Maxximuss Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 (edited) My police department uses Federal 180 grain HST ammo for duty carry. We carry the Glock model 22 (.40 s&w). I have carried the same group of rounds for just over 3 years. I noted some of the rounds looked a little short today. I measured the OAL and found them to vary between 1.125 (normal) to 1.088 (WAY TOO SHORT!). Federal stated the velocity to be 1010 fps, making these a pf of 181.8! What is your professional opinion on this? I obviously have some concern. Edited May 22, 2014 by Maxximuss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Is it your opinion that it has become shorter while in your possession, or that it came from Federal like that ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerTrace Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 My police department uses Federal 180 grain HST ammo for duty carry. We carry the Glock model 22 (.40 s&w). I have carried the same group of rounds for just over 3 years. I noted some of the rounds looked a little short today. I measured the OAL and found them to vary between 1.125 (normal) to 1.088 (WAY TOO SHORT!). Federal stated the velocity to be 1010 fps, making these a pf of 181.8! What is your professional opinion on this? I obviously have some concern. I really surprised your agency let you keep those rounds for that long. Most agencies I'm familiar with shoot their duty ammo once a year and reissue new rounds. I would venture to guess that your round were shortened from unloading and loading the same rounds over the three year period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gooldylocks Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 That is similar to what I have been told about carry ammo. Throughout the year unload your rounds and move their placement in the magazine so your aren't always chambering the same round, and after a year of carrying them shoot em up and load fresh rounds in the mag for the next year. My police department uses Federal 180 grain HST ammo for duty carry. We carry the Glock model 22 (.40 s&w). I have carried the same group of rounds for just over 3 years. I noted some of the rounds looked a little short today. I measured the OAL and found them to vary between 1.125 (normal) to 1.088 (WAY TOO SHORT!). Federal stated the velocity to be 1010 fps, making these a pf of 181.8! What is your professional opinion on this? I obviously have some concern. I really surprised your agency let you keep those rounds for that long. Most agencies I'm familiar with shoot their duty ammo once a year and reissue new rounds. I would venture to guess that your round were shortened from unloading and loading the same rounds over the three year period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EkuJustice Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Ya it's chambering the same Round over and over that causes setback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain037 Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 I agree, chambering over and over, or, shooting a few rounds out of a mag and topping it off, leaving the bottom rounds to be beat in the mag multiple times. We never keep duty ammo longer than a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxximuss Posted May 22, 2014 Author Share Posted May 22, 2014 Is it your opinion that it has become shorter while in your possession, or that it came from Federal like that ??? I believe it is from loading and unloading the ammo over several years. I am confident that Federal wouldn't allow their ammo (especially duty) to be that out of spec. I try to down load all of my mags ever couple months and reload them as to not keep chambering the same round. I would agree to get new ammo every year, I will take this info to the brass in the department and see if I can get it rectified. What's your thoughts on safety or over pressure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbu Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 I wouldn't shoot short .40 ammo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 I would be scared to shoot the short rounds. Sounds like a recipe for a kaboom to me. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biloxi23 Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Federal 180 grain hollow point duty round, FC stamp on case head, new Glock 35, did not check old duty rounds for setback = KABOOM, Case head separation, magazine blown out of frame along with extractor launched to who knows where. I checked the remaining ammo and found three to be very short. Bottom line, I should have checked the old ammo before I shot it, but I do not believe it came from Federal too short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbu Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 http://blog.vec.com/2010/12/11/reloading-its-a-game-of-precision/ The link has a graph of pressure vs overall length for .40. Interesting how fast it goes waaaaaay up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Give to your supervisor to test it out for ya if they won't replace it. Do you have to unload your gun at the end of your shift? I just unholster and put it in a safe so I don't rechamber rounds.... Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxximuss Posted May 24, 2014 Author Share Posted May 24, 2014 That is good information everyone. It is consistent with what I thought. I usually down load my gun every night when I get home. My safe isn't near my bedroom and it is very common for me to get called out at night. Having my gun in the safe would easily add 3 or 4 minutes to my ready time, which is a lot in an emergency. I just finished measuring all the round in my mags, the following is the results: 1.120-1.125 = 13 1.110-1.119 = 14 1.100-1.109 = 14 1.090-1.099 = 2 1.082-1.089 = 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodownzero Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 I usually down load my gun every night when I get home. My safe isn't near my bedroom and it is very common for me to get called out at night. Having my gun in the safe would easily add 3 or 4 minutes to my ready time, which is a lot in an emergency. This really is the problem. If you can't leave your gun loaded, you need to get a safe that you can get into quickly to get your gun. Chambering your duty ammo 5-7 days a week is not a good idea and could cost you your life. My carry and home defense guns are loaded all of the time unless I need to unload them to shoot them with target ammunition at the range. I don't have children so this isn't a problem, and if my girlfriend is home by herself, she can be confident that any handgun she sees around the house that is not locked up is ready for use with a reload nearby. If you thought it was safe to chamber and rechamber a round every day in your duty gun, I would suspect that the training you received was lacking slightly in that area. It is not safe for you to do so and I would discard any ammunition that was chambered more than a few times. I would also suggest that you get rid of all of the duty ammunition you currently have immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxximuss Posted May 24, 2014 Author Share Posted May 24, 2014 I will probably look into getting a small/fast safe in my bedroom. I do have small children so leaving the gun chambered and unattended isn't an option. My wife is a sponsored shooter so I am not too worried about her manipulating the guns. I would disagree about discarding ammo that was chamber more than a few times. I believe there is a limit to the amount you want to reasonable chamber a round, it has obviously been surpassed in this circumstance. But, a few times seems a little over cautious and would likely not fly among departments. We are required to account for every round and cannot just stop using/ discard them. I will contact Federal Ammunition to get their official recommendations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 You can for sure chamber a few times no problems. I keep a vault like this next to my bed. They have some that open with your fingerprint but I don't know if they are totally reliable....... http://www.amazon.com/Gunvault-GV2000S-Multi-Vault-Standard/dp/B001XZZA6A/ref=pd_sxp_grid_pt_2_1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tac_driver Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 +1 I agree with Gooldylocks and follow the same practice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djcantr Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Sounds like a pistol safe would benefit you. I bought a Fort Knox pistol safe at the suggestions of guys here. Very pleased with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxerglocker Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 (edited) I have a very strict rotation for my carry ammo. Starting with the first unchambered round, I make a line with a sharpie at the base and re-chamber it once again. After the second unchambering it gets a second line now marking a X on it. That round now gets rotated to the bottom of the mag. The process duplicated itself until all rounds have rotated through and at that point the mag gets swapped as my backup mag. Once the next carry mag gets rotated through, I shoot both rounds down range for practice and get a fresh box of carry ammo. Edited May 25, 2014 by Boxerglocker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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