in my G22 don't feed. Guess I'll have to get something that sizes everything on my Dillon 650. I am a happy shooter. Now all my comp. guns are 40. Still carry the good old 45 though. TRK

[North]

Hi Everyone I have been reading the news about the Trojan 40. Just received mine from Dawson. A little reluctant at first. I have owned a Kimber Stainless II and could not get it to feed. Tried different OALs to no avail. All nose dived into the ramp. I was using Metalform 40 mags and everything else I could beg or borrow in 40. Even tried my Wilson 45 mags. None solved the problem. Sold it shortly therafter.

I wanted it for the SS Div. in USPSA. Very disappointing. Waited a while and read all the threads. The cash was burning a hole in my pocket so I ordered the Trojan from Dawson.

I have been shooting it now for about 300 rounds. Using Winchester Red Box 180's and my Metalform mags. Not one problem! It functions flawlessly. Everyone at my club kind of looked down at it until they tried it. No complaints. I think the new ones have all the bugs worked out. I'll try my reloads later. All my reloads from brass shot in my G22 don't feed. Guess I'll have to get something that sizes everything on my Dillon 650. I am a happy shooter. Now all my comp. guns are 40. Still carry the good old 45 though. TRK

Did you have Dawson "tune it" or is it straight from the box?

[TRK]

Hi Everyone I have been reading the news about the Trojan 40. Just received mine from Dawson. A little reluctant at first. I have owned a Kimber Stainless II and could not get it to feed. Tried different OALs to no avail. All nose dived into the ramp. I was using Metalform 40 mags and everything else I could beg or borrow in 40. Even tried my Wilson 45 mags. None solved the problem. Sold it shortly therafter.

I wanted it for the SS Div. in USPSA. Very disappointing. Waited a while and read all the threads. The cash was burning a hole in my pocket so I ordered the Trojan from Dawson.

I have been shooting it now for about 300 rounds. Using Winchester Red Box 180's and my Metalform mags. Not one problem! It functions flawlessly. Everyone at my club kind of looked down at it until they tried it. No complaints. I think the new ones have all the bugs worked out. I'll try my reloads later. All my reloads from brass shot in my G22 don't feed. Guess I'll have to get something that sizes everything on my Dillon 650. I am a happy shooter. Now all my comp. guns are 40. Still carry the good old 45 though. TRK

Did you have Dawson "tune it" or is it straight from the box?

It's straight from the box.

[TRK]

Hi Everyone I have been reading the news about the Trojan 40. Just received mine from Dawson. A little reluctant at first. I have owned a Kimber Stainless II and could not get it to feed. Tried different OALs to no avail. All nose dived into the ramp. I was using Metalform 40 mags and everything else I could beg or borrow in 40. Even tried my Wilson 45 mags. None solved the problem. Sold it shortly therafter.

I wanted it for the SS Div. in USPSA. Very disappointing. Waited a while and read all the threads. The cash was burning a hole in my pocket so I ordered the Trojan from Dawson.

I have been shooting it now for about 300 rounds. Using Winchester Red Box 180's and my Metalform mags. Not one problem! It functions flawlessly. Everyone at my club kind of looked down at it until they tried it. No complaints. I think the new ones have all the bugs worked out. I'll try my reloads later. All my reloads from brass shot in my G22 don't feed. Guess I'll have to get something that sizes everything on my Dillon 650. I am a happy shooter. Now all my comp. guns are 40. Still carry the good old 45 though. TRK

Did you have Dawson "tune it" or is it straight from the box?

It's straight from the box.

Update! I got to put some of my reloads throught the Trojan. These are Rainier 180gr FNRP on top of 4.5 grns of Tight Group. OAL 1.135.

Everything went well. No feeding problems, no mag issues just ran great. I had my doughts about the magazines but these work everytime. Probably going to order some more. The new Trojans must have been changed. Seems like they listened. The Dawson action job would make it even better. The only thing I will do, if nothing happens, is after 500 to 1000 rnds is lighten the trigger a bit. TRK