Tim/GA

Is there video of this Tim or can you explain the stage in more detail and why you liked it? Another thing we try to do at our local 3GN matches and they do at a lot of the big matches is to have options on what you shoot with what. For instance we often could shoot white painted steel with either shotgun or pistol, etc. I found a couple (not sure who the shooters were in the first two, just found the video) of the 3 "bay" stages. Stage 1 and 2 were the 2 bay stages and 3 was in one large bay. All 3 stages were 3 gun stages. Stage 1- Stage 2- Stage 3- This one is Keith Garcia shooting stage 3, rifle had close paper and steel poppers and a dueling tree at 50 to 60yds, shotgun steel and then pistol at the end.

Glad to see this announcement and the date not being a week earlier since we have the Freedom Munitions match at Clinton House, SC. that weekend. We have gone from almost no 3 gun matches around the SE to having some on consecutive weekends! I hope to be there. Thanks for taking this on. While I prefer matches that include some natural terrain stages along with bay stages, that is just something we cannot have here in Coastal Georgia and FL. I know it is a bit different for you, but thanks for giving it a shot. While I am not a huge fan of single gun stages, it is easy for that one stage to tank a whole match, it is not unusual- especially shotgun. Having just shot the 3GN SE Regional match, I was surprised how much I really enjoyed the 2 stages that each were set in 2 bays similar to what yous see with the Pros. Something we do at our local 3 gun matches since we have smaller bays.

I am looking at retention holsters again after the 3GN regional match. There were 2 stages that included running from one bay to another in pretty much the exact same distance, curve etc. One stage you did this run AFTER dumping your pistol and on the other stage you did the run with the pistol holstered. I felt far quicker and more secure running regular with no pistol to worry about than with one had on the gun worrying it would pop out on the run. Made a difference in my mind if nothing else, and yes I had the friction retention cranked down on my holster. Also, everyone talks about the pistol when running. What about props or other guns. In those cases, no matter how much friction you have it might not be enough. I got to watch a loaded Glock spin 2 times over with the muzzle flashing me on each spin when a shooter caught the rear sight with his nice soft recoil pad on a shotgun. You could see the marks on the pad when we looked at it, I doubt anything that was not positive retention would have held that pistol in the holster.

Interesting numbers. I am mine are from a 16" 223 Wylde chambered barrel and run right at 250fps slower than yours pretty much across the board. Also similar numbers as far as accuracy with the Xtreme bullets. For longer distance stages/shooting I load Hornday 55grn Ballistic Tip 2nds or factory overruns since they have same trajectory and hold 3/4" at 100 yards.

Great match, thanks Charles, Tennille and bunch of hard working ROs. I am tired and sore, I can only imagine what some of the ROs are feeling. First time out with this format and no real issues is hard to do but they did it. 1/2 day format- I like it better than sitting on my butt for 1 hour plus and if you were morning on day one it was early anyway. Rockcastle is a bit different with the distances and the way the non-shooting stuff is set up. This match was great for 1/2 day. A couple of tips to make it work: Get your squad off their butts and setting! This is 3 gun and there is a lot to do, just do it. Thus the reason I like self squadding, I know they shooters on the squad are hard workers. Be prepared- It is only 4 stages a day that most all shooters looked over ahead of time. Why are people having to load rifle and pistol mags after every stage? Shotgun, sure but the vast majority of us have the mags to be prepared at least most of the time. Be ready- every set of ROs I saw were perfectly clear on how they wanted the on deck shooter to be ready. The hard working squad is a waste if every shooter has to be called to the start. Bring what you need to make it half a day without hitting the gut truck. It is only HALF a day! I much prefer being able to spend that half a day hitting the side matches or demos, eating, resting, etc rather than wondering if I can be doing anything in between stages without being late, etc. DQs, the ones I know of were shotguns not being empty and safety off when ditched. Thankfully I got that out of my system at our club match in Jan.! While there were some specified procedures and some did include a match DQ if broken, that is part of natural terrain stages- this is not USPSA where it all has to be done with props.

I use our Nooks for our 3 Gun Nation club matches along with USPSA. I could swear that I have exported the overall match (the stages times, etc) to either text or csv in the past so I can upload the columns I need to 3GN. For some reason I could not find it this time using the newest version 1.2.12 Instead I had to copy from the HTML match results and paste to text. Was I wrong about before or did this change with the newer version? Thanks

I wondered why things were so slow the other day. Thanks!

It is actually 7 stages for Am, 8 for Pro. Agree though about that 1 Pro stage on Sun., cannot stay an extra day for 1 stage as it would be another day off work. It does spread out the prize tables which completely separate between the 2 matches. As for between stages, there is time but at this match there is a lot to do with the side matches, vendors, etc. Other matches, not so much. 3 day matches leave a lot of us out since it takes so much time away from home/work, etc. Dillos, not sure how it was last year for Pro but in Am they had it in some piles on the table. Mainly the last ones to be taken, where I was The first year or 2 they were in the shooter's bag if I remember- happily I have 1 from all 3 matches so far. less than an hour to see if in again.

That is ios, right? That makes sense since that version is designed to upload directly to USPSA from what I have seen. I am using the Android version so it is not there yet.

I had emailed earlier today as well. Did a test match in Practiscore and it would take 2 classifiers but when I uploaded to EzWinscore it gave me the error message Bill posted in the other thread. Not just the software though, like I had said the fees have to be worked out. Steve, if I did as you suggested I would basically end up paying for 2 matches with a classifier. It would also not be kosher as far as activity points and I am pretty sure there would have to be more than 1 stage in the second match to even be classified a match. All in all, the new rule is in place but we cannot implement it until things are updated/changed is what I am telling our shooters. Bill, I have to think the entire way classifiers are handled will be changing a the office with the change in time frames etc. I guess it will most likely be handled in as that is.

We can close this one, there are better threads going: Kim Williams posted responses to questions here: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=190081&page=2#entry2103330 and the scoring/uploading part of the change is here: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=190202#entry2103889

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=190081&p=2103330 That is true, and exactly the issue. The new ones are in place immediately without the mechanism being in place to implement them. In Practiscore you can have more than one classifier in your match, but when done in or uploaded to EzWinscore it will only allow you to upload to USPSA one for a regular Level 1 match without changing it over to a Special match. We also don't have a fee amount for more than 1 in a match- right now $1.50 per shooter for 1, $5 per shooter for a Special. What is it going to cost us for 2 in a regular match? I don't mind the change at all, more flexibility and gives me a chance to meet the needs of our shooters. Whether it being 2 classifiers/3 regular from time to time or combining 2 classifiers in one bay have 4 regular stages. I just don't like having to explain to shooter that what they want is actually allowed but I cannot set it up for them.

Thanks Ken, so I take it that means that as of now the 1 classifier a match is not in effect BUT we don't have a way of actually doing more than one for the time being? I am also wondering how we will be charged for the 2nd one. Generally we have to charge a bit more for the Special Classifier matches to make up for the extra fees- I wonder if we will we be charged extra for the 2nd one?

Did any other MD hear from a shooter about this yet? "Ending the Classifier Limit One major administrative change for 2014 is the elimination of the 12 per year limit on USPSA classifier score submissions. The development of the new activity credit system means there is no longer a need for this restriction and clubs may now submit as many classifiers as they like. This also means the restriction of one classifier per match without a special classifier is also removed. We hope this gives clubs more flexibility in their match design and helps clubs get new shooters classified faster." It is in the Report to the Membership and I don't understand. The rulebook (the brand new, 2 week old one) still shows 1 classifier in a Level 1 match, other than a Special Classifier match. Correct me if I am wrong, but the current software will not even allow us to upload more than 1 classifier stage in a regular Level 1 match. I need to answer some shooters who are trying to get classified before upcoming matches and other local clubs have been rained out the last 2 months making it hard for them.

Didn't we just get a new rulebook?? A shooter at our club brought to my attention that the limit of 1 classifier in a Level 1 match(other than a once a year Special match) has been changed. When I asked where he saw that was the first time that I heard about the Report to the Membership posted on the main USPSA page. (as an aside, we cannot get an email system together for all members to be notified about such things as the report?) I checked and there it was "Ending the Classifier Limit One major administrative change for 2014 is the elimination of the 12 per year limit on USPSA classifier score submissions. The development of the new activity credit system means there is no longer a need for this restriction and clubs may now submit as many classifiers as they like. This also means the restriction of one classifier per match without a special classifier is also removed. We hope this gives clubs more flexibility in their match design and helps clubs get new shooters classified faster." I don't see that change in the new rulebook- how am I as an MD supposed to answer a shooter when I don't know anything about it and the brand new RULEbook that went into effect 2 weeks ago does not say it? Not to mention that I don't even think that the scoring software will ALLOW us to upload more than 1 unless it is a Classifier match. Posting about that in the scoring forum though.

Running a local USPSA club and being part of running a 3GN club, I can tell you that people really want a web page ALONG with Facebook. Not everyone is comfortable with having a Facebook page for various reasons and while it is fast to get info out, a good website and mass email system is worth its weight in gold. We are lucky in that a local donates his time and money to host and run the sites for 3 relatively local clubs. Someone like that is invaluable since clubs have to do it on their own. That said, the GA Section website offers us space and the ability to post there as well (in fact I need to check on ours) so we are pretty well off compared to others. Really, each club needs a website since anyone who can hunt and peck on a keyboard can search for USPSA club location and find the club's website.

Lots of red dots used, I used one the first 2 years.

Some interesting ideas, will PM you to see about getting a few of the Sketchup files if you don't mind so I can make them fit our bays and needs. One thing I noticed, you have a number of times in the stages where you have shots at low, angled targets up close. I like targets and use them often but you have to be careful of 2 things. 1- how tall are your berms and how far is the position from the berm so that ricochet bullets stay in the bay. 2- those same bullets will tear up the walls and props you show downrange of them. You can dig the targets into the ground, but then you have holes in your range floor. Better to adjust it if you can, for instance on What's My Time, keep the walls but put the targets angled to the right. Thanks for posting the stages!

Same thoughts here Bruce. I am not sure if there is any driving between stages, but some of us will be riding together anyway. And of course want to shoot together.

Would also make a difference where your reloads would be since that is when a lot have issues with the 180. Are you really forced to hit each port? To often shooters overlook being able to shoot a lot of targets through ports with much less movement if they don't get up into them. Ports tend to "suck in" shooters even when not necessary and slow them down.

Not there yet, but wait until it gets to be like 3 gun major matches where we have to be online at a specific time and it fills up in seconds to minutes!

Real cold, everyone might as well stay up north I missed last year and am hoping not to again. Lots of shooting, lots of mental (as already said above) and always seem to have some type of a "twist" that is hard and seen throughout the match. One year it was small steel and long distances and painted sky/light blue. My last stage you either shot the steel plate from near 35 yards with hardcover next to it or made an extra stop at about 15yds to take a shot at 1/2 of that plate now covered by the steel hard cover. Another year it was the partial Classic targets on swingers all over the place. The 3 min with 14 shooter squads also makes it tough and for those not used to them- it is ALL Classic targets. Fun, frustrating and my small plaque from D class 6 months after I first started USPSA actually means something to me because of it. Hope I don't miss again this year but doing a lot of larger 3 gun so have to see.

That is a rule I would like to see deleted as well. As a local club MD/RM I have only ever seen either holsters OR mag pouches with retaining devices on a few LEOs and all the rest were on new shooters who were trying us out for the first few times with gear they owned. Just like we advised them to do. I hate to advise them to shoot what they have that way and then have to penalize them by when we make them button the flaps on the mag pouches, etc.

Go to the match page and the button on the right will now say Pay Now in it if you have been "promoted" to the match

Actually, my understanding after talking with Charles and Tennille, in getting our club set up, the newly revised "Regional" rules are for regional and club matches. They have not switched them on the website yet though. The Pro rules are completely different. No, the Regional rules are not made for TV. Open shotgun does not specify a max number in the gun at the start, the other divisions specify 9 in the gun. Foot faults- just like any match I have shot, pull the trigger while touching outside the fault line or an object- 1 procedural per shot. That 2nd part about one penalty per hit does not make sense since the RO cannot/should not know if the shooter is hitting anything. I wonder if they meant it to be like USPSA where the number of procedural cannot exceed the number of possible hits? Ie. the array has 3 targets for a total of 6 possible hits- shooter shoots 8 shots at those targets while faulting but only gets 6 procedurals. Something to ask about. Same with the no shoots, I had not noticed it until pointed out above. I know that in most 3gun matches no shoot steel that falls along with shoot steel is still counted but had not seen it on shoot throughs on paper.