Thumb Safety

[trodrig]

I ended up breaking the left side of my thumb safety last night. Going through Dawson it's going to take until 2nd week of March to get a replacement fit!! I really didn't want to be down that long. How difficult is it to fit the thumb safety and test it to ensure that it is safe to use (i.e. low risk of AD's)? I've read the article on Brazo's web page and most of the steps look pretty straight forward but I'm just a little nervous about the step where you have to fit the stud against the sear.

Do ya'll recommend getting a pro smith to do this type of fitting or would this be a not too difficult do it yourself task?

BTW, I'm thinking of going with either the Wilson or Ed Brown ambi-safety as the replacement part. Does anyone have an opinion on which one (or others) is better? In my opinion, the original STI part was way too easy to break! I didn't put much force on it at all....

Thanks!

Thomas

[bkeeler]

Look here http://www.brazoscustom.com/magart/0601.htm

BK

[Seth]

That's like asking if a guy can fix a car... Some guys can.

I didn't find it difficult, though it is tedious. It was a process of trial and error the first couple of times for me.

I CAN fix a car, I have good tools, and a background in fabrication.

[SLM]

Order a couple and have at it. Or not. I can fix / build darn near anything and not always with anything even close to the correct tools. I've spent years working on race cars. Putting a new ring and pinion and axle tube in a Franklin Quick Change rear end or assembling a 750+ HP 420ci small block Chevy is a CAKE WALK compared to fitting a safety IMO. I did one and will not be doing any more.

[edwin garcia]

Do ya'll recommend getting a pro smith to do this type of fitting or would this be a not too difficult do it yourself task?

I i've replaced 2 already. My first attempt was a Swenson, a complete failure. That went to a smith.

The last two, I used SV Infinity ambis and I thought they're a a whole lot easier to install.

I might have been just lucky twice, though.

[Results may vary, just my $.02]

Edwin

[shooterbenedetto]

It can be tricky if you dont have patience. i would order 2 pieces just in case

you screw the other if you really want to learn.

[Flatland Shooter]

Thomas,

What exactly broke? Is it the lever your thumb rests on? If so, you may have someone that could silver solder it back on. Also, study the old safety and note how the notch where the safety contacts the sear is square to the sear. I've seen too many safeties installed by kitchen table gunsmiths that file down the safety at a taper to where it just makes enough contact with the sear to hold it short term.

Just take your time and you can do fit it correctly.

Bill

[G-ManBart]

SV ambis are probably the easiest to fit I've ever seen....not that I've tried more than a handful of different brands. I'm pretty certain they're the best quality you can find right now. I can usually fit a set of them in 10-20min give or take. Shaping and polishing them the way I like might take an hour, but the functional safety part is really easy with these. R,

[trodrig]

Thomas,

What exactly broke? Is it the lever your thumb rests on? If so, you may have someone that could silver solder it back on. Also, study the old safety and note how the notch where the safety contacts the sear is square to the sear. I've seen too many safeties installed by kitchen table gunsmiths that file down the safety at a taper to where it just makes enough contact with the sear to hold it short term.

Just take your time and you can do fit it correctly.

Bill

The shaft that goes through the frame for the left side lever broke right where it meets the lever. Basically, as I was wiggling the safety to remove it, I heard a crack and it came apart. I thought that maybe it could be welded, soldered, or JB Welded but, it was pretty easy to snap it as I was trying to remove it so I'm thinking a replacement would be better.

I think I'll try to fit it myself and see how it turns out. It'll be a good learning experience if nothing else. Hadn't considered the SVI safety but maybe I'll check that one out as an alternative to the Ed Brown.

Thanks for the inputs everyone! I'll let ya'll know how it turns out!

Thomas

[G-ManBart]

The shaft that goes through the frame for the left side lever broke right where it meets the lever. Basically, as I was wiggling the safety to remove it, I heard a crack and it came apart.

I think I'll try to fit it myself and see how it turns out. It'll be a good learning experience if nothing else. Hadn't considered the SVI safety but maybe I'll check that one out as an alternative to the Ed Brown.

That's pretty much where all the STI safeties break (you didn't say what brand, so I'm guessing). They may not all break, but a bunch of them do and that's right where it happens most frequently (it's pretty thin there).

There's nothing wrong with the Ed Brown, but they aren't up to the quality of the SV...which explains the price difference. I think I've fit four SV units so far and they've all been a snap. I like them so much I have a spare set ready to fit just in case. R,

[trodrig]

The shaft that goes through the frame for the left side lever broke right where it meets the lever. Basically, as I was wiggling the safety to remove it, I heard a crack and it came apart.

I think I'll try to fit it myself and see how it turns out. It'll be a good learning experience if nothing else. Hadn't considered the SVI safety but maybe I'll check that one out as an alternative to the Ed Brown.

That's pretty much where all the STI safeties break (you didn't say what brand, so I'm guessing). They may not all break, but a bunch of them do and that's right where it happens most frequently (it's pretty thin there).

There's nothing wrong with the Ed Brown, but they aren't up to the quality of the SV...which explains the price difference. I think I've fit four SV units so far and they've all been a snap. I like them so much I have a spare set ready to fit just in case. R,

Sorry, 'bout that...forgot to mention that it's the original STI thumb safety that came with the gun. Looking at the SVI on their website I'd be interested in trying one. However, I want to try and get whatever replacement I'm going to use locally so that if I can get it done and function checked before Sunday I can still go to the local match! Well, even if I don't get one installed by then I'll probably still go to the local match but I'll have to shoot single stack....not that there's anything wrong with that!

Thomas

[G-ManBart]

Sorry, 'bout that...forgot to mention that it's the original STI thumb safety that came with the gun. Looking at the SVI on their website I'd be interested in trying one. However, I want to try and get whatever replacement I'm going to use locally so that if I can get it done and function checked before Sunday I can still go to the local match! Well, even if I don't get one installed by then I'll probably still go to the local match but I'll have to shoot single stack....not that there's anything wrong with that!

Thomas

Heck, SV is only like 200 miles from you right?....that's barely "over that there hill" in Texas terms

[Freddie the Swede]

When I do my safeties I always do it with the grip safety removed.

With it removed you can see the engagement points of the safety and where it gets in contact with the sear.

It's not that tricky but be careful and remove small portions of the safety and test it before you shoot it.

I just read the Brazos instructions and they are pretty good but don't show how it looks on the inside.

If you take of the grip safety you will see it clearly.

Good luck.

Fredrik

PS. If you feel the least unsure leave it to the smith. Bad safeties are really dangerous.

Edited February 11, 2009 by Freddie the Swede

[G-ManBart]

When I have done my safeties I alwas do it with the grip safety removed.

With it removed you can see the engagement points of the safety and where it gets in contact with the sear.

It's not that tricky but be careful and remove small portions of the safety and test it before you shoot it.

I just read the Brazos instructions and they are pretty good but don't show how it looks on the inside.

If you take of the grip safety you will see it clearly.

Excellent point...I do that too and it makes it much easier.

[Tzygä]

When I have done my safeties I alwas do it with the grip safety removed.

With it removed you can see the engagement points of the safety and where it gets in contact with the sear.

It's not that tricky but be careful and remove small portions of the safety and test it before you shoot it.

I just read the Brazos instructions and they are pretty good but don't show how it looks on the inside.

If you take of the grip safety you will see it clearly.

Good luck.

Fredrik

PS. If you feel the least unsure leave it to the smith. Bad safeties are really dangerous.

+1

Don't hurry just take your time. Place your old safety and alternate with new safety to the gun and compare them which is different. Take it slow and you will succeed.

Remenber Fredrik's PS. if you feel unsure.

[trodrig]

Sorry, 'bout that...forgot to mention that it's the original STI thumb safety that came with the gun. Looking at the SVI on their website I'd be interested in trying one. However, I want to try and get whatever replacement I'm going to use locally so that if I can get it done and function checked before Sunday I can still go to the local match! Well, even if I don't get one installed by then I'll probably still go to the local match but I'll have to shoot single stack....not that there's anything wrong with that!

Thomas

Heck, SV is only like 200 miles from you right?....that's barely "over that there hill" in Texas terms

Yeah, I've been known to take longer trips for less important reasons. Only trouble is, according to SVI's website, they're out of stock of the wide ambi-safeties! I'm going to call them today though and see if maybe the website is just not up to date.

I spent some time looking at how everything goes together late last night (read: early this morning ) and I think I see how things are supposed to go together. It's a little difficult because the shaft broke on the left side lever, the one with the lobe that needs to be fitted. Therefore it won't stay in the frame on it's own so that I can see the engagement point on the sear. But, I think I see it close enough. Good tip on leaving the grip safety off. That's what I did and you can see things pretty good.

I'm sure I'll have some more questions especially when it gets to the safety check aspect. I wasn't 100% sure about some of the points in Bob L.'s article.

Thanks,

Thomas

[AlamoShooter]

I have don it, I don't recommend it If you have a hammer sear safety you can take off another 1911 do that

I don't think I would fit one even for my best friend The function part is one thing making it flow around the beavertail and grip safety is another. that is what can ruin the finish on the gun. if it not matched at your grip it will end up cutting your hand, you will end up grinding or filing and cut in to the chrome and be unhappy

[bkeeler]

I think the biggest key is to have knowledge of how the safety actually works. Once you understand how it functions it is pretty simple to install/fit.

BK

[G-ManBart]

I have don it, I don't recommend it If you have a hammer sear safety you can take off another 1911 do that

I don't think I would fit one even for my best friend The function part is one thing making it flow around the beavertail and grip safety is another. that is what can ruin the finish on the gun. if it not matched at your grip it will end up cutting your hand, you will end up grinding or filing and cut in to the chrome and be unhappy

Dude, what in the heck are you talking about?

What's a "hammer sear safety"?

You generally can't take the safety out of one 1911 and put it in another and have it be safe.

Making what flow around the beavertail and grip safety?

A thumb safety can ruin the finish on a gun? Huh

If what isn't matched at your grip it will cut your hand?

Why would anyone cut into the gun finish (he never said it was chromed, I don't think) to fit a thumb safety?

[trodrig]

Well, the gun is chromed but, I didn't think that any filing would be needed on the outside of the thumb safety. I thought it was all internal fitting first to get it to slide up and down in the frame without rubbing and then to properly engage the sear. But, I guess I can see how you might need or want to blend the back/bottom edge of the left lever to be smooth with the contour in the frame. Seems like even a pro smith would have this issue and not be able to file/sand the two surfaces together due to marring the finish though. Couldn't this just be filed/sanded with the safety not installed? I guess you couldn't get it perfectly smooth with the frame in that area but, seems like you could get it close or at least get it so that it doesn't dig into your hand.

Thomas

[Brazos Custom]

I have don it, I don't recommend it If you have a hammer sear safety you can take off another 1911 do that

I don't think I would fit one even for my best friend The function part is one thing making it flow around the beavertail and grip safety is another. that is what can ruin the finish on the gun. if it not matched at your grip it will end up cutting your hand, you will end up grinding or filing and cut in to the chrome and be unhappy

Dude, what in the heck are you talking about?

If you read it closely you will understand.

What's a "hammer sear safety"?

Three parts that when installed together usually fit.

You generally can't take the safety out of one 1911 and put it in another and have it be safe.

You can if you install the hammer, sear, and safety together as Jamie suggests. This will generally work.

Making what flow around the beavertail and grip safety?

A thumb safety can ruin the finish on a gun? Huh

He said making the safety flow around the grip safety can cause damage to the finish which it can if you fit it with the safety on the gun.

If what isn't matched at your grip it will cut your hand?

The thumb safety that is being installed.

Why would anyone cut into the gun finish (he never said it was chromed, I don't think) to fit a thumb safety?

The easiest way and what gives the best fit is to blend the safety, frame and grip safety with the safety installed in the gun. This is how I do it on every gun I build. If you have a gun that you are replacing the safety on you have to be careful of the finish on the frame and the grip safety so you do the fitting while the safety is off the gun. You can get pretty close but it takes longer.

[G-ManBart]

I have don it, I don't recommend it If you have a hammer sear safety you can take off another 1911 do that

I don't think I would fit one even for my best friend The function part is one thing making it flow around the beavertail and grip safety is another. that is what can ruin the finish on the gun. if it not matched at your grip it will end up cutting your hand, you will end up grinding or filing and cut in to the chrome and be unhappy

Dude, what in the heck are you talking about?

If you read it closely you will understand.

Oh, I read it like five times and it made no sense at all other than he was suggesting to not attempt it

What's a "hammer sear safety"?

Three parts that when installed together usually fit.

Oh, I truly had no idea he meant "a hammer, sear and safety". I'm sure you hear all sorts of creative names for parts when people call you and thought this was one of those situations.

Making what flow around the beavertail and grip safety?

A thumb safety can ruin the finish on a gun? Huh

He said making the safety flow around the grip safety can cause damage to the finish which it can if you fit it with the safety on the gun.

I've held quite a few 1911s and 2011s and I have yet to see one where the thumb safety flows around the grip safety. Sure you need to blend/shape/contour/etc the grip safety to the gun but that is not at all what came to mind when reading this and I guess I can't imagine anyone trying to blend a safety while it's on the gun (assuming it's on a finished gun)...but I guess someone might try it.

If what isn't matched at your grip it will cut your hand?

The thumb safety that is being installed.

Matched to what? The frame? Your hand? The safety is on the frame, so why are we matching it at the grip? I'm guessing he's saying if the safety isn't blended to the frame and grip safety it can cut your hand...something like that. Most of the thumb safeties available are pretty thick/blunt, I'm sure so that there's plenty of material for blending, and while they might cause a blister if you didn't blend them a cut would be a little extreme.

[Merlin Orr]

When installed on a blended frame and grip safety the thumb safety will usually protrude down into the blended grip safety area and needs to be contoured into the grip safety area to be smooth with nothing to dig into the web of your thumb to hand area.

The above conversations reinforce the suggestions that you have a pistolsmith do the work.

Anyone can stick the safety into the frame. A pro does a professional job.

[AlamoShooter]

Edit to add what Merlin said too, I checked what I wrote and Merlin posted in 10 faster than than I can type.

So

What Bob Said

Letter combinations to form words, just don't get along with me some times

The Grip on my gun has a lot of -Blending- around the grip safety and a replacement safety will stick out at the web of my thumb over 1/8" past the frame and grip safety , the outside of the safety is smooth but the inside part next to the gun is sharp when it sticks out and 1/8" of an inch to 3/16" it may as well be a knife.

The reason one of the Brazos guns and Dave's Guns feel so good it the extra work at this area. to remove as much metal on the frame and grip safety to let the shooters hand get as high and forward on the gun as possible.

A Box stock gun is no big deal.

Besides ....Don't yell at me, I thought we were friends? Them Blue words look mean

Edited February 12, 2009 by AlamoShooter

[Singlestack]

Then Blue words look mean