Flexmoney Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 I got a message from one of the shooters/members on the Enos Forum, asking if it was OK to post the request below. I told him I'd post it for him. - Admin. Title "Looking for small quantity of Igman .38 spl ammunition to assist in a murder investigation"Post I am investigating a murder which occurred in Cincinnati back in Jan. I need a small quantity of Igman .38spl 158 grain lead round nose ammunition to do ballistic comparison with autopsy bullets. The head stamps are "IK 03". I need no more than 20 rounds or so and will buy the ammunition or workout a trade with anyone willing to part with a few rounds for their trouble. Thanks, Colin Vaughn Contact me at Colin Vaughn Cincinnati Police Department 513 352-6958 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSeevers Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Sure I have a whole box minus one round that I shot in Cincinnati last....... Never mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMV Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Sure I have a whole box minus one round that I shot in Cincinnati last....... Never mind There's always one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waltermitty Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 That's odd. How did he get head stamps on revolver ammunition used in a murder? Did the perp stand over the body and do a reload? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFlowers Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 They may have recovered a gun with the spent cartridges in it and now need to find that specific brand of ammo for ballistic matching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyZip Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 There is a model of Smith&Wesson that is an auto that shoots 38spl loaded with wadcutters. I can't remember the model though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calishootr Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 its a smith and wesson model 52 target wadcutter gun, primarily used for bullseye competitions, if he is looking for lead round lased bullets than the model 52 isnt your gun, because a normal lead round nose wouldnt fit in the gun;s magazine or chamber as its made/designed for only hollowbased wadcutter loads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waltermitty Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 They may have recovered a gun with the spent cartridges in it and now need to find that specific brand of ammo for ballistic matching. Still odd: http://www.igman.com/ammunition/ http://www.igman.com/ammunition/codes/I/IK-Yugoslavia.html Presumably IK 03 would be fairly recent vintage, but I've never heard of any Igman in 38 Special. I am aware of 9mm, but I thought everything else they made was rifle ammo. Or has "Axel Foley" stumbled onto another wildcat round cut down to fit a hand gun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R112mercer Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 NOTHING is surprising in perp guns. They can do things that no normal shooter can get away with, .380 in a 9mm chambered gun, 9mm in a .40 chambered gun, AND vice versa. Normal rules don't apply here, they have their own form of luck. As for regular .38 ammo in a Model 52, the 52 CAN chamber any normal .38 Special round, the chamber is a standard .38 Special chamber. But you are right, the magazine will only fit flush seated wc ammo. I have heard of guys chambering .38 Super in M52's , but I like mine far too much for that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waltermitty Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 NOTHING is surprising in perp guns. They can do things that no normal shooter can get away with, .380 in a 9mm chambered gun, 9mm in a .40 chambered gun, AND vice versa. Normal rules don't apply here, they have their own form of luck. As for regular .38 ammo in a Model 52, the 52 CAN chamber any normal .38 Special round, the chamber is a standard .38 Special chamber. But you are right, the magazine will only fit flush seated wc ammo. I have heard of guys chambering .38 Super in M52's , but I like mine far too much for that... I can see 9mm firing in a 38/357 revolver, maybe even without a moon clip occasionally, but if that's the case, law dog Vaughn is barking up the wrong tree... If we had the actual gun model (instead of guesses) and a photo of the brass this could probably be resolved quickly. If he *is* looking at 9mm brass then his ballistic testing will be kludged firing any other ammo since (as we all know) 9mm is .355"-.356" and is much shorter than .38 Special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 If we had the actual gun model (instead of guesses) and a photo of the brass this could probably be resolved quickly. If he *is* looking at 9mm brass then his ballistic testing will be kludged firing any other ammo since (as we all know) 9mm is .355"-.356" and is much shorter than .38 Special. "I need a small quantity of Igman .38spl 158 grain lead round nose ammunition" "The head stamps are "IK 03"". Seemed pretty clear what he needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waltermitty Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 If we had the actual gun model (instead of guesses) and a photo of the brass this could probably be resolved quickly. If he *is* looking at 9mm brass then his ballistic testing will be kludged firing any other ammo since (as we all know) 9mm is .355"-.356" and is much shorter than .38 Special. "I need a small quantity of Igman .38spl 158 grain lead round nose ammunition" "The head stamps are "IK 03"". Seemed pretty clear what he needs. Sorry I don't have the energy to lay it all out again for you Tom. Besides, I just hate beating dead pink unicorns. Of course, I hope the first person that comes up with said unic.. um, ammo will post the link for our mutual edification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMV Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Wow... You guys are just gonna have to trust me that the ammunition in question is headstamped "IK 03" (it also says .38 special). As for how all this come together and the whole story, I will be happy to relay all that when the case is solved and the bad guy arrested. In the meantime, I really need some of this ammunition and I KNOW they made it cause I have a couple rounds in my possesion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Xtreme Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Wow... You guys are just gonna have to trust me that the ammunition in question is headstamped "IK 03" (it also says .38 special). As for how all this come together and the whole story, I will be happy to relay all that when the case is solved and the bad guy arrested. In the meantime, I really need some of this ammunition and I KNOW they made it cause I have a couple rounds in my possesion! Well send them to the man for crying out loud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbbean Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Wow... You guys are just gonna have to trust me that the ammunition in question is headstamped "IK 03" (it also says .38 special). As for how all this come together and the whole story, I will be happy to relay all that when the case is solved and the bad guy arrested. In the meantime, I really need some of this ammunition and I KNOW they made it cause I have a couple rounds in my possesion! Flex should have told you that we all regularly watch CSI and several of us stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night. Feel free to ask us any sensitive forensic questions or for help in complicated criminal investigations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 Well send them to the man for crying out loud! LOL...CMV is "the man". I opened the post so folks wouldn't think it was out of line here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waltermitty Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Wow... You guys are just gonna have to trust me that the ammunition in question is headstamped "IK 03" (it also says .38 special). As for how all this come together and the whole story, I will be happy to relay all that when the case is solved and the bad guy arrested. In the meantime, I really need some of this ammunition and I KNOW they made it cause I have a couple rounds in my possesion! I'll certainly take your word for it, but it is a little strange: 1) That a Law Enforcement agency lacks resources to the extent that you appeal to an internet board(s) for supplies. 2) That the round in question is so obscure that such lengths are required to find it. This wouldn't be the first spoof/troll/noob question to land here that had some important detail omitted. So take no offense, but at least at this point you must realize this isn't something common and therefore may get some additional scrutiny. All you guys that have this ammo laying around offer it up. I am unsubscribed and out. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Do a little Googling... It appears some Prvi Partizan .38 special ammunition has an IK 03 headstamp. You may be looking for Prvi Partizan and not Igman. Wideners has it in stock. This is the quote on their page "NOTE: This ammo is very high quality. It is made by PPU but it has the IK headstamp. It features non-corrosive and non-crimped boxer primed fully reloadable brass cases. The bullets are all lead round nose bullets and they shoot really well. Very accurate." Call them and ask them to check the headstamp. Since you're LE, they'll probably check it for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I should probably mention, a lot of places appear to have prvi partizan 158gr .38 special (or had it). Widener's just happened to mention the "IK" headstamp that matched hits I'd found on "IK 03" and "Prvi Partizan". I found that interesting. Midway has prvi as do many others. Waltermitty - You can take the tinfoil hat off now. Prvi isn't all that obscure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 I'll certainly take your word for it, but it is a little strange: 1) That a Law Enforcement agency lacks resources to the extent that you appeal to an internet board(s) for supplies. 2) That the round in question is so obscure that such lengths are required to find it. This wouldn't be the first spoof/troll/noob question to land here that had some important detail omitted. So take no offense, but at least at this point you must realize this isn't something common and therefore may get some additional scrutiny. I guess I've been telling too many jokes in the Revo Forum lately. This is not one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itchy Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I still think it's awesome that the folks here on the forum are willing to lend a helping hand. Sometimes it just takes someone to look at things from a different angle to get things rolling. Seiichi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMV Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I assure you all this isn't a joke or spoof. Additionally it isnt that we lack the resources to buy some ammunition, I haven't been able to locate any. design of the projectile is somewhat unusual in that it is a LRN with a deeply concave base. I only have (had) three rounds of the ammunition for the firearms examiner to work with for comparison and every cylinder in a revolver leaves slightly different identifying characteristics on a fired projectile. Finally, I came here because I figured where was I going to find a more knowledgeable group of shooters, in one place, willing to help... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMV Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Do a little Googling... It appears some Prvi Partizan .38 special ammunition has an IK 03 headstamp. You may be looking for Prvi Partizan and not Igman. Wideners has it in stock. This is the quote on their page "NOTE: This ammo is very high quality. It is made by PPU but it has the IK headstamp. It features non-corrosive and non-crimped boxer primed fully reloadable brass cases. The bullets are all lead round nose bullets and they shoot really well. Very accurate." Call them and ask them to check the headstamp. Since you're LE, they'll probably check it for you. I will. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMV Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Think I have found what I need. Thanks to all who helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopalong Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Good Luck with the investigation CMV. I hope you catch whomever did it. Hopalong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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