Model 317 Kit .22

[carexpert]

Anyone have any opinions about this gun?? I'm thinking about it for my wife's first gun, 3" barrel in .22 She has a small hand and couldn't find a semi that felt comfortable

I've read good and bad, I know it's all about the individual...It seems quite light 11.9 oz,

[Toolguy]

Should be a real nice little gun.

[Carmoney]

Be warned....317s have an extremely heavy trigger pull and are very hard to shoot well in DA mode. Even in competent hands,317s are not known for being terribly accurate. I was not able to reduce the DA pull on mine very much.

As much as I love revolvers, I'm afraid you could be setting her up for a lot of frustration.

(Unless that is your goal!)

[carexpert]

Be warned....317s have an extremely heavy trigger pull and are very hard to shoot well in DA mode. Even in competent hands,317s are not known for being terribly accurate. I was not able to reduce the DA pull on mine very much.

As much as I love revolvers, I'm afraid you could be setting her up for a lot of frustration.

(Unless that is your goal!)

Any suggestions on what to get her along the lines of a small frame .22? I'm sure it will be a once, maybe twice a month plinking - and something that she is comfortable using in case the need ever occurred...

thanks.

[Joe4d]

Ruger bearcat

[snertley]

Did she try a Walther P22? Nice size, even my daughter when she was like 8 or 9 could get a good grip on it.

[Boats]

If it's .22 revolver you want and small size frame no better than a original S&W M 34 Kit gun. Most, if not a perfect collectors gun, cost less than a new Smith 22 Revolver. Fit finish and shootablity is much better. I use mine often to start new to revolver shooters, particularly if they are going to carry a J Frame. They were available both 2 and 4 inch. Mine is a 4 inch and was a re-blue, very good double action pull. 300 bucks from a dealer that sells a lot of collectible Smiths. Re blue cuts the value considerably. 2's sell for less than 4's

Boats

Edited September 1, 2010 by Boats

[Carmoney]

My daughter shot a 4" S&W 617 10-shot at steel matches when she was still in junior high. She did just fine with it, and she's a small-statured girl. It's much easier to shoot well with a K-frame, even for those with smaller hands.

That would be my vote. Plus--you can use it too!

[Tom E]

I'm with Mike. If you want to encourage her shooting, a 617 would be a much better choice.

[carexpert]

Thanks everyone...I'm pretty sure that the 317 won't be the purchase I make now, mainly due to the trigger pull issues. Shame, it's a pretty neat little gun. Maybe for another time.

[Brewski]

This is a timely thread! My son is just starting to show an interest in shooting handguns; in fact he shot one for the first time Wednesday. Although he shot the model 41 with the red dot the best by far, he was intrigued by the 617. My 617 is the six inch model is way too heavy for him and the grip is really too large for him to be able to shoot double action effectively. I didn’t even know that S&W made casual target guns on the J-frame until this thread. Both the 63 and 34 look promising – my question is can the actions be tuned as well as the K, L, N guns? The spring setup differs from the larger guns – yes? Can you Carmonize a J-frame hammer. I’m hoping Sam will avoid some of the bad habits I developed as a youngster – such as smoking, cheating at cards, thumb cocking hammers, and such as that.

[Carmoney]

You can Carmonize the hammer on a centerfire J-frame to good effect. Not so with the rimfires.

J-frames have a coil mainspring. They tune up pretty nicely, but the actions aren't generally as good as those you can get with the larger frame models.

[MrBorland]

some of the bad habits I developed as a youngster – such as smoking, cheating at cards, thumb cocking hammers, and such as that

WooHoo!! We're gonna have some fun at the Patriot Cup, Will, though one of us may end up on the others' couch once we're back...

I have a 4" 617 you or Sam are welcomed to try. It's not as muzzle-heavy as the 6"er, which might make all the difference.

[Team Amish 1]

617's are terrific guns but the triggers are super heavy. Not sure that is very motivating for small female hands.

As much as I dislike the trigger and ergonomics of the Beretta Neos - my hands are somewhat large and chunky - for a lady it seems to be a decent gun. My wife has one as a practice toy and likes the size and feel. Might be worthwhile checking one out at the local sporting goods store. Good luck!

[Brewski]

Tom, I'll take you up on the 617 offer. Even if we have to wait a year or two, I suspect a K frame is the best option for a revo. As for the Patriot Cup - what we need is a driver so we can celebrate our masterful performances on the ride home. Will

[John Z Sr]

Tom, I'll take you up on the 617 offer. Even if we have to wait a year or two, I suspect a K frame is the best option for a revo. As for the Patriot Cup - what we need is a driver so we can celebrate our masterful performances on the ride home. Will

Calm down boys, it's an IDPA match, you must keep your vest on during all celebrations and down the beverages near to far, from low cover under the table, and sip, sip, gulp, sip sip the first 3 glasses, and if you drop a glass it's 3 seconds

[John Z Sr]

This is a timely thread! My son is just starting to show an interest in shooting handguns; in fact he shot one for the first time Wednesday. Although he shot the model 41 with the red dot the best by far, he was intrigued by the 617. My 617 is the six inch model is way too heavy for him and the grip is really too large for him to be able to shoot double action effectively. I didn’t even know that S&W made casual target guns on the J-frame until this thread. Both the 63 and 34 look promising – my question is can the actions be tuned as well as the K, L, N guns? The spring setup differs from the larger guns – yes? Can you Carmonize a J-frame hammer. I’m hoping Sam will avoid some of the bad habits I developed as a youngster – such as smoking, cheating at cards, thumb cocking hammers, and such as that.

Can't have your son develope carpul tunnel from that nasty heavy revo, I have a spot in my safe for it, just looking out for the boy

[BE Fred]

I have all of the Smith and Wesson revolvers mentioned above.

The 317 is not a K frame as the number suggests it is a J freame. Therefore it has a coil main spring not a leaf mainspring (someone mentioned this). The J frame can be tuned but not to the degree that a K (L or N for that matter) frame can.

My 317 2 inch snub has fixed sights, it is an easy carry. My 317 3 inch has high vis front sight and adjustable sights, this is a great companion in the woods and was with me today as I set tree stands for the upcoming deer season.

If your spouse can handle a K frame it will tune better. The model 18 is a "combat masterpiece" it has a 4 inch barrel and a ramped front sight and adj. rear sights. This gun may be the ticket.

The model 17 (or 617 in stainless) is normally a 6 inch gun. The stainless are almost always a full underlug. This is a heavier gun.

The grips you use will make a big difference. Small hands do better with standard magna grips (not the target grips). A grip filler can be added, I like the Tyler T grips, they work well and look great. Another small, quality grip is the Jerry Michlick grip.

All that said, my wife can not use the K frame due to hear very small hands. She likes the Wather P-22 (I think it is crap) but she shot it alot and that is what it is all about. This was her first gun, she no longer shoots it but it got her started.

Currently my wife shoots a ruger Mark II with a Tactal Solutions PacLite Barrel for 22, and a Custom 1911 with a flat MSH and short trigger. She is a shooter, I have seen her clean a PPC course 600 out of 600, more than once.

Good luck with your quest, make it fun for her to shoot and she will, this is ALL that is important.

Fred

[Northern Xtreme]

This weekend I happened to stop by a small shop I'd never been in before and asked the owner if he had any S&W revolvers, he pulled out a nice little 4" model 34 that was in pretty decent condition for $400.

The double action seemed pretty nice, of course I wasnt firing it so I dont know if it would actually go bang, but I dont think anyone had worked on it.

I might have to go back and buy it, I actually bought a model 14 instead at another shop for $325 tax included.

Does $400 sound like a good deal to you guys for the model 34?

[Cherryriver]

For this neck of the woods, $400 is indeed a good price for a quality gun.

Of all the guns I've sold and regret selling, the 34 I bought new in '75 for my small-handed wife might be the most regretted.

I've since gotten an older 63, the same but stainless. Fitted with a superb rosewood Eagle grip it's my basic trainer and many a newbie has fired their first shot with it.

I'd trade it in a blink for a 34, though... that old blue gun still rides near the top of my favorite guns memories.

[Northern Xtreme]

Do the model 17 speedloaders work in the 34?

[Cherryriver]

34s are six-shooters, at least the older ones.

[Carmoney]

With all due respect, you guys need to get the notion out of your heads that small-handed women have to be given J-frames.

Take another look at my daughter Jill in the pictures above--that's a 4" K-frame w/underlug she's shooting, and yes she won the junior event that year at the Missouri Steel Championships. Your wives' hands are not smaller than hers when that photo was taken, OK?

If that doesn't convince you, consider Molly Smith (pictured below), who shoots her full-size N-frame 627s well enough to be made a member of Smith & Wesson's competition team. I will guarantee you that none of your wives have hands smaller than Molly's.

Edited September 21, 2010 by Carmoney

[Revopop]

Carmoney's right on. I just picked up a Model 18, and it's the perfect size for me. I have short fingers, my girlfriend says I have "delicate lady hands". Her hands are even smaller, and she felt the M18 fit her better than the 4" M34 her dad gave her years ago. I don't think that grip size is really an issue. Remember that the grips are interchangeable, and there's dozens and dozens of different styles that all feel different to different people.

I could certainly see a 6 inch barrel with a full underlug being an issue for somebody with small hands, but with a 4" barrel it shouldn't be an issue. If you get an older M17/18, there won't be a full underlug and the barrel profile is lighter, so even a 6" may not be a problem.

[Northern Xtreme]

I wasnt really considering the 34 primarily for grip size, I just thought it was a nice older Smith, which are getting harder and harder to find.

I thought the action felt nice which is one of the complaints I had about the 617's, but maybe its because the spring is worn, I dont know.

I actually didnt even realize it was a J frame until I started reading this thread a little further, but thats not the real selling point for me. However my sons hand is fairly small and the fact it is a J frame is just a bonus, and I have a 7 year old daughter that may want to shoot handguns in the next few years.

I bought the model 14 for my 10 year old son to shoot and it seems to fit his hand fine, but having a light double action will be very important because his grip strength hasnt developed much yet, and fatigue will set in quick.

The nice thing about a revolver is I can load mouse fart 38's and the gun will still go bang everytime, I have been having trouble getting a centerfire auto to function with loads light enough that he can handle with decent splits.

Plus I want him to be a real man and learn the art of the revolver of course!