Since we're talking buffs

[JD45]

This winter I am trying different spring weights so I can find one that works and order a bunch and forget about it. At the same time I need to settle on a buff and get it over with.

My problem is that the Wilson blue buff is cracking at around 600 shots with a 15lb. Wolff spring. The gun is a stock single-stack .45acp. I want to go down to a 12lb. spring and work from there, but I know that the buff won't make it.

I really believe that a harder buff will still stop frame damage with a 170pf load. Which ones are the hardest? I can't understand how some of you shoot pistols with 10-12lb. springs and still have buffs last 1000rds.

[JD45]

This is what I am taking about:

"Geez, what are you people doing to those poor Shok Buffs? I've put, like, 5,000 rounds on one, running a Wolff 14-pound variable power recoil spring and Slide-Glide #1. And I only replaced it because I had the gun apart anyway and said, "Ah, why not." It didn't really need it. " from D. Thomas

[SiG Lady]

14-lb Wolf spring, almost 10K rounds later, and weekly inspections of the Shok Buff under a photo loupe. No cracks. Not even a hint of one.

Your Shok Buff mileage may vary......

[EricW]

I can't imagine that anybody makes a harder buff than the Wilson's short of the Dawson Al buff.

I have a tough time believing that there isn't something going on with your gun - like the recoil spring tunnel not being square to the frame or having rough/sharp edges. I shoot 180 PF loads on a worn-out spring and my Wilson buffs show no wear at all. No marks. Nothing.

[Guest Larry Cazes]

Yeah, I got between 3-4 thousand rounds off of red heitt buffs on a commonoli FS rod with an 8lb spring shooting 170+pf loads in my 38supercomp open gun the last time I changed them out. Sounds like your really battering that gun.

[achard]

I'm also using 2 wilson buff with 12lbs recoil spring and so far so good even after 5k rounds with 175 pf.

[LPatterson]

JD45,

You might want to try the CP bullets buffer 169-001-000 from Brownells they seem to be a more resilent material than Wilson's. I've got 1 in a 1911 that is so tight that I have to use the slide release because it won't slingshot. But ddon't over look the sharp spring tunnel as a problem.

[froglegs]

Kimber 45, makes major on any day and the occasional box of federal 230 grain hydra-skoks and a 12# progressive sprinco and wilson skok buff last at least 2000 rnds it would probably run twice as long but there cheap to replace.

[Jasonub]

i put a thin steel plate over the buff, shaped like a buff and so far no wear on the buffs whatsoever

[cking]

The CP buffer that was mention holds up the best in my 45. All the rest crumbled and caused problems. The cp seems to last as long as the spring does! In Excess of 2000 rounds

[DougCarden]

I tried Wilsons, now I use CP buffs in everything, from PinGun .45 shooting 215PF loads to 9mm steel loads, I change them once a year, whether they need it or not..... DougC

[MoNsTeR]

Try a Cominolli rod.

Or, ditch the buff altogether. Has anyone ever actually damaged their frame by not using one? I think we're just being paranoid.

[EricW]

Try a Cominolli rod.

Has anyone ever actually damaged their frame by not using one?

Yes. (With 210 PF ammo in a 45.)

[JD45]

Good grief. It must be my gun, but I have no idea why my mileage would be thousands of rounds less than everyone else.

The spring is always a 15lb. The slide leaves a horseshoe shaped imprint in the front of the buff. After 400rds. in starts getting deeper(with a new spring), and by 600 or so it is cracked almost all the way through. The pistol is a box-stock Kimber.

If the buff was chewed-up on the edges I would blame it on the tunnel, but since it's not, I don't know what to look for.

[Harmon]

local master shooter and gunsmith cracked his frame using a 9 pound spring and major 40 caliber.

i tried 12 pound spring with blue wilson buff, it was ok, but seemed like the buff was coming apart at 500 rds of major 45s.

i spent some time shooting the gun with NO buffs and noticed wear starting..even with 16.5# spring. i put two(2) buffs in it, and while i didnt like the way it "felt" my bill drill times dropped a tenth on avg.

these two buffs look brand new after nearly 4000 rounds.

[Dead Buff]

I've replaced my red buff once so far...and it was a case of "Sh 1 t, how long is this thing in here - oh well, lets put in a new one..."

That was after about 18-20 months in the gun, so lets say 10k rounds running a 16lb Wolff in a P16-40 with 180pf loads.

[Skywalker]

DB,

given your nickname, I'm still trying to figure out if you're the most entitled to post in this thread or if you shouldn't speak at all...

[Dead Buff]

DB,

given your nickname, I'm still trying to figure out if you're the most entitled to post in this thread or if you shouldn't speak at all...      

That is luckily not a decision I have to make... The "Buff" part refers to a for legged animal - but who knows, plastic might do to me what sights do to others around here....

I still have that buff, the "new" one is in for about 6 months now. Both have the horse-shoe indent, one more than the other.

I don't know how hard these things are supposed to be, but mine a REAL hard...maybe the African sun and dry weather....

[shred]

Good grief. It must be my gun, but I have no idea why my mileage would be thousands of rounds less than everyone else.

The spring is always a 15lb. The slide leaves a horseshoe shaped imprint in the front of the buff. After 400rds. in starts getting deeper(with a new spring), and by 600 or so it is cracked almost all the way through. The pistol is a box-stock Kimber.

If the buff was chewed-up on the edges I would blame it on the tunnel, but since it's not, I don't know what to look for.

What are you cleaning the gun with? Are you hosing it on the buff? Ozone source nearby? Brittle and cracking sounds like a chemical problem.

[JD45]

I remove the buff and wipe it clean (no solvent). However, I do use Break-free as a lube. I recently figured out that it sucks as a lube for the amount of shooting most of us do.

I have read here that FP-10 is better for lubrication, plus the posts about Mobil 10w-30. Still, even if it is the Breakfree, the indent gets deeper and deeper as the round count gos up. I really want to try a 12lb. recoil spring, but if a buff can't make it on a 15 pounder what do you do?

Besides Slide Glide, what liquid lube seems to be the best?

[mcoliver]

If you're shredding the thin Wilson buffs try using 2. Or if you can find a thicker buff use it. My smith has this white indutrial plastic he's using to make AR buffs with. I had one made for my 1911 and it's thinner than the Wilsons. Turns out this one holds up much better than any buff I've tried.

Or you can try the aluminum buffs and see how they hold up.

[Lycanthrope]

I was shredding Wilson buffs every 200 rounds in my Kimber Eclipse using the stock springs.

I found that the slide area that contacts the buff had very sharp edges. I barely broke the edges with a file and some emery paper and now the gun runs a few thousand per buff.

[JD45]

I looked at the slide tunnel and it's rear edges seem to have a smooth radius.

For those who came in late, here are the figures:

1- uses no buff

1- gets 10,000+ rounds service life

1- hardly ever sees a mark on it

1- uses an 8lb. spring and goes 4,000rds.

1- uses a 12lb. w/2 Wilson's and gets 5,000+

1- uses a 12lb. Springco plus Wilson buff and goes 2000+

1- likes a piece of steel and a buff

2- say CP buffs go a long time

1- uses a red buff w/16lb. spring and goes 10,000rds.

1- likes a homemade buff

1- had a Kimber like me, and w/16lb. spring destroyed buff at 200rds. before gunsmithing.

And on a side note, one grip-tape making chocolate lab once cracked a frame shooting 210PF loads with no buff.

[Dead Buff]

And the moral of the story: How the hell should I know....

Keep shooting straight

-------------

From the above I would start looking at contact surfaces and cleaning/lubricating liquids for the round count to vary so much. Or someone has huge diffs in the manufacturing process.

[JD45]

I wish some good gunsmiths would help me understand how the frame is the part that is damage prone. When you look at the whole assembly that thin slide tunnel seems like it should be the first part to fail. Also, the whole guide rod head takes a major beating (without a buff). To the average person, the front of the frame looks really thick and solid compared to the other parts.

I am hoping that I got a pack of overly weak buffs. Today I ordered another pack of Wilsons and some CP buffs. I doubt if I will ever trust a spring under a 12lb. with my ammo, but I'm trying a 10 pounder to see what it does to a buffer.