Duane Thomas Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 Turtle-- They had an El Prez at the 2002 Factory Nationals, and Sevigny won it in Production in with 58 pts. in 5.39. No one broke four seconds (TJ was fastest at 5.30), and only five competitors were below 6. Partly correct. I have all the stage printouts for the 2002 Factory Gun Nationals. They fill an inch-thick file folder that's sitting next to the keyboard as I write this. It's true that Dave Sevigny won Stage 10, El Presidente, in Production with 58 points in 5.39 seconds. The single best score on the stage belonged to Travis Tomasie in Limited-10 with 55 points in 4.71. (I feel blessed that I got to watch him do it.) 42 shooters broke the six second mark. Just FYI, only three shooters, Travis Tomasie, Steve Marsden and Taran Butler, broke five seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 Did a 3.25 with 3 mikes today. Lotsa .7x draws...that surprised me. I can post the vid of the 3.25 if anybody wants to see it... Back to the basement , SA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 Post it, let's have a look! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamakiri Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 Duane-- I was just looking at the 2002 Production scores, in light of Turtle's excellent runs; should have made that clearer, I guess. I do remember hearing the buzz about TT's smokin' stage win. Maybe the disparity between Production and L-10 scores is an indicator that it does indeed help to have a mag well and major hit factor. On the other hand, there were certainly more of the acknowledged 'top guns' shooting L-10, as opposed to Production, in that match. Still I think that as usual Sevigny gave us a pretty good idea of where the upper bar was set for Production. I gave in to my pack animal tendencies and went out and tried an El Prez today myself. I figured I'd shoot it cold-- which in this case meant it was my first shots fired for the day, without dry fire practice runs. Being here in VT, it also meant that I was shooting in 20 degrees with snow falling, wearing five layers. I managed a 5:49, so Dave only beat me by a tenth... oh, and about 25 or 30 points, since I had a mike and a few D's ... Alas. Gabe-- I know BE says you can shoot A's just as fast as D's. And I'm sure it's true, if you think about the physics involved. But that doesn't mean you can shoot A's as EASILY as D's at a given speed. That requires a focus and refinement of technique that he and Sevigny and the other top guns possess, but some of us are still working on. And working and working... Elye A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRD Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 I'll tell you, man, going out and running Prez's in your snowsuit and moonboots is the definition of focus. That or 'insanity' - Gabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 Here are the best three from yesterday:2.12.05 On the first one, you can hear the middle target fall down right before the beep. I don't remember the exact time, but it was pretty good. Watching them, this seems like the best one. Wish I had recorded the time. I thought I heard the target fall, but felt so relaxed I decided to risk it. The middle one is the 3.25 with 3 mikes, all on the first target. The way I'm rushing the turn, that's not surprising. The reload is average and the splits slow down at the end for some reason. The last one is a 3.34 with a blown reload. Did I waste .34 on the reload? Who knows...probly. After my first live fire attempt at this, I have reached some conclusions: 1. It's gonna require my best ever draw, best ever reload, and best ever splits. ALL AT THE SAME TIME. I just need to improve all of the above. 2. It's very possible, and will happen eventually. I think that's what's hit a nerve here. I don't care if people think I can't do it. I just refuse to believe that NOBODY can do it. Matt Trout is faster than me, and Jake has phenomenal speed as well. SA btw, that is a major load, 7625 over a 125. Looks pretty flat from the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierruiggi Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 Steve, on that first run, the one you said it was your best, you jerk or quiver when that target falls. Do you think that this particular event that seemed to distract you just before the beep helped make that the best run? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRD Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 Steve, on that first run, the one you said it was your best, you jerk or quiver when that target falls. I think that was just the drugs wearing off. Speed freak. - Gabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 I thought about that on the way home...maybe the target falling gave me permission to just shoot instead of "going for the record." Who knows. maybe. SA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 Duane-- I was just looking at the 2002 Production scores, in light of Turtle's excellent runs It occurred to me that was probably the case - after I made my own post, natch. Maybe the disparity between Production and L-10 scores is an indicator that it does indeed help to have a mag well and major hit factor. On the other hand, there were certainly more of the acknowledged 'top guns' shooting L-10, as opposed to Production, in that match. I think it was the latter factor at work there, not necessarily the former. Still I think that as usual Sevigny gave us a pretty good idea of where the upper bar was set for Production. Oh yeah. I wonder how many G34s owe their purchase directly to hero worship of Dave Sevgny. I know mine does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 The reload is average and the splits slow down at the end for some reason. Steve, I've seen that before (in your shooting and mine...likey others, too). Check out the vids of the Mini-mart that you shot last year at the match with Blake and Mink (Alabama?). I recall it showing up there for somebody. I wonder if it is an issue with the grip...coming off the reload? Maybe our vision taking over to bring us more under control? Maybe our stance is off, reducing our ability to deal with recoil? Perhaps a lack of aggressiveness? Complete visualization? Focus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 I have a hunch it is a psychological hurdle we need to overcome. If you watch a swimming meet for example you will notice many swimmers in a relay have better time at the same distance than than they do in a stand alone event. With the exception of the last leg, there is the awareness one must get the best time possible to help the team and that the race is not over, hence continued effort to excel. In an individual event, as one nears the end there is the temptation to begin to back off as one concludes. I have noticed this when I time myself with Bill Drills. Once I notice it I try to accelerate through the drill which has the effect of maintaining my splits rather than having them decline. FWIW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_Mink Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 The reload is average and the splits slow down at the end for some reason. Steve, I've seen that before (in your shooting and mine...likey others, too). Check out the vids of the Mini-mart that you shot last year at the match with Blake and Mink (Alabama?). I recall it showing up there for somebody. I wonder if it is an issue with the grip...coming off the reload? Maybe our vision taking over to bring us more under control? Maybe our stance is off, reducing our ability to deal with recoil? Perhaps a lack of aggressiveness? Complete visualization? Focus? You are correct, that was Alabama. Funny thing is when I just watched Steve's new videos of the El Prez runs, I immediately thought of Mini-Mart at Alabama. Probably because they sound similar.... Anyway, I think the slowing down at the end of Mini-Mart is due to the target being a little further out. I know I slow down on it a little, cause I hate the C's I get on it. On El Prez, they are all at the same distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catfish Posted February 15, 2005 Share Posted February 15, 2005 Came across this quote today and thought about this thread: The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it. - Chinese Proverb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckbradley Posted February 15, 2005 Share Posted February 15, 2005 If the person was doing it then the one who said it cannot be done has been proven wrong. Maybe the proverb should say dont interrupt the person TRYING to do it. Like I said I dont think it can be done, if it is then it will be a fluke like winning the lottery. It will never be able to be done on a consistent, on demand basis. Go for it but if your game is IPSC then I would put the energy to work on the complete game. So much of IPSC is breaking stages down, accuracy, movement and assessing risk and rewards for different approaches, not just shooting a lead slinging Elpres and happening to connect in sub 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted February 15, 2005 Share Posted February 15, 2005 If the person was doing it then the one who said it cannot be done has been proven wrong. Maybe the proverb should say dont interrupt the person TRYING to do it. Like I said I dont think it can be done, if it is then it will be a fluke like winning the lottery. It will never be able to be done on a consistent, on demand basis. Go for it but if your game is IPSC then I would put the energy to work on the complete game. So much of IPSC is breaking stages down, accuracy, movement and assessing risk and rewards for different approaches, not just shooting a lead slinging Elpres and happening to connect in sub 3. Although I think it can be done,and I have stated that here. And I think that the quest will be beneficial effects on your shooting. Chuck does make some valid points! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 Go for it but if your game is IPSC then I would put the energy to work on the complete game. So much of IPSC is breaking stages down, accuracy, movement and assessing risk and rewards for different approaches, not just shooting a lead slinging Elpres and happening to connect in sub 3. And no one is debating that. But, as has already been stated numerous times, this isn't being done to "improve my IPSC game" or to "prove I can do it every time." It's being done to accomplish something that's never been done before. Could Sir Edmund Hillary have made it to the top of Mount Everest every time he tried? Could Roger Bannister have cracked the sub-4 minute mile every time he ran it? No. And who cares? They weren't trying to prove they could do it every time. They were doing it to be the first person who ever did it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BamBam Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 Why not shoot the sub-3 ElPrez with minor ammo?? Because it ought to have major loads to matter in our sport where DVC is the motto. Same for accuracy. A sub-3 ElPrez with hits anywhere isn't really the DVC that we all try to live by, and the issue of accuracy is what is raising any doubt about the mission. But to be the "FIRST" is such a tremendous and admirable goal!! Might I suggest a quest for the FIRST sub-3.5 ElPrez with NO-POINTS down?!!?! Reading all of this thread I heard some great times, but Grauffel at 3.95 with no points down sounded the most impressive to me. People might say it "could" be done, but no one has ever done it. This is the place to start the quest and document the victory. Jake?? Steve?? Phil?? A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted February 17, 2005 Author Share Posted February 17, 2005 KC Eusebio has already done a 3.15 with 60 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyin40 Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 Those who doubted just got a reality check Flyin40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 KC Eusebio has already done a 3.15 with 60 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BamBam Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 [KC Eusebio has already done a 3.15 with 60 points. ] WOW !!! Then clearly a major power sub-3 with 60 points is the next barrier to blaze through. Best of luck to you Jake (et al). If it can be done, your attitude and presistence is absolutely the first correct step! A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 KC Eusebio has already done a 3.15 with 60 points. 0.16 is nothing! You can do it Jake! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 It's amazing that .15 seconds is the difference between a 19.05 HF and a 20.00HF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 KC Eusebio has already done a 3.15 with 60 points. That I did not know. I may have to rethink my opinion and prediction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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