Is a 10.5" AR too short for 3-gun?

[strojo]

Just getting into the 3-gun thing and wondering if my 10.5" upper is too short to be effective at a 3-gun match?

Thanks!

[bberkley]

Just getting into the 3-gun thing and wondering if my 10.5" upper is too short to be effective at a 3-gun match?

Thanks!

Not if its a Noveske barrel, but I don't think you can use NFA-restricted weapons in a USPSA event.

[stockton]

No rule prohibits NFA devices/ firearms EXCEPT if full auto only. IE, no semi mode. What WILL get you is PF. 150 PF in a 10.5 barrel is going to be tough if not impossible!

[jbullgpd]

and if you are going to shoot matches with long distances that 10.5 will start to give you fits. IMHO I would just buy a new upper geared toward your division you want to shoot. My 2 cents.....

[9MX]

14.5 inch should do the trick

[gotm4]

No rule prohibits NFA devices/ firearms EXCEPT if full auto only. IE, no semi mode. What WILL get you is PF. 150 PF in a 10.5 barrel is going to be tough if not impossible!

It isn't that hard, FWIW 77gr MK262 Mod 1 does 2341fps out of my 10.5" LMT for a power factor of 180. It even goes a little faster with the suppressor mounted. I've used it in non-USPSA 3gun matches.

[Larry White]

!0.5 and 14.5 are both too short. Hard to make power factor. A lot of 16s are used, 18 and 20 are more common. Some of the iron shooters are going 22 or longer but thats for sight radius more than anything Flashers and plates at 300+ yds are just a bit much for the short guns, even with optics. The short guns can be a lot of fun at the local type carbine matches at pistol or slightly longer range.----------------Larry

[Filishooter]

I'm using a 10.5" barrel AR in 9mm. Makes minor rifle easy. If you use an optic then site radius doesn't matter. That being said, my local range only goes out to 70 yards max and I'd shoot my regular AR if were anything over 100 yards. But for the close tight stuff it works great!

[strojo]

and if you are going to shoot matches with long distances that 10.5 will start to give you fits. IMHO I would just buy a new upper geared toward your division you want to shoot. My 2 cents.....

Forgive my ignorance, but where can I find an easily digested explanation of divisions, power factors, etc. so that I can figure out where I'd likely end up? Right now here's what I'll likely be shooting:

Pistol: S&W M&P 9L (5" slide)

Shotgun: Mossberg 930SPX 18"

Rifle: AR to be determined

Thanks!

John

[Doug H.]

Forgive my ignorance, but where can I find an easily digested explanation of divisions, power factors, etc. so that I can figure out where I'd likely end up? Right now here's what I'll likely be shooting:

Pistol: S&W M&P 9L (5" slide)

Shotgun: Mossberg 930SPX 18"

Rifle: AR to be determined

Thanks!

John

John,

For USPSA, the divisions are listed in Appendix A2 of the Tournament Rules. Sounds like you will be in Limited from the above info if

you have iron sights on your AR or Tactical if you have a single optic on your AR and. You have to go to the Appendix of the individual Rifle, Pistol or Shotgun rules for power factor and other requirements. Not exactly easy.

Doug

Edited July 18, 2008 by Doug H.

[Les Snyder]

Two years ago at Ft Benning we had two Ranger NCO's on the squad with 10.5 barrels and Holo sights. They had a lot of problems past 150m.

regards Les

[strojo]

Two years ago at Ft Benning we had two Ranger NCO's on the squad with 10.5 barrels and Holo sights. They had a lot of problems past 150m.

regards Les

I guess my 16" upper would probably make more sense if the distances are past 100 yards. I was hoping to get away with the 10.5" since it's quite a bit lighter.

[StealthyBlagga]

I have run my 7.5" iron sighted SBR in local matchs just for shits and giggles, and was astounded to drop LaRues out beyond 400yds ! With that said, I doubt I could do it consistently, and even on hoser stages the advantage of a shorter barrel is marginal. A longer barrel makes much more sense (longer sight radius, flatter shooting, more convincing impacts etc.) - I would recommend a flat-top 20" to start. With the price of ammo being what it is these days, the ability to make hits with les rounds fired will pay for iteself very quickly (at least thats the rationalle I gave myself for spending $1000 on a scope and mount recently) .

[Alaskapopo]

!0.5 and 14.5 are both too short. Hard to make power factor. A lot of 16s are used, 18 and 20 are more common. Some of the iron shooters are going 22 or longer but thats for sight radius more than anything Flashers and plates at 300+ yds are just a bit much for the short guns, even with optics. The short guns can be a lot of fun at the local type carbine matches at pistol or slightly longer range.----------------Larry

I have had not problems making power factor with my 14.5 inch Noveske n4 with 77 grain Sierra Match bullets. In fact I took the rifle portion of the last three gun match I was at with this scope and rifle ammo combination.

Pat

[jbullgpd]

In the end you can make anything work. If you look at the top competitors though, I don't think you will find any of them shooting anything less than an 18". So if you are wanting an AR just for 3 gun it would make sense to get one that fits that mold. Can you shoot what you already have, yes, is there probably a better option, yes.

[BPiatt]

I think you're all confusing this guy.

Yes, come on out and shoot your 10.5" gun. It will be great practice for what ever you use that gun for.

FYI, the majority of 3gun matches, other than USPSA matches, could care less what power factor you shoot. Just put holes in the targets or hit the steel and you're good to go. So your short gun is fine. 3gun matches shoot a lot of MGM swingers and R&R racing 10" round plates at distance. The MGM's are 10" round plate with a 4" head on it. If you're confident to hit those size target at the furthest distance for the match, then you're good to go.

Most matches are under 300yds. Ft. Benning, Rocky Mountain, and the Blue Ridge Mountain match had some longer targets.

[kellyn]

In the end you can make anything work. If you look at the top competitors though, I don't think you will find any of them shooting anything less than an 18". So if you are wanting an AR just for 3 gun it would make sense to get one that fits that mold. Can you shoot what you already have, yes, is there probably a better option, yes.

That's mostly true and good advice but el Tarano shoots with a 17 or 16 in bbl AR. But now I expect to see Bruce with an iron sighted 10.5!

But if a 10.5 is what you've got bring it out and play.

[gotm4]

I shot on the squad with Bruce Piatt at the Area 8 3gun. He's a good guy! I'm confident that he can't shoot any AR with irons VERY WELL!.

Stay Safe Bruce,

Robb J

[Chuck Anderson]

I shot on the squad with Bruce Piatt at the Area 8 3gun. He's a good guy! I'm confident that he can't shoot any AR with irons VERY WELL!.

Stay Safe Bruce,

Robb J

Is that a slip? I've seen Bruce shoot Irons, and he manages to hold his own.

[gotm4]

I shot on the squad with Bruce Piatt at the Area 8 3gun. He's a good guy! I'm confident that he can't shoot any AR with irons VERY WELL!.

Stay Safe Bruce,

Robb J

Is that a slip? I've seen Bruce shoot Irons, and he manages to hold his own.

Yeah my brain was outfunctioning my fingers. I meant to type that there isn't an AR that Bruce can't shoot well.

[Alaskapopo]

!0.5 and 14.5 are both too short. Hard to make power factor. A lot of 16s are used, 18 and 20 are more common. Some of the iron shooters are going 22 or longer but thats for sight radius more than anything Flashers and plates at 300+ yds are just a bit much for the short guns, even with optics. The short guns can be a lot of fun at the local type carbine matches at pistol or slightly longer range.----------------Larry

Power factor is easy with 75 and 77 grain bullets. That is what I use in my 14.5 inch barreled Noveske N4.

Pat