rpage Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Is this the typical course of fire in an IDPA match. I have not been to an official match, I have always been and USPSA guy and took a 3 year hiatus, I have just gotten back into shooting and since my weekends are still tied up I have been going to a local shooting range match that is not an official IDPA match but loosely based on those rules and for the best of my ability it is killing me, with the 2 to the body, 1 to the head, restricted not restricted, reloading behind cover, not dropping a mag with live rounds. I am not complaining, just trying to get some clarification on a true IDPA match. The game is the game just need to know what I need to work on as looks as though IDPA is what I am going to be able to work into my schedule. All input would be great. Does anyone else struggle with this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee B Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I've only shot IDPA club matches, not the IDPA "style" matches that other's put together. Restrictions like two the body, one to the head are very rare; probably only have seen that once (other than the classifier). Reloads and dropping loaded mags, yes are part of the rules. But the 2/1 requirement is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Koski Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) I'd guess that on average you'd see mozambiques (2 torso then 1 head) required at every other match. It's not uncommon. Koski Edited December 9, 2011 by Steve Koski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ac4wordplay Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 How do you score the target if a competitor gets sloppy and the first one misses the body and hits the head, then 1 in the body, and then 1 in the head? Can the competitor go "@#!, my first shot missed the body and went in the head, now I'll put 2 in the body so that I get the right end result" ? I'm accustomed to USPSA and trying to figure out IDPA... TIA ac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirveyr Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 How do you score the target if a competitor gets sloppy and the first one misses the body and hits the head, then 1 in the body, and then 1 in the head? Can the competitor go "@#!, my first shot missed the body and went in the head, now I'll put 2 in the body so that I get the right end result" ? I'm accustomed to USPSA and trying to figure out IDPA... TIA ac If the COF calls for two scored body shots and one scored head shot, the target should be scored accordingly. If the target has the required number of hits in the proper scoring zones when the smoke has cleared, just score the Target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirveyr Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Is this the typical course of fire in an IDPA match. I have not been to an official match, I have always been and USPSA guy and took a 3 year hiatus, I have just gotten back into shooting and since my weekends are still tied up I have been going to a local shooting range match that is not an official IDPA match but loosely based on those rules and for the best of my ability it is killing me, with the 2 to the body, 1 to the head, restricted not restricted, reloading behind cover, not dropping a mag with live rounds. I am not complaining, just trying to get some clarification on a true IDPA match. The game is the game just need to know what I need to work on as looks as though IDPA is what I am going to be able to work into my schedule. All input would be great. Does anyone else struggle with this? It is hard to apply real idpa rules to a fake idpa match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpage Posted December 9, 2011 Author Share Posted December 9, 2011 At the "IDPA" style match I have shoot twice in doesn't matter when you hit it only that you do. Again this is a very lacs match I have been shooting. I think I struggle with the reloads more than anything. Always have trained to reload on the move regardless if the mag is empty or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 To the OP question- it does show up in matches... more or less depends on the club. Some people love them... some don't However- in general, wrt ac's post- a head shot will count as a head shot per the rules. However in this case, when requiring a mozambique... you generally can't just pop 3 in the head (depends on the cof). Most clubs that require a 2 to the body, one to the head will at least require a transition or if specified, some clubs will specifically require at least two shots in the body and one in the head. Some clubs will look for a transition from the body to the head (in that order) some don't. I'm not a big fan of the mozambique in matches.... but that's just my preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GmanCdp Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 i'ved use them at the state match several times and as long as you put it in the COF as a sense of 2 to the body then 1 to head,i've never had any issues with shooters..last year i had a COF setup where you did a "reverse mozambique" drill in it..had a 8 inch plate in the cut out zero down,then the shooter had to put 2 to the head.. from another thread qoute:2 body and 1 head to all targets. The shooter then explains that the head is part of the body, etc solution: two torso and 1 head shot to all targets. The head is not part of the torso and the torso is not part of the head Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Watson Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 One of the MDs hereabouts loudly announces "Two to the body followed by one to the head. Targets will be scored for two body hits and one head hit. A miss on the head will be a failure to neutralize." Hard to get around that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strick Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 One of the MDs hereabouts loudly announces "Two to the body followed by one to the head. Targets will be scored for two body hits and one head hit. A miss on the head will be a failure to neutralize." Hard to get around that. Oy vey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Directly from the rule book: In certain course designs, the course description may specify that a certain number of shots may be required on specific areas of the target, i.e. two (2) shots to the body and one (1) shot to the head. Shots that are specified for the body, but where the shooter actually shoots the head are to be counted as -0. However, shots that are specified for the head that are shot below the neck line are to be counted as misses (-5 for each miss). The rationale is that the head box is a smaller target than the body and therefore is a more difficult target. Shooting all shots to the head to circumvent sight alignment transition may be considered a procedural and incur the penalty. CoF designers and MDs should be aware of this possibility and decide beforehand how to handle it. Some course designers will specify head shots in order to simulate the threat target as wearing body armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Koski Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) One of the MDs hereabouts loudly announces "Two to the body followed by one to the head. Targets will be scored for two body hits and one head hit. A miss on the head will be a failure to neutralize." Hard to get around that. Oy vey. +1 Send that man through the re-education process. Edited December 9, 2011 by Steve Koski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GmanCdp Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 One of the MDs hereabouts loudly announces "Two to the body followed by one to the head. Targets will be scored for two body hits and one head hit. A miss on the head will be a failure to neutralize." Hard to get around that. Oy vey. +1 Send that man through the re-education process. ??? ..back east,where ever i've shot if specified in the COF, "missed heads" (if part of an "actual failure" drill,Vickers count) incur a FNT..i know its been that way since ??? 2004/2005?? and have seen it mentioned/announced in the COF at several state matches.. if you are calling a target(s) in a COF as a Failure drill,then a FTN will apply ...[back east,or southeast ] what if the shooter puts 3 shots in the - 3's on the same target that calls for 2 body then 1 to the head how is that scored?? 11 down and a FTN OR is it just 11 down, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirveyr Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 11 down + FTN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strick Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I have never seen that called at any match I have shot, thankfully. The rulebook clearly states that if the target has atleast one -1 or better hit then there is no FTN. Using the above method could give the shooter 2 FTN's on the same target..........that seems, well not right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirveyr Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Directly from the rule book: In certain course designs, the course description may specify that a certain number of shots may be required on specific areas of the target, i.e. two (2) shots to the body and one (1) shot to the head. Shots that are specified for the body, but where the shooter actually shoots the head are to be counted as -0. However, shots that are specified for the head that are shot below the neck line are to be counted as misses (-5 for each miss). The rationale is that the head box is a smaller target than the body and therefore is a more difficult target. Shooting all shots to the head to circumvent sight alignment transition may be considered a procedural and incur the penalty. CoF designers and MDs should be aware of this possibility and decide beforehand how to handle it. Some course designers will specify head shots in order to simulate the threat target as wearing body armor. Hopefully, this is one of the contradictory rules that will be dealt with by the TT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Koski Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) If the COF calls for 2 torso and 1 head, and you shoot... A ) a miss torso, a miss torso, and a -0 head: Down 10 B ) a -3 torso, a -3 torso, and a missed head: Down 11 FTN C ) a -3 torso, a -3 torso, a -3 torso: Down 11 FTN D ) a -0 torso, a -0 torso, and a missed head: Down 5 Page 17 PP 3. Failure-to-Neutralize (FTN): A. Will add five (5) seconds per infraction. This penalty applies to any target that does not have at least one (1) four zone (minus 1) or higher value hit. See Appendix NINETarget- Scoring Zones for further clarification. Failure to neutralize penalties ONLY applies when standard Vickers Count scoring is used and the target(s) do not completely disappear. Edited December 9, 2011 by Steve Koski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Koski Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I have never seen that called at any match I have shot, thankfully. The rulebook clearly states that if the target has atleast one -1 or better hit then there is no FTN. Using the above method could give the shooter 2 FTN's on the same target..........that seems, well not right. Amen. I'm no fan of "creative scoring." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 If the COF calls for 2 torso and 1 head, and you shoot... A ) a miss torso, a miss torso, and a -0 head: Down 10 B ) a -3 torso, a -3 torso, and a missed head: Down 11 FTN C ) a -3 torso, a -3 torso, a -3 torso: Down 11 FTN D ) a -0 torso, a -0 torso, and a missed head: Down 5 Yep, that's the way I'd see it as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Watson Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 Around here, target D would get a FTN also. Because it will have been spelled out in the CoF. Only if a Vickers count stage, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Koski Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 Bizarre. So the MD can override the clearest of scoring rules? Can he also hold other IDPA rules at bay temporarily? Such as, well, I guess any and all rules could be suspended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 "2 to the body, 1 to the head, just to be sure he's really...." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Koski Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 ventilated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul-the new guy Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 Around here, target D would get a FTN also. Because it will have been spelled out in the CoF. Only if a Vickers count stage, of course. That is treating 1 target as 2 individual threats. Should not be that way at all Bizarre. So the MD can override the clearest of scoring rules? Can he also hold other IDPA rules at bay temporarily? Such as, well, I guess any and all rules could be suspended. Yeah or add in additional rules at will... I hate when the course of fire takes all of the creativity out of it... "2 shots to each body and THEN 1 shot to each head" so if you shoot T-1: 2 body and 1 head and the shoot T-2: 1 head and 2 body you get a Pe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now