Stalker Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Can you use one gun for production & standard division if you base your pistol configuration on the production division rules? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Sure but not in the same match. Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalker Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Why not? Which part of the IPSC rulebook is it written? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Rule 5.2.6 Rule 6.2.3 Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalker Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 But it didn't say anything about the handgun should only be used in one division per match! (sorry but i'm new to this IPSC!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbear38S Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Since you can only shoot the match once for score, I guess it really doesn't matter, does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalker Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 oh! i see! (typical newbie!) so, does this apply if you only use one handgun for two divisions or even though you have a different gun for each division, you can only join one division which you will receive scores? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shooter Grrl Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Right - you can only shoot a match once (for score) - period. The thought behind this rule is that with the second gun, you've already "practiced" the stages and would have received an unfair advantage over your competitors. So you can only shoot a match once in one Division (meaning you can't sign up for 2 divisions and shoot it once with one gun). You gotta pick one when you sign up for the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Pinto Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 I would like to contribute to this discussion by pointing out a unique Rule D in Appendix E, Modified Division. If you have a gun which fully complies with the requirements of either Standard or Production Division (which are both recognised in a competition), you may not use that handgun in Modified Division. Since you are in the Philippines (a region very familiar to me), I suspect someone has incorrectly tried to apply this rule to you in respect of shooting the same gun in Standard and Production Division. As Pat and others have already pointed out, the only rule which affects you using the same gun in Standard and Production Divisions in the same competition is Rule 6.2.3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalker Posted April 28, 2002 Share Posted April 28, 2002 Thanks for the replies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted April 30, 2002 Share Posted April 30, 2002 Pat, [thread drift on] "Golf should be a contact sport." And, should be scored comstock. [tdo] be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Pinto Posted April 30, 2002 Share Posted April 30, 2002 You mean golf is not scored Comstock ?? Damn. Now they tell me. Anyway that's why I prefer shooting over golf. I still miss my target sometimes, but at least my bullets don't hook or slice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfinney Posted April 30, 2002 Share Posted April 30, 2002 Your bullets DON'T slice? Darn, I'm pretty sure mine do, alot! That's the only reason I can think of why my hits are low and left - It CAN't be my shooting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julien Boit Posted May 3, 2002 Author Share Posted May 3, 2002 Vince, Here is my question: Is it true that if I plan to shoot in modified division with my standard gun, and both classes are recognized at the match, I will not be allowed to shoot modified and I'll be automatically put in the standard class ? DVC Julien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Pinto Posted May 3, 2002 Share Posted May 3, 2002 Yes Julien, you understand correctly, and Part D of Appendix E Modified Divison is the applicable rule. The reason for this rule is to prevent competitors going to a match ready to shoot Standard (or Production) Division but, when they arrive at the match and realise there are far fewer competitors in Modified Divison, they jump divisions. (Edited by Vince Pinto at 11:49 pm on May 3, 2002) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julien Boit Posted May 3, 2002 Author Share Posted May 3, 2002 In france we have two separate nationals: Open/modified and Standard/revolver/production. My main concern is : Can I shoot the Open/modified national with my standard gun. Or will I have to use a "real" modified gun ? Thanks DVC Julien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Pinto Posted May 3, 2002 Share Posted May 3, 2002 Julien, >> Can I shoot the Open/modified national with my standard gun. The short answer is NO, not in Modified Division. However you can shoot your Standard gun in Open Division if you wish. The rule is very clear: "Any handgun which satisfies all the requirements for either Standard or Production Division may not be used or entered in Modified Division". To shoot in Modified Division you must use a gun which does not qualify for Standard or Production Division. If you are still unclear, just give me a full description of your "standard gun" (i.e. make, model and modifications, if any), and I will advise you further. Or, if you prefer, contact my dear friend Monsieur Alain Joly at joly@ipsc.org (who is with the FFT), for more information (in French) (Edited by Vince Pinto at 2:26 am on May 4, 2002) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julien Boit Posted May 3, 2002 Author Share Posted May 3, 2002 Ok clear for me Vince. I asked you this because I and fellow shooters planned to shoot the Open/modified national with our standards guns, which complies with the standard criterias. Some of us tell that it would be possible as long as the standard class was not in the game, but ok, I'll fit a specific top end (now I really have to do this )! Thanks DVC Julien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julien Boit Posted September 26, 2002 Author Share Posted September 26, 2002 Can someone tell me why IPSC makes rules that are not enforced ? Let me explain: At WS, I saw plenty of standard shooters with mag pouches in the wrong place (too much in front), sometimes Holsters too. I also saw a Production shooter with Heinie sights on his Glock, which is forbidden. Why keeping those rules if they are not enforced, why don't we all play with the same ? DVC Julien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D Posted September 26, 2002 Share Posted September 26, 2002 I can't speak to the holster or mag pouch problem but you can install ANY notch and post sight system on your Production Division gun as long as you make NO modifications to the slide in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Dunlop Posted September 26, 2002 Share Posted September 26, 2002 Julian, the sights are ok as Chuck says. In Cebu the shooter was required to mark the possition of his holster and mag pouches on a card. The cards were checked at each stage by the RO before the breifing. The holster position is fairly liberal, the hip bone extends well out to the front and as long as the holster is behind that most forward point it is ok. Whether it is an advantage is another matter, for me the point of the hip is the spot. No question on mags out front though, thats a pretty big advantage for a standing reload and should be checked by the RO P.D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sweeney Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 I too noticed the migration of mags and holsters. The problem is defining and enforcing. You get skinny guys like us (Julien, Phil and yours truly) and "behind the hip bone" starts to seriously limit holster and mag pouch capacity. I saw one petite woman competitor whose 4th mag was back past her spine. Good luck reaching that one! You get a "stable weapons platform" like one of the Germans I saw, and just finding the hip bone is tough. What to do? Heck if I know. Tattoo a line on our body? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 "Skinny Guys like us".......... Finally, being BIG has an advantage ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 Quote: from Patrick Sweeney on 9:52 am on Sep. 27, 2002 You get a "stable weapons platform" like one of the Germans. I like it. I think I'll use that on my doctor at my next physical..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted September 27, 2002 Share Posted September 27, 2002 Remember, it is not a beer gut, it is recoil absorbing mass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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