Best Bayou Bullet for CZ 75 SP-01

[johnsons1480]

I have a CZ 75 SP-01 that I'm looking for loads for. I'm currently shooting the Bayou 135 gr bullet, but am not getting phenomenal accuracy (~4" at 25 yards, good enough, but could be better). I can load to no longer than 1.100" with the 135 grain bullets. I'm looking to order a sample pack from Bayou before I order my next case. Does anyone have any compelling reason for me to try out one of the following? Valid reasons would be better accuracy, the ability to load longer (I'm getting a lot of case gauge failure due to fat rounds), etc.

124 gr RN

124 gr TCG

147 gr FP

Thanks!

[andrewtac]

I have recently purchased an sp01; haven't got it yet. However when I shot a friend's (the reason I decided to get one) I shot a magazine of my load I use in my glock. It is the BB 160 grain at 1.135. No issues. I did not check for accuracy, but was shooting steel at about 25-30 yards with no issues. The bullet is a RN so maybe there is a little more room with it. I did send dummy rounds to CGW to ensure I had enough throat to load my load in my new sp01. Also, (hopefully I don't loose all credibility with this) I use the Lee FCD on all pistol rounds. I only shoot uspsa type shooting with the pistol and I am equally concerned with reliability and accuracy. I understand why the die should not be used with the pistol rounds, and don't disagree with the science/theories of why it is bad. However, I've never had a fat round with it, accuracy is sufficient, and it works for me. I've went without it and had issues, twice. Perhaps I suck at setting up my press and as a reloader, but I see it as recognizing my shortcomings and realize the crutch I need.

Edited November 19, 2014 by andrewtac

[johnsons1480]

I didn't have any issues with gauging when I was loading at 1.125" for my glock. I had maybe 1 in 200 fail. When I use 100% FC headstamped brass, even at the short 1.100" OAL, I get a very low failure rate. It's when I start using mixed headstamp brass that the problem arises. I may need to cull out these headstamps. but Tula and Aguilla fail more often than they pass. I have a few CBC failures, but everything else seems to gauge just fine. I just feel like I'm wasting lead when I have a 5% failure rate. Those same headstamps that are failing didn't fail when loaded longer. That's why I'm curious if people are able to load longer or are having less issues with any of the bullets listed above. If the answer is culling those headstamps, then I will cull the headstamps.

[andrewtac]

When I had issues when not running the FCD it was specific to head stamps and brass that had the factory external crimp on the brass (the vertical lines). I am with you as far as waisting supplies, it was frustrating.

[phidelt208]

I"'m getting Sub 2.5" and 1.5" groups with the 124 gr TCG bullets, and titegroup, at 75 feet.

i'm running them at 1.12" OAL

[johnsons1480]

I"'m getting Sub 2.5" and 1.5" groups with the 124 gr TCG bullets, and titegroup, at 75 feet.

i'm running them at 1.12" OAL

That's what I was looking for. Did you ream your chamber?

[fishsticks]

In my experience, bullet profile makes a difference with the CZ. I have tried the blue bullets 125 gr and can only go out to 1.1, but berry's 147s pass the plunk test out to 1.15 with no issues. Reaming the chamber is an option, but doesn't seem worth it. I have had trouble with the blue bullets at 1.1 gauging with CBC brass. So, I just cull it out. The issue I believe is the tapered 9mm can cause issues when seating short, particularly if the brass is thicker walled.

[Neomet]

Bullet profile is everything. I run my BB 160s at 1.160 with a stock chamber. Almost all other profiles I run at 1.1. The 160s are very accurate and soft. Not good with some powders that need a minimum charge weight to get to their best accuracy numbers. Stunningly accurate with 3.0 of N320.

[dskinsler83]

BBI makes a bullet he molded just for the CZs

[johnsons1480]

BBI makes a bullet he molded just for the CZs

Which one?

[dskinsler83]

The 135gr round nose

[dskinsler83]

He also has the 160 round nose he can size for 9mm upon request

[johnsons1480]

The 135gr round nose

Is it a different profile than the Bayou 135? Because I can only load that one to 1.100". The reason I'm asking is that I'm have a lot of failures to gauge with the Bayou 135 because I'm loading it so short. I was having no problems when I was loading the same bullet to 1.125" for my Glock.

[cslafrain]

There is a radical difference in the chamber cutting for a glock and a CZ. The 135 in testing has performed better than the others. We found the 147 worked well in glocks but the 135 worked better in the CZ. If you want to load longer in the CZ just have the chamber throat reamed. It's a simple 5 minute job that will alow you to increase the load lengths. CZ are typically short chambered and require OALS at 1.1 or even down to 1.09. You may also look at your crimp. Over or under crimping can cause chamber in concerns.

Send me some pictures of loaded rounds and I may be able to assist.

Edited November 20, 2014 by cslafrain

[dskinsler83]

Cheely can ream the chamber usually for $30 and a one week turn around

[johnsons1480]

The loaded rounds are crimped properly. The problem is that some headstamps are too thick toward the head and there is too much bullet in the case. I'm looking for something I can load longer in the standard chamber and/or have less lead in the case.

[open17]

Interesting. I've got a pair of CZ75 SP-01 Tacticals, and I run the same loads in them I use for Glocks, my wifes M&P, and 2 9mm 1911's.

147 Bayou, OAL 1.140. EGW U die, all other dies Dillon. I've also ran Blue Bullet 147's and Montana Gold 147 CMJ's, same OAL.

[BeerBaron]

before you ditch the 135s. have you tried upping the powder charge a little? I've often found there is a sweet spot for a nice accurate load for a given gun/bullet/brass/powder combo. it may be no where near 125pf. could be closer to 135pf but shoot nicer and more accurately. play with a few loads and test for grouping. it can be solved fairly quickly.

[Neomet]

^^^^ This is a wise and true statement regardless of bullet weight. Somebody compiled a huge list of loads for CZs with various powders and bullet weights in an excel spreadsheet (I will think of who it was when I actually wake up) and almost uniformly pushing the PF up to about 132-135 resulted in improved accuracy.

edited to add. Okay, here is the link. I am back to bed.....

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=141763&hl=%20bayou%20%20darrell

Edited November 20, 2014 by Neomet

[dskinsler83]

I think this rings true on just about an 9mm in my opinion (which isn't much lol)

[cslafrain]

The ogive of the 147 is much more forgiving and allows for longer loading. I typically load the 135 with 3.8 of N320 for a 1911 at 1.145 oal. I use the same ammo for my CZ because I reamed the chamber to accept that load length otherwise it would not accept that load.

[johnsons1480]

before you ditch the 135s. have you tried upping the powder charge a little? I've often found there is a sweet spot for a nice accurate load for a given gun/bullet/brass/powder combo. it may be no where near 125pf. could be closer to 135pf but shoot nicer and more accurately. play with a few loads and test for grouping. it can be solved fairly quickly.

Yes, I loaded 3.6, 3.7, and 3.8 at 1.100".

3.6 averaged 129, high of 130, low of 127

3.7 averaged 131, high of 132, low of 130

3.8 averaged 133, high of 135, low of 132

3.6 was the most accurate, but one of these groups was compellingly more accurate than the other. All 3 were between 4" and 5" at 25 yards. I landed on 3.7 because I felt like it gave me the best cushion for power factor at +5 on the low end.

The problem isn't accuracy. I feel like I can play with the OAL and get a more accurate load. I could take 3.7 and load 1.100", 1.095", 1.090", 1.085", and 1.080", shooting in that order and watching for pressure signs. Once I found what seemingly shot best, I could play with the powder one last time and see where that got me.

The problem is, at 1.100", there is so much lead inside the case with the 135 grain bullet that I am having about 5% failure rate on gauging. Loading shorter will only make it worse. It's pretty consistently Tula, Aguilla, and CBC headstamped brass. Yes, I could cull that brass. They are clearly thicker than other brands of brass toward the head. The issue is that when I was loading for my Glock at 1.125", I had less than 1% failure rate. I already culled through the 5k pieces I bought for crimped brass, aluminum, and steel cases. I don't really want to do that again.

In summation, I am looking for a bullet that I can load less of into the case so I can have less of a failure rate. I see a poster above said something about 147 grain bullets being more forgiving. I can try that suggestion. What about 124 grain bullets? Is anyone having any luck loading longer, or are they shorter bullets leading to less lead in the case even at the same OAL? I appreciate all of the help.

[dskinsler83]

I think the best bet is have the chamber reamed by Cheely or anyone else that will do it I have used him more than once. Well worth the $30 and will save you a lot of headache

[Laughingdog]

I have a CZ-75 SP-01. I have tested roughly 20 different brands/profiles of 9mm for maximum possible OAL in the CZ-75. The following can be loaded all the way to 1.160" and work just fine.

Bayou Coated: 124g RN

Berry's RN: 124g and 147g

Xtreme RN: 124g and 147g

Rainier RN; 124g and 147g

Precision Delta: 124g (presumably the 147g as well, but I didn't have any to test)

Everything that's a truncated cone, all Blue Bullets, everything from Black & Blue bullets, and anything that's more hemispherical at the nose instead of a pronounced ogive needs to be loaded to 1.100" or less. The exception being the Bayou 147g (and others of that profile). With those, depending on their coating, you can load to 1.120"-1.135".

The main issue I've found with bullets that need to be loaded short is that the 9mm is a tapered round. so when you push the base of the bullet that deep into the case, you cause a swell that will keep it from passing case gauge, and ultimately not chambering reliably either. With the bullets I can load to 1.160" (though I actually go with 1.150"), I will have 2 or 3 fail case gauge out of every thousand bullets loaded. With bullets loaded to 1.100" or less, I will have 3-5 fail on average out of every hundred. As for grouping, I haven't noticed any real difference in accuracy between Berry's plated 124g, 147g, or the Bayou 124g. I can do a 4" group or less with all 3.

[johnsons1480]

I have a CZ-75 SP-01. I have tested roughly 20 different brands/profiles of 9mm for maximum possible OAL in the CZ-75. The following can be loaded all the way to 1.160" and work just fine.

Bayou Coated: 124g RN

Berry's RN: 124g and 147g

Xtreme RN: 124g and 147g

Rainier RN; 124g and 147g

Precision Delta: 124g (presumably the 147g as well, but I didn't have any to test)

Everything that's a truncated cone, all Blue Bullets, everything from Black & Blue bullets, and anything that's more hemispherical at the nose instead of a pronounced ogive needs to be loaded to 1.100" or less. The exception being the Bayou 147g (and others of that profile). With those, depending on their coating, you can load to 1.120"-1.135".

The main issue I've found with bullets that need to be loaded short is that the 9mm is a tapered round. so when you push the base of the bullet that deep into the case, you cause a swell that will keep it from passing case gauge, and ultimately not chambering reliably either. With the bullets I can load to 1.160" (though I actually go with 1.150"), I will have 2 or 3 fail case gauge out of every thousand bullets loaded. With bullets loaded to 1.100" or less, I will have 3-5 fail on average out of every hundred. As for grouping, I haven't noticed any real difference in accuracy between Berry's plated 124g, 147g, or the Bayou 124g. I can do a 4" group or less with all 3.

Wow, thank you SO MUCH for this information. This is exactly what I needed! I will order a sample pack Bayou 124 and start testing.